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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to loathe the people here?

735 replies

OnenessWithAllStrife · 30/11/2021 10:06

Some people say that feeling a negative emotion or having unpleasant feelings about something shouldn't define you, that you should let the thoughts flow and then let them go. OK. I hope this to be true :(

But i have lived somewhere for the past 6 years that has brought me to conclusions and created feelings in me that I am not proud of. For the first time in my life I have actually come to loathe people and feel a sense of terror about being stuck with them. This is not particularly politically 'correct' when put into words, unfortunately, but I can't think of any other way to express it.

I moved to a town6 yrs ago in which I don't have much in common with the residents. It isn't unusual, just an ordinary large town which at one time contained more diversity, but in recent years has become very insular and homogenous. Everyone is angry, anti social, or depressed. If you don't openly discuss some sort of prejudice (racism, sexism, anti-intellectualism) you're 'soft in the head' or a 'bloody weirdo'.
Wherever I go here, in any direction, you will either see kids or drunk adults destroying property, or else screaming at each other in the street. There are a few select areas that are less challenging and rough, but the vibe is somehow the same.

Education or reading is a mugs game, football is the only passion, kids are yelled at for merely existing. Any conversation with a seemingly friendly stranger results in them wishing all the foreigners to go home. There is a general air of brutality to everything, a leathery, hard resistance to any kind of sensitivity whatsoever. Art, creativity and self reflection are suspicious, and the only permissible clothing is black or sport branded. Every damned street is choked with the fumes of endlessly revved up vehicles with ear splitting exhaust modifications. The environment is filthy, full of dog shit and bordering on dereliction.

I would once have considered all of this a problem of poverty, but it isn't quite that easy to determine, having witnessed it. There is no seeming variation in behaviour across income brackets here, it looks to be more cultural than income related, although the attitude towards learning, etc will obviously have the effect of creating more poverty regardless. It is like a self perpetuating cesspit of no hope and hard hearts. I thought i was a leftie, a socialist, but when I leave here I will be fucking marked by this and hope to never exist within it ever again.

We moved here for DP's work and are set to leave this coming year. I also appreciate that the residents and I have experienced very different upbringings and we do not share much in common, but even so, I think that you have to endure this to really, really see it, to come to fear it. It is easy to sit in a comfy armchair miles from it and 'defend' this stuff because you haven't truly sampled the existential sickness of it on your own doorstep.
I wish i didn't feel it, but it is difficult to lie to oneself, and the fear has probably evolved from having felt 'stuck' in it for so long. I wfh and DP does part time (some here regard us as 'pretentious' for this and have suggested we ought to do some 'real' work). It all feels very dated and odd, to be surrounded by values that repulse me and contain so little diversity. I mean, this is the type of place where you'll get side-eyed for cooking from scratch or having the audacity to flavour a dish with pesto.

Does this mean I loathe them? I don't know. I imagine I will chill with it when we have moved, as it all becomes a distant memory, but it has certainly left a mark. It feels wrong to state these feelings and observations, but I bet I am not the only one who has thought them....

OP posts:
lazylinguist · 30/11/2021 12:44

I can see why you don't fit in.

Confused Who would want to fit in with people with attitudes like the ones the OP's describing?

OnenessWithAllStrife · 30/11/2021 12:44

sorry to bail out, we have to go somewhere at the mo, hopefully will have time to catch up later. god forbid Grin

OP posts:
Dontbekatty · 30/11/2021 12:46

Out to enjoy the delights of Wigan, op?

dabbydeedoo · 30/11/2021 12:47

@THisbackwithavengeance

Don't worry OP, I'm sure you'll be back soon with like minded people in your nice bit of the SE away from those horrible, poor "locals".

I've noticed that when mumsnetters talk about their lovely "diverse" areas, they mean that their next door neighbours are either Black or Asian but invariably middle class.

They don't mean that they live in a tower block crammed full of refugees and illegal immigrants.

And you wonder why working class people voted Tory? Because they know that left wing pseudo socialists/London types despise them.

It's weird how defensive so many people get when someone says they don't want to live in a depressing shithole full of racists.

I live in a really grotty part of South London. It's not 'naice', I hear the police helicopter several times a week most weeks and the air ambulance fairly regularly because someone has been stabbed.

