To think taking a baby to Parliament is ridiculous?

[iawbuwes]

Stella Creasy MP taking her baby to the Commons - I think it is utterly ridiculous.

Everyone else has to find childcare. Labour have lost the plot and don’t seem to care what people think (I say this as a life long Labour vote who cannot stomach voting for Labour as it now is). Parliament even have a nursery! www.parliament.uk/about/working/nursery/

For some reason I find the fact you’ve really self righteously provided a link to the nursery absolutely hilarious.

@iawbuwes

It is unreasonable for elected representatives not to be given maternity leave - they are elected as individuals. But if they are speaking in parliament they can surely find childcare for that time period. And maybe your term in parliament is not the ideal time to have a baby, give that your focus is meant to be on your constituents.

And there's the sexism.

@Missmissmiiiiiiiiisss

You’re totally missing the point. Most people don’t or can’t leave their tiny baby (hers isn’t even 4months old!). She has to because otherwise her constituents won’t be represented in parliament because of antiquated rules. Basically MPs can’t really go on proper maternity leave. That’s why she’s bringing her baby in. She’d much rather be at home with her baby for 6 months but she can’t nominated anyone else do this for her.

I am sorry for cynicism. But you know what people (of any sex) do if their chosen career suddenly does not fit well with parenting responsibilities, and does not pay enough to cover adequate childcare? Well, they quit and someone else suitably qualified takes the job and does it without bringing small babies to work. Even if they are a neurosurgeon or a firefighter. Or an MP.

@forinborin Well said!

You do know that women didn’t get the vote, the right to have their own bank account, get a mortgage, carry on working after they got married, equal pay by being quiet and nice and not making a fuss?

I’m sure SM knows how to get childcare and probably has some, some of the time, but if we want to have MPs including women who live real lives like their constituents, rather than just the boys club who pride themselves on having 7 kids without changing a nappy, or just an indeterminate number of kids, people need to be shown what the failings in the current system are. In most other jobs, no maternity rights would be shit, why should politics be any different?

@Heidipi

You do know that women didn’t get the vote, the right to have their own bank account, get a mortgage, carry on working after they got married, equal pay by being quiet and nice and not making a fuss?

I’m sure SM knows how to get childcare and probably has some, some of the time, but if we want to have MPs including women who live real lives like their constituents, rather than just the boys club who pride themselves on having 7 kids without changing a nappy, or just an indeterminate number of kids, people need to be shown what the failings in the current system are. In most other jobs, no maternity rights would be shit, why should politics be any different?

They do have ‘maternity rights’ but what they don’t have is the right to delegate their vote to someone else or do it somewhere other than the chamber which I think is entirely fair. Any MP that has a baby knows this and has plenty of time to prepare for it and has an ample salary to pay for childcare for the periods they are in the chamber. Hardly reasonable to complain - it is a simple problem with a simple solution.

"But you know what people (of any sex) do if their chosen career suddenly does not fit well with parenting responsibilities, and does not pay enough to cover adequate childcare?
Well, they quit and someone else suitably qualified takes the job and does it without bringing small babies to work.
Even if they are a neurosurgeon or a firefighter. Or an MP."

Or they could just get involved in debates and voting via Teams/online platforms.

I don't think those options are open to firefighters etc.

@Heidipi

The baby is 3 months old. She should be on maternity leave but MPs don’t get any.

This.

Plus she's not allowed a proxy or someone to stand in so her constituents would have no representation.

Good on her. And well done for taking a stand - I wouldn't have coped trying to work with a 3-month old.

A simple solution of being able to vote online or by proxy is also workable though. And also addresses the issues of MPs off on long term sick, meaning votes aren't lost and constituents aren't left without representation.

they don’t have is the right to delegate their vote to someone else or do it somewhere other than the chamber
That is literally the point of what she has done, to get these rights. Not to get out of paying childcare, but to create workable solutions for when MPs are unable to be present I.e. when sick or on maternity leave.

It is absurd to expect work places to accommodate peoples desire to have children to the extent so many PP think they should.
She didn't need or ask for any accommodation. She just turned up and did her job.

You must be people with no experience of the real world.
I have plenty of experience of the real world, that's why I applaud attempts to make life easier for working mothers.

MPs are allowed maternity leave, the speaker has the power to alllow proxy votes

@NamechangeApril21

So fine she has a stand in for everything else and all she needs to do is get childcare when she is in the chamber. No need for theatrics and drama.

But she shouldn't have to! She's on maternity leave!

She is paid £82k a year. She has a stand in who does most of the work. All she has to do is appear in the chambers every so often. She can easily afford childcare! All she is doing is displaying her privilege. Most working mothers don’t have the privilege of keeping their salary when they are on leave. They have to either take the reduction in maternity pay or go back to work and arrange childcare.

