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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think a clearer message should of been given

99 replies

TEH82 · 11/12/2021 08:27

So DS is 10 and in year 6 at junior school, I also have a DS in year 5 at the same school who has ASD.
Thursday night DS10 went to the local park with friends and another boy produced a knife which was a proper sized kitchen knife and said he was going to stab DS friend. DS and fried made excuses about needing the toilet and ran home and told me. A few minutes later another mum messaged me as had seen the knife but the boy ran off with it so I rang the police and the head teacher as I have her mobile due to son with ASD.
The police come round and we’re at school yesterday giving talks on knifes and dangers and them and head spoke to kids.
However son is really upset this kid was still in school yesterday but want allowed out at lunch and break.
My second son was a mess hearing this happened and wanted to look at ways to stop bleeding if you were stabbed- literal child due to additional needs.
Am I harsh in thinking this kid should of least not been in school yesterday or even the rest of the term due to the upset and fear caused which hasn’t given a great message about punishment to other kids.

OP posts:
RoastedParnsip · 11/12/2021 08:31

YANBU. He threatened to stab a child whose in his class. He should be suspended at the very least to protect the child!
Just because he didn't carry it out doesn't mean he potentially won't do something else... also year 6 going round with a knife? Wtf is happening to this world!

x2boys · 11/12/2021 08:40

A fifteen year old boy was stabbed to death around the corner from me in the summer by a fellow fifteen year old ,they definitely need to crack down hard on knife crime Sad

WatchMyLips · 11/12/2021 08:48

I agree but we don't know what's going on behind the scenes. The school have to do everything above board and legally
It's utter shit I know

Nevertime · 11/12/2021 08:53

I'm not sure it's the school's issue? The police were called and (presumably) made no arrest. It didn't happen at school, why is it up to the school to do what the police didn't?

Skyll · 11/12/2021 08:55

Why did you ring the school? It didn’t happen in school?

I don’t think that’s really what you have the head teachers number for.

Mamamia7962 · 11/12/2021 08:58

I agree with others it's not for the school to deal with, but the police.

Ponoka7 · 11/12/2021 09:01

In primary school, he should still be able to attend. Research has shown that exclusion doesn't do any good. For a child that age to be carrying a knife, there's something massively going on at home and school could be being used to safeguard the child. The child can see whatever professionals he needs to in a safe environment, as opposed to at home, were that might not happen. The focus here isn't public punishment, but solution focused.

@Skyll
"Why did you ring the school? It didn’t happen in school"
A serious crime had been committed to and by one of their pupils, it was an appropriate response.

Medievalist · 11/12/2021 09:02

Of course op was right to ring the school!!! Do you seriously think a HT wouldn't want to know if one of their pupils had, the day before, been carrying a kitchen knife and threatening to stab someone - even if it was off the school premises?!!!!!!!!

In the op's shoes I'd be asking the HT what they were going to do to ensure my dc's safety and deal with their anxiety. I'd also be contacting the chair of governors.

chillied · 11/12/2021 09:02

I'd be very concerned OP and I would talk to anyone who can help, including going back to the police and back to the head. The head needs to have a strategy about this, surely.

Ponoka7 · 11/12/2021 09:04

"I agree with others it's not for the school to deal with, but the police."

A child of 10 commuting such a crime, even though not charged, would be viewed as a child in need. Schools can oversee Child in Need plans upto level two. There will be things going on behind the scenes.
OP put the pitch forks away.

Skyll · 11/12/2021 09:04

The police will liaise with the school. The op does not need to be ringing the heads mobile.

If she wanted to report it to the school she could have ring the main school number during working hours.

A580Hojas · 11/12/2021 09:06

Yanbu. I would be very unhappy about that knife wielder being in school the next day too. A horrible incident for your son to witness I'm really sorry - it must have shaken him.

Hoardasurass · 11/12/2021 09:06

@TEH82 the school can't expell or even suspend a child for something that you claim happened outside of school and outside of the school day infact his parents could demand that the school stop keeping him in at break and lunch as again the school doesn't have the right to punish him for an alleged crime that they have no evidence of having happened just the 2nd hand reports (ie hearsay) from parents who weren't there nor did they see the knife.
I understand how worried you are but you need to be realistic in your expectations and hope that either he has learned his lesson and/or that someone is getting that boy some counselling to find out what is going on with a 10 year old boy that he wants to stay another boy, because there must be a reason (even if we don't agree that it is a valid reason) for a 10 year old to have a knife

megletthesecond · 11/12/2021 09:07

That child might be better off in school than at home.

