Hairdresser's testimony at Tustin trial

[FallingStar21]

I know there have been several threads discussing various details around the case.. But having read the complete timeline and hairdresser's testimony, i just absolutely cannot believe that neither she or her partner called the police!
For example, she had been at Tustin's house doing her hair for 4 hours and Arthir made to sit at a table and not move for the entire time. She says she just thought he'd been naughty or something. No alarm bells ringing, really?
Different time she witnessed Arthur made to stand by the door, but not move or lean on the door etc.. Arthur given a sandwich to eat by the door while Tustin eating in the garden with the other kids... No alarm bells.
Witnessing Arthur being shouted at horrible words.
Finally, hairdresser at Tustin's with her (hairdresser's) partner seeing Arthur so frail and by their own accounts "petrified". They know Arthur had been deprived of water, because hairdresser's partner gives him a glass of water in secret... a glass, which Arthur cant even hold up to his mouth (all in their testimony) ...No Alarm bells, no nothing?!
If they were previously unsure whether they needed to do something, that last account couldn't have been more crystal clear.
I know legally it's viewed differently, but IMO these people are almost complicit in this... They too, had the responsibility to protect him once they'd seen what they saw, which was really black and white.
Just cant believe it.

Franklin who knows it's utterly bonkers isn't it and I loathe the political point scoring.

As a whole all our essential services need lifting out of politics and ring fenced with special teams running them which should include front line workers coming to meetings and able to speak freely or be able to comment freely and anonymously because without front line feedback they know nothing.
Special teams looking how to improve it all the time and ring fenced funding.

@Franklin12

So how much money is needed to see the bruising on this boy? How many more reports from various people saying they had concerns?

Oh well just 'more' funding apparently, despite the very glaring evidence that someone who has done a basic child abuse awareness course could spot.

@Alltheblue

Nothing would have happened even if they did report it

I agree with this. SS were very arrogant and seem to have decided they knew best.

I’m only quoting this for reference, and not addressing this too the poster.

Does anyone in the police, or SS or similar know what would have happened I’d say the boyfriend had “gone to the shop” and called the police and said “there is a child in my house right now, this is what I witnessed, this is how he looks (starved, weak etc)”? Would the police have been more likely to attend straight away as the abuse was happening in progress? Or would it have been a case of them just passing it on to social services?

Janiie agree.

Sw do by and large do a very hard job, as pp pointed out we don't hear the success stories.

But this was catastrophic.

Surely as there was already social services involved because two of her children were removed and because his mum killed someone? How the hell did they get away with it all

I’m asking because I know If I witnessed someone attacking someone in the street i would expect the police to respond immediately. Surely the same response would be appropriate if someone said a child was being abused in their house right now?

@MaryAndGerryLivingInDerry

If they had told the police on the phone the child was at immediate risk the police would have gone in

Mary I would have said that's instant attendance however it was the lock down.

@MaryAndGerryLivingInDerry

I’m asking because I know If I witnessed someone attacking someone in the street i would expect the police to respond immediately. Surely the same response would be appropriate if someone said a child was being abused in their house right now?

It would be the response we all hope would happen.

As for what would happen - we'd all just be guessing.
During lockdown round here the police didn't come out for almost an hour when someone was being attacked in the park so who knows.

Thanks all.

It’s education
Most of the people on this site are fairly aware , switched on and know some basic shit
These people literally didn’t
We can vilify them (hell I did when I read about the hairdresser months ago )
But they are not aware , or wired to think that way

And the wider family equally fucking shit.
. They did report it. Grnadmother took photo of bruising , uncle went to the police with it.
They were told that they would be arrested for harassment/breaking Covid rules if they went to the house.
The inquiry will make things clearer but I suspect both the police and social services won't come out of it well.

