How do people keep voting in the tories?

[chaosmaker]

I'd love it if tory voters could say why they vote the way they do given that there's ample evidence for how utterly incompetent they are (11 years). Especially in the last election. With that not-fit-for-purpose idiot in charge - edited by MNHQ
I also keep writing to my MP saying that if they are going to pretend we have democracy then they need to scrap FPTP.

AIBU that we should allow people with no sense to vote or
AINBU am I right in that people should have to factor history and rare sense into their decision making?

Not RTFT and don't know if it's been mentioned, but I suggest @chaosmaker that you withdraw your claim in the OP that Boris was "sacked from May's government as an embarrassment".

He wasn't. He resigned shortly after the Chequers proposal on Brexit because he couldn't support it under the doctrine of collective responsibility in Cabinet, which had been suspended while opposing sides came to agreement on how to proceed.

@Overthebow

Because I’d rather conservatives than labour being in power. I agree with their general principals and the majority of their manifestos, more than I agree with other parties. In other words, the best of a bad bunch.

Many of us oldies remember the horrors of a Union -led 'LAbour' government in the 60s.

Jeremy Corbyn.

I don't know what is wrong with Starmer. He doesn't have a dodgy past and has a decent set of principles. Ok his Northern credentials aren't as high as others, and he isn't always the most charismatic. But I'm sick of the cult of the charismatic leader, all of the past charismatic leaders have made colossal mistakes - Iraq, Brexit, Covid in care homes. Johnson has nailed his own coffin as far as I am concerned with hypocrisy and not getting his House in order. He couldn't order a takeaway.

I vote Conservative to make sure that the current Labour government doesn't come in to power. They need to move more central as they are currently far too left. The majority of the country are central and swing slightly more left or right.

@Pazuzu Many of us did point this out. All of it. Until we were blue in the face. We pointed out how dependent the UK is on imported food, and healthcare workers, just as two examples. All anyone had to do was take a little walk around their nearest supermarket or their nearest hospital or care home. (Or pop into Costa for an overpriced coffee with marshmallows and whipped cream on the top.) Let alone actually look at the country's demographics.

And if you think your area has declined while it was having EU projects funded, you're really going to love the next 9 years.

The whole thing has made me understand how civil wars get started, in the very early years, in countries which used to like to think of themselves as civilised.

Not this again

Many of us oldies remember the horrors of a Union -led 'LAbour' government in the 60s.

Indeed and the power cuts and three-day of the 1970s Tory ones as well.

That was then, this is now. Things are very different.

I still can't forgive the Labour party for taking us into Iraq (RIP Robin Cook).

I am not voting for any party (Labour, Lib-Dems, Greens) who deny women's rights to safety and go along with self-ID.

@MistySkiesAfterRain

Jeremy Corbyn.

I don't know what is wrong with Starmer. He doesn't have a dodgy past and has a decent set of principles. Ok his Northern credentials aren't as high as others, and he isn't always the most charismatic. But I'm sick of the cult of the charismatic leader, all of the past charismatic leaders have made colossal mistakes - Iraq, Brexit, Covid in care homes. Johnson has nailed his own coffin as far as I am concerned with hypocrisy and not getting his House in order. He couldn't order a takeaway.

I'm always amazed that any of those were seen as charasmatic, johnson has worn out whatever charisma he ever possessed.

[quote Newcomer68]@Pazuzu Many of us did point this out. All of it. Until we were blue in the face. We pointed out how dependent the UK is on imported food, and healthcare workers, just as two examples. All anyone had to do was take a little walk around their nearest supermarket or their nearest hospital or care home. (Or pop into Costa for an overpriced coffee with marshmallows and whipped cream on the top.) Let alone actually look at the country's demographics.

And if you think your area has declined while it was having EU projects funded, you're really going to love the next 9 years.

The whole thing has made me understand how civil wars get started, in the very early years, in countries which used to like to think of themselves as civilised.[/quote]
Definitely, huge areas where I live in Wales were rebuilt and transformed by EU funding with huge blue plaques declaring that. Didn't save us from people voting leave. The people that are never counted are the non voters. And of course the disenfranchised 16+ age group whose future would be affected for more of their life time.

@Pazuzu If no funding was obtained in your area then it's down to that area not having applied for it. Nothing to do with the EU but more the government that, you know, ran the UK in that time.

@rhowton

I vote Conservative to make sure that the current Labour government doesn't come in to power. They need to move more central as they are currently far too left. The majority of the country are central and swing slightly more left or right.

If every party is central then where is the choice. Also what is now considered central has become more right wing. This is why the manifesto under Corbyn was considered far left LOL

For me, the alternative of a New Labour revival is a horror. I would have voted for Corbyn and a more genuinely socialist system, similar to European models, as long as his inability to recognise the existence of criminal behaviour was reined in.