PinkMochi I agree

@iawbuwes

My question is why can her partner not sure childcare so she can get on with voting? That’s what most people do.

That could solve her problem but it wouldn't solve the problem for all female MPs in the future. What if they don't have a partner or family to help out? At 3 months I wasn't ready to leave my baby for more than a short period anyway but she's obligated to do so or her constituents who voted for her won't be represented.

Her replacement can't vote which I imagine is a big part of the job. It's not like for like cover.

She can't vote electronically (which they managed over the pandemic).

And she's not representing most working mothers who are employees. She is not an employee. She asking for adaptations for women in politics. Do we want women of childbearing age in politics or not?

Was the baby limiting her or anyone else's ability to do their job. If not then what's the issue?
Once the baby gets big/loud/stops sleeping and feeding most of the time, it's an issue.
But a tiny baby basically in the 4th trimester. Not an issue.
I took my baby to work at that age, in a sling, taught teenagers. Breastfed whilst walking and talking and they didn't even notice. Small babies are fairly inconspicuous for short periods of time.

@Notonthestairs

"But you know what people (of any sex) do if their chosen career suddenly does not fit well with parenting responsibilities, and does not pay enough to cover adequate childcare? Well, they quit and someone else suitably qualified takes the job and does it without bringing small babies to work. Even if they are a neurosurgeon or a firefighter. Or an MP."

Or they could just get involved in debates and voting via Teams/online platforms.

I don't think those options are open to firefighters etc.

I'm sure I don't need to point out why an MP wouldn't give up her position mid-term.

How do you think things for "most working mothers" will change without working mothers in politics?

And?

Why shouldn't online voting for nursing mothers/disabled etc be utilised?

She is paid £82k a year. She has a stand in who does most of the work. All she has to do is appear in the chambers every so often. She can easily afford childcare! All she is doing is displaying her privilege. Most working mothers don’t have the privilege of keeping their salary when they are on leave. They have to either take the reduction in maternity pay or go back to work and arrange childcare

Its nothing to do with maternity pay, it is to do with maternity cover and ensuring her constituents get what they, as tax payers, are paying for - representation.

I find incredible that we could have proxy and remote votes for MPs moonlighting for the BVI whilst on HoC property and that was deemed acceptible but the boys club sez "no" to use of remote or proxies for MPs on chemotherapy, recovering from surgery or in 4th trimester.

A 13 week old breastfeeder can't just be left with a nanny for the day, unless you are suggesting a wet nurse? And again, nannies won't help MPs on sick leave.

Everyone saying "she shouldn't be there" and "Women with children shouldn't be in the House" is simply reinforcing boys club rules when we should be looking at the structures and how they work, not still trying to be mini-men with padded shoulders and power suits.

@Notonthestairs

"But you know what people (of any sex) do if their chosen career suddenly does not fit well with parenting responsibilities, and does not pay enough to cover adequate childcare? Well, they quit and someone else suitably qualified takes the job and does it without bringing small babies to work. Even if they are a neurosurgeon or a firefighter. Or an MP."

Or they could just get involved in debates and voting via Teams/online platforms.

I don't think those options are open to firefighters etc.

My point was more about arguments along the lines "but who will look after her constituents, will be they thrown to the wolves?". The same as with the neurosurgeon and the firefighter, if they resign due to family responsibility conflict, other qualified people will come and fill the vacancy. I cannot understand why posters on the thread try to make it that she's in a uniquely difficult situation. Self-employed mothers are in the same position. Most of high-flying career professional women are in the same position.

I am not represented by anyone in the UK as don't have voting rights, but if I were, I wanted my MP not only to press the voting button and dial into debates on Teams, but actually spend her working day analysing, reading, listening to different sides of the story and making an informed judgment.
Is it possible whilst caring for a 3 month old baby in parallel? No. Both are full-time occupations.

It's also a feature of the voting system that we have with individuals in individual constituency. If we had a PR type system, like for the EU parliament or indeed the London assembly then there would be other people to cover her responsibilities so she could have her maternity leave

A 13 week old breastfeeder can't just be left with a nanny for the day, unless you are suggesting a wet nurse? And again, nannies won't help MPs on sick leave.
She can afford formula, I'd imagine. Most of mothers returning to work stop breastfeeding. Not ideal, but not terrible either - some compromises must be made.

@forinborin

A 13 week old breastfeeder can't just be left with a nanny for the day, unless you are suggesting a wet nurse? And again, nannies won't help MPs on sick leave. She can afford formula, I'd imagine. Most of mothers returning to work stop breastfeeding. Not ideal, but not terrible either - some compromises must be made.

Disgusting remark.

Disgusting remark.
Ehhh? What is disgusting about it? I stopped with both of mine. All my friends did. It is impractical when you need to be out of the house for 10+ hours. Not ideal, yes, but not the end of the world.