I’m afraid there are far too many who feel it’s not their business and don’t want to stand up and be counted — look at the Shannon Matthews case too— lots of people there said afterwards how they thought the girl was neglected— but at the time they said Jack shit. A lot of these people in these communities have grown up to associate police or social workers with ‘interfering’ or poking their nose in and so their is a mentality to not involve them . These people are complicit and said nothing in order — to save their own skin — if they had half a brain and we’re still scared of being found out- they should have sent an anonymous letter immediately to the police or a local GP. - just saying what they saw without saying why they were there

I do hope their sentences are reviewed upwards. This women should never have the opportunity to have any more children. Neither should her partner but I suspect when he gets out he will find a way. He will find some daft women who will get together with him regardless of his background.

Next week I'm going to be ringing a woman who reported the job I was involved in to say thank you. I tried last week . We've also asked if the force can send a thank you letter. Because without a doubt - that woman saved the lives of the children she had concerns about . Not an exaggeration. Once police got in they had to get an ambulance and immediately take several children into police protection. When children die it hits the headlines. There are children living like this every day, everywhere.
Without people reporting their concerns they carry on living like it . Or they die . And then everyone and their dog crawls out of the woodwork to say how it's everyone else's fault .

My reporter - went to the house by pure accident. Came out unable to speak and rang 999. And saved at least one child's life with several others removed there and then as soon as police got there .

This is everyone's responsibility.

If there was CCTV in the house, that would show them being there illegally, the facility to make anonymous reports wasn't going to address the fear of punishment issue.

I agree when I read the testimony. Part of me thinks if only they had reported it or even taken him to hospital without Tustin's knowledge but another part wonders if it would have made any difference. It had been reported multiple times and SS seemed to believe everything Tustin said and failed to check properly. I just feel the same might have happened.

Whilst there is no doubt that Arthur was utterly and devastating failed by a system that should have protected him, as an adoptive parent, with dozens of adopter friends, there are many of us looking at our children who could have been Arthur, Star, Daniel, Peter and who are here today because social workers did intervene.
Of course it doesn't make the failures right, but those SWs currently being vilified will have been responsible for saving many children. We should not forget that.

I find it pretty mental that the hairdresser’s Facebook is incredibly easy to find, as is her business page with her mobile number on.

I’ve rung 999 for a child in distress before and the police turned up about 5 minutes later, so they would absolutely have turned up.

(In my case this was for a child aged about 8 half way along the street from me at 11pm at night who I could hear screaming and crying outside his house and shouting to be let back in. I wasn’t too sure what was going on but he sounded extremely distressed so I rang 999 and reported it straight away. The call handler said they could actually hear the child screaming in my phone call despite the fact I was calling from my own bedroom a good 15 or so houses down the road, with the window open. They turned up, as far as I could see they went inside the house and spoke with the family - I don’t know what happened after that but since then there have been no more instances and my son actually often plays with this child and he seems happier. So who knows. I did my bit and wouldn’t hesitate to ring them again).

@VikingOnTheFridge

If there was CCTV in the house, that would show them being there illegally, the facility to make anonymous reports wasn't going to address the fear of punishment issue.

But they didn’t even need to say who they were or where they’d seen him. If they’d gone to a phone box or blocked their number they could have made a completely anonymous call and said they’d seen him at their house and were worried. Everyone has seen the cctv footage of him. If the police or ss had seen him on that day and how frail he was I’m sure they would have acted on that. Even if they’d previously ignored earlier reports.

*not the hairdressers house. I mean Tustins house.

I've seen the picture of his bruised shoulder it looks like his entire back is bruised up how is that not a concern? I've had three children they rough around sometimes (a lot) they have rarely if ever had a bruise on their back! And off the you of my head I can't remember a shoulder bruise when I did safeguarding training I was told that these were what we looked out for

People don't want to get involved. Another awful recent case - Kaylee-Jade Priest - the same thing - someone saw Kaylee-Jade literally crawling up the stairs behind her mother with what turned out, after her death of course, to be a broken leg. A three year old crawling up stairs behind her mother with a broken leg. Incomprehensible.

Bagels the point I'm making is that even an anonymous report would likely have led to the authorities realising they had broken the covid regulations, because they would've been visible in the house CCTV.