A580Hojas · 11/12/2021 09:07

Don't talk about pitchforks when someone has threatened child with a knife ffs.

CentrifugalBumblePuppy · 11/12/2021 09:11

Unfortunately, for some children the school is the only secure, stable & supportive framework a child has. Not every child is with parents, like you, who care about them & teach their children good behaviours & the harsh consequences of poor behaviour (like carrying a knife).

For some children, knife carrying & using threatening behaviour is normalised within their family.

I suspect the head will realise there may be little support from this child’s parents. Therefore, the only option to give that child the right support & guidance (and, to be honest, a Police bollocking) will be to have kept that child in the classroom.

Unfortunately too, there are some parents for whom seeing their child suspended or excluded will be a badge of honour, and will not give the child the right moral lessons in right from wrong. If it were my child, their ears would be ringing from the total bollocking they would have received from me, as well as showing examples of how devastating knife crime is, as well as discussing why they felt the need to carry a knife & threaten other children. This kid may not have that kind of moral & supportive parenting at home.

Most parents on here see life within a bubble of setting a good, supportive environment for their children. I think we forget sometimes that all parents are not created equal. For some, carrying a knife & using threatening language is a normal thing. If that’s the case with this child, suspending them will only send that child back into that poor moral environment.

Heads have a tough job balancing the needs of safeguarding all children. In this boy’s case, safeguarding the child may be keeping the child in school away from that crap (and frankly dangerous) parenting. It may be they are aware that being suspended or expelled could put the child at risk from violence in the home.

I am in no way defending this little turd for carrying a knife & threatening your son & his friend. Personally, I’d think that kid is a little scroat. But professionally in this case, there may be factors in this child’s home life that make suspension a very bad thing, and as much as I’d wish every parent would be as good as you are, the school may be the only positive parenting that child gets. Hence why they punished the child by talking away their playtime.

For good parents, it seems like this kid is being rewarded. In reality, keeping the kid in school may be due to safeguarding the child from a home where such threats and carrying weapons is normal.

Skyll · 11/12/2021 09:12

The school can’t suspend on something that there is no evidence of.

Nevertime · 11/12/2021 09:12

OP didn't ring the school, she rang the head's mobile out of hours.

I agree head would want to be aware, but on what grounds can she take any action beyond the knife awareness she had promptly arranged and a watching eye?

Medievalist · 11/12/2021 09:15

*The police will liaise with the school. The op does not need to be ringing the heads mobile.

If she wanted to report it to the school she could have ring the main school number during working hours.*

No. Before school started the HT needed to be on the ball and alert to the fact that a child could be entering the school with a knife and thoughts of harming someone.

A message delivered via the school office would not necessarily have reached the HT quickly. And who knows when the police may have got round to notifying the school.

Skyll · 11/12/2021 09:15

The op should not have phones the head’s mobile for this.

The police will have contact methods for the head and it’s their job to inform out of hours.

Nevertime · 11/12/2021 09:19

FWIW police rarely liase with schools IME.

We have had students both stabbed and stabbing including one murder. We hear via social media or from other students. Police don't feel to tell us when our children are either the victims or perpetrators of a crime or when there's a potential risk to our children. E.g. in the case of the murder there was a huge public backlash, as you'd expect, but no one told us there might be a risk that would come into school.

Medievalist · 11/12/2021 09:22

The police will have contact methods for the head and it’s their job to inform out of hours.

Not sure how anyone can have such confidence that the police will do their job given the news coverage yesterday.

Surely better safe than sorry?

Skyll · 11/12/2021 09:23

I don’t think that’s an appropriate use of the head’s mobile.

And no child can be suspended for weeks (over the holidays) on the say so of a parent where there is no evidence and the event happened outside of school.

ApolloandDaphne · 11/12/2021 09:23

It sounds like the school and the police are working together to talk to the pupils about the dangers of knives. I don't think excluding the child in question would be helpful. He needed to hear this information too. We don't know what is going on at home and what else might be being done behind the scenes. Withdrawing a child from school should never be used as a punishment.

mumof1or2 · 11/12/2021 09:24

@Nevertime

I'm not sure it's the school's issue? The police were called and (presumably) made no arrest. It didn't happen at school, why is it up to the school to do what the police didn't?
It absolutely is the school's issue. I'm a secondary teacher and something similar happened during a half term holiday (except someone actually was stabbed). Everyone involved was excluded so the victim feels safe to come back. Issues between the students of a school are always the schools issue, even if they happen outside of school.
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