You know what? I still feel more at home here than I would in the shitty town I used to live in where people would stare in the pub and where I was told to f**k off back home. There's a great community here where everyone is accepting and absolutely nobody is interested in your skin colour or your background. There's a real Little England feel in lots of the country, especially after Brexit. It doesn't make someone a snob not to want any part of it.

TopCatsTopHat · 30/11/2021 12:49

The town I'm in now is diverese socio-economically as well as racially and it is all the better as no one single group dictates the flavour of the place. A mix is always better for a real community because we all get to see how the other lives then, it makes for better appreciation.

buntybanana · 30/11/2021 12:50

@THisbackwithavengeance

Don't worry OP, I'm sure you'll be back soon with like minded people in your nice bit of the SE away from those horrible, poor "locals".

I've noticed that when mumsnetters talk about their lovely "diverse" areas, they mean that their next door neighbours are either Black or Asian but invariably middle class.

They don't mean that they live in a tower block crammed full of refugees and illegal immigrants.

And you wonder why working class people voted Tory? Because they know that left wing pseudo socialists/London types despise them.

They vote Tory because they are conned into believing this will give them a better life. The current depravation of the working class is systematic, deliberate and extremely useful to the tories. Social services and educational opportunities have been slashed for years, resulting in further depravation, anger & revenge seeking. Add the Sun & Daily Mail to the equation and bam you have the perfect blame-seeking, undereducated majority screaming that Corbyn will wreck their lives. The opportunity for critical thinking is stolen - by the tories and their systematic austerity - especially in the north of England. It is appalling.

It's deeply unfair to blame this on the average London middle class individual who chooses better for themselves than the ASB, violence & anger that the tories have created in some parts of the country.

MyFamiIyAndOtherAnimals · 30/11/2021 12:50

Well op since they’re all uneducated louts, I’m sure you can name the town freely since nobody from there would be reading something as high brow as mumsnet!

So go on....!

Pigeoninthehouse · 30/11/2021 12:50

you must be one of them, surely.
i absolutely would not want to fit in to a racist, sexist shit hole, would you?

There is asbolutely no indication of me being any of those things in anything that I have written, is everyone different to you a racist and sexist by default. What a very sad and narrow world view that you have.

OhMyCrump · 30/11/2021 12:53

@MyFamiIyAndOtherAnimals

Well op since they’re all uneducated louts, I’m sure you can name the town freely since nobody from there would be reading something as high brow as mumsnet!

So go on....!

Hmm
Cordyceps · 30/11/2021 12:53

I think it's pretty telling that OP has posted several times to say thank you to all the posters who agree with her but has not engaged in any substantive way with anyone who doesn't. If she were ACTUALLY the progressive and thoughtful person she thinks she is, or thought she was before she moved to Wigan, she would be open to conversation. She's not, she just sees herself as someone special surrounded by a stinking underclass and she wants sympathy and support. It's disgusting and it's disgusting how many other posters are exactly the same.

Cordyceps · 30/11/2021 12:54

@MyFamiIyAndOtherAnimals

Well op since they’re all uneducated louts, I’m sure you can name the town freely since nobody from there would be reading something as high brow as mumsnet!

So go on....!

She's named it, it's Wigan.
ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 12:55

www.ilivehere.co.uk/top-50-worst-places-to-live-in-england-2021

Wigan came in at a pathetic #20. @OnenessWithAllStrife you'll have to try the local shitbags to up their game.

foxgoosefinch · 30/11/2021 12:55

@Cordyceps

I think it's pretty telling that OP has posted several times to say thank you to all the posters who agree with her but has not engaged in any substantive way with anyone who doesn't. If she were ACTUALLY the progressive and thoughtful person she thinks she is, or thought she was before she moved to Wigan, she would be open to conversation. She's not, she just sees herself as someone special surrounded by a stinking underclass and she wants sympathy and support. It's disgusting and it's disgusting how many other posters are exactly the same.
Except….have you been to Wigan…?
MadTilda · 30/11/2021 12:58

I get you, OP - totally.