So the short answer is because no one agrees on possible solutions to the many complex cultural problems we face, although I would ask them to look at history. A New Labour revival based on neoliberalism ideas is no solution to corruption, nepotism or waste of public money. It was the Left that originally gave us the NHS, social housing and a welfare state, but it is important that such things not be abused.

@ParsleySageRosemary

For me, the alternative of a New Labour revival is a horror. I would have voted for Corbyn and a more genuinely socialist system, similar to European models, as long as his inability to recognise the existence of criminal behaviour was reined in.

So the short answer is because no one agrees on possible solutions to the many complex cultural problems we face, although I would ask them to look at history. A New Labour revival based on neoliberalism ideas is no solution to corruption, nepotism or waste of public money. It was the Left that originally gave us the NHS, social housing and a welfare state, but it is important that such things not be abused.

I'm confused by this, on a thread about "how do people keep voting in the Tories" are you saying that you'd vote for Johnson because you can't have Corbyn and Johnson would be better than a Blairite version of Labour??

Jeremy Corbyn
Angela Rayner
Diane Abbott

Where I live, there is a higher than average percentage of people who are Jewish. There was no possibility of a Labour candidate being elected whilst the appeaser of anti-semitism Jeremy Corbyn was leader.

I don't think that's entirely true, but obviously statistics can be manipulated. This morning I read that France has even worse ratios on public spending to tax revenue that Italy.

A capable opposition party that present a credible alternative is desirable but when you have public sector unions as in the NHS that are in thrall to the idea that more money is all that's needed and that billionaires should be taxed until the pips squeak, then all you do is send the billionaires off to Monaco. The NHS cannot be fixed until it's acceptable to admit that it can only offer a fairly limited service for acute care, and that we all have to have a modest insurance top up to fund the treatments we feel entitled to. But when its budget is nudging £3000 per person, and most people under 60 use it for maternity and emergency care, then the obvious implication is that money is being wasted in a thousand trivial ways. For example, DH has a small company that does quite a bit of work for hospitals -- making sure the water is hot and the plant works properly, and of the five or six hospitals he works for, every single one operates its own buying team and system, and every tender requires reams of paperwork. It surely isn't revolutionary for the regional NHS Trusts to maintain a central register of companies that are qualified and accredited to do the work to ISO 9001, and simply ask for bids on an agreed schedule of work?

And while I accept that there are individuals with very complex needs and costly requirements of healthcare, to a degree you have to understand that these will be the guinea pigs for new ideas and radical therapies. But there needs to be recognition that obesity and/or an unhealthy lifestyle often ends up causing type 2 diabetes, which absorbs about or maybe more than 10% of NHS spending... because it's become insensitive to tell someone that they would row back from diabetes if they make a supreme effort to shed the weight.

Brace yourself there's a hell of a lot of obnoxious tories on mumsnet OP .

They play on racist rhetoric which is popular with people who feel shit about themselves. Think that's one of the reasons.

10% of the total spend on the NHS (and no, it wouldn't be all that) would release a very substantial amount to spend on other non-lifestyle-caused illness. I do know that MN is fiercely resistant to the notion that the individual has to bear some significant element of responsibility personally for their own health, but it doesn't make it less true.

I didn't mention race. But where I live, the Tories look like a better bet for an aspiring person from any background. Last time I looked, the Chancellor, Home Secretary and Health Secretary were all POC. The Labour party looks ..umm.. less diverse.

Tories appeal to people who want to succeed, and Labour accommodates victims.

@Shoxfordian

Yep anyone who doesn’t vote the way you do has no sense: clearly

Yup! I think one of the reasons people have turned against Labour is the sneering manner in which their supporters talk about Tories. I mean how dare anyone have different views to them? The tolerant left eh 🙄

@hardtofindaname

Brace yourself there's a hell of a lot of obnoxious tories on mumsnet OP .

They play on racist rhetoric which is popular with people who feel shit about themselves. Think that's one of the reasons.

Over the years I've posted here, I have had more abuse from the left-leaning. It has been pointed out repeatedly that maybe the Labour Party has a hell of a lot of persuading to get through to Tory voters. It really is a lot more subtle than just telling us we're wrong and evil, cruel racists. As you've doubtless read most of this thread, you will know about two-thirds of posters disagree with you.

I didn't vote tory last time because I really dislike my local (tory) mp. However, I would never vote Labour, ever. Blair, Miliband, Corbyn.. never.

I dislike Boris and I didn't like TM.

But a Labour government just stands against everything that's wrong in this country and between 2007 and 2010 they really did mess up in true style, making people extremely vulnerable by creating a false sense of security.