Wingutyoy · 30/11/2021 12:59

@Cordyceps

I think it's pretty telling that OP has posted several times to say thank you to all the posters who agree with her but has not engaged in any substantive way with anyone who doesn't. If she were ACTUALLY the progressive and thoughtful person she thinks she is, or thought she was before she moved to Wigan, she would be open to conversation. She's not, she just sees herself as someone special surrounded by a stinking underclass and she wants sympathy and support. It's disgusting and it's disgusting how many other posters are exactly the same.
Aww have a Biscuit , Judging by all your previous posts on this thread your at home with these types. Well there is nothing wrong with people who don't want to live in a shit hole with the dregs of society.

Before you start I grew up in such a place and worked hard to get out. its perfectly possible if you TRY!

sashagabadon · 30/11/2021 13:00

Isn’t Lisa Nandy the local MP? She’s pretty high profile and you would think would have more influence to get improvements / Lobby for jobs, industry etc to come and provide employment like for example Andy Burnham and Andy street and that other Tory councillor of Teeside. She was shadow foreign secretary so a position of power and influence you would think?

whatstobecomeofus · 30/11/2021 13:00

I used to live in a small minded, insular town and I can identify with what the OP describes. We ended up by leaving after being harassed by some neighbors. We were outsiders and stuck out I suppose. It was the sort of place you'd need to be third, if not fourth generation to get away with living there.

We moved ten miles away to an equally poor part of the region and the people have been lovely. No sign of the grinding misery and chip on the shoulder attitude. It's more diverse and outward looking though.

ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:00

@housemaus sure, but as you say it really is up to the people from that place to make it better. If "incomers" tried to start community initiatives it would not be well received in these kinds of insular, backwards places. It's like walking into the 1980s in terms of social awareness and attitudes on some of these towns, at best.

If the people that grow up there decide to stay and make it better then that's great. But in the interim, people who move there without fully comprehending how crap it is and how disgracefully locals will treat them, are completely within their rights to point out how crime-ridden, backwards, insular, unfriendly and unpleasant it is to live there.

Cordyceps · 30/11/2021 13:01

@foxgoosefinch I have actually, I have a friend who lives there and works in an employment support charity (and also eats pesto and listens to opera) who I've visited more than once. I still manage not to speak about it, or the people who live there, like this poster and her supporters do, and neither does my friend, who spends time every day with the sorts of people that OP is so repulsed by.

fairynick · 30/11/2021 13:01

You must be fucking joking, I’ve just bought a new build in Wigan and was excited about going until now Sad

PeppermintTea2021 · 30/11/2021 13:01

Aw! I like Wigan! I have relatives there. I'd take it over where I currently live which is inner city grottiness. It's got some beautiful countryside on the doorstep, only an hour and 40 mins from the Lake district, close to Manchester which is my favourite city - and it has a decent town centre. In my experience people are lovely. Not sure which part OP has ended up in but honestly I can't recognise it from her description!

ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:02

There's a real Little England feel in lots of the country, especially after Brexit. It doesn't make someone a snob not to want any part of it.

Absolutely. It's made a lot of these racists feel that it is not acceptable to express their vile prejudices in public, whereas previously they at least kept their "opinions" to themselves.

MadTilda · 30/11/2021 13:03

I also believe that liking where one is, is a totally subjective and personal thing and one's feelings about it are valid.

I live in chocolateboxsville and I have come to dislike it deeply, because everyone is a selfish tory (with campanulas and calendulas, but still a selfish tory). Brexiters. Racists.

My feelings about living here are as valid as their subscription to the Daily Mail is valid to them.

MadTilda · 30/11/2021 13:04

@ThousandsOfTulips

There's a real Little England feel in lots of the country, especially after Brexit. It doesn't make someone a snob not to want any part of it.

Absolutely. It's made a lot of these racists feel that it is not acceptable to express their vile prejudices in public, whereas previously they at least kept their "opinions" to themselves.

yes! yes! yes! million times yes!
ThousandsOfTulips · 30/11/2021 13:06

@sashagabadon

Isn’t Lisa Nandy the local MP? She’s pretty high profile and you would think would have more influence to get improvements / Lobby for jobs, industry etc to come and provide employment like for example Andy Burnham and Andy street and that other Tory councillor of Teeside. She was shadow foreign secretary so a position of power and influence you would think?
She's now the shadow secretary for "levelling up" and local Government etc. Will be interesting to hear how she intends to fund making places like Wigan inhabitable for average humans.