Why do people believe Covid was made in a lab?

[Disabrie22]

I saw this on another thread about someone having a cold - where does this theory come from? I only know one person who believes this, who interestingly is in medicine. I have no strong opinion, just trying to live through this like most people. But I’m interested in why people might believe this.

Because COVID-19 is a bat coronavirus that was first discovered in Wuhan. And the Wuhan institute of virology laboratories had been studying bat coronaviruses for some time. And the year before covid, US inspectors visited the Wuhan laboratories and found that they had serious failings in safety procedures.

I don’t think it was ‘made in a lab’ but I do think someone in the lab was studying a highly contagious disease and didn’t decontaminate perfectly when they left work for the day.

Read this article below about the UK’s last smallpox outbreak, and note that they never worked out how the smallpox escaped the laboratory, which should have been impossible. The lady working on the floor above the lab still died of it though.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1978_smallpox_outbreak_in_the_United_Kingdom

Deliberately created in a lab as a biological weapon and then released on purpose? Vanishingly unlikely.

Accidentally released from the lab where it was being studied due to poor infection control/decontamination procedures? Seems very likely to me.

[quote KurtWildesChristmasNamechange]@knittingaddict that's my experience of how it felt. It's not nonsense just because you don't understand tit. [/quote]
I'm not saying that feelings don't matter, but in a debate that is largely about science, facts have much more weight than feelings. Science matters and the rise of the anti science movement is dangerous, in my opinion.

A lay person's feelings about a virus do not equal the knowledge of a trained virologist. That is a fact.

@Sunshine1235

I do think it a very weird coincidence that the virus originated from Wuhan where there is a lab where they study Corona virus’. I don’t think that means it was man made but more likely a leaked lab situation.

I agree. Also it seems to be such an effective virus. It's annoying in every way possible - doesn't show up on tests immediately, doesn't show symptoms immediately, mutates really quickly, symptoms differ widely between different people etc.

I read an article a few months ago from a scientist who was convinced it was man-made but then satisfied himself it was natural. But he took some convincing!

This is the report that made me take the possibility seriously

www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/wuhan-lab-staff-sought-hospital-care-before-covid-19-outbreak-disclosed-wsj-2021-05-23/

I’m a scientist working in infectious diseases. I’m not at all a conspiracy theorist, very pro-can, all that stuff. I do think a lab leak is the most likely source. I don’t think it was ‘made’ in a lab per se, there are lots of coronaviruses in the world, though this one may be slightly mutated from a naturally occurring form. But you’d be amazed how often mistakes happen, especially when people are under stress (which you may expect amongst Chinese scientists given government pressures). I don’t necessarily think it was malicious, but it wouldn’t be a difficult mistake to make if security measures and infection control is weak.

Synthetic is how it felt. Artificial. Not like anything I'd ever felt before, and I've had tons of viruses and a couple of nasty more prolonged illnesses in my 45 years. Nothing about it felt organic. I tried explaining it to a family member who wasn't really sure what I meant until they caught it and I received a text saying oh.. I see what you mean now!

Clearly there's something about it that makes some of us experience it that way.

Can you describe what you mean by synthetic KurtWildesChristmasNamechange? What symptoms exactly didn't felt "artificial"?

I think your feelings are valid, but your conclusion is not, unless you're a virologist.

Sorry I meant:

What symptoms exactly felt "artificial"?

@bookworm14

Deliberately created in a lab as a biological weapon and then released on purpose? Vanishingly unlikely.

Accidentally released from the lab where it was being studied due to poor infection control/decontamination procedures? Seems very likely to me.

Yes, honestly it amazes me that anyone would think this wasn't at least a realistic possibility.

Because COVID-19 is a bat coronavirus that was first discovered in Wuhan.

No. The closest thing to COVID-19 was discovered in bat caves in Laos in 2017/2018 and was transported to the Wuhan virology centre. What happened after that is anyone's guess really, and I doubt we'll ever be privy to the information. There's plenty of links online if you'd like to read about it.

The thought that a government (any government) might engineer a virus that imitates flu like symptoms, designed to do the most damage to a certain demographic (with some small collateral damage of other demographics) might be too horrifying to entertain, but you can't deny that these things may exist.

I'm not saying that's what it is btw. Just that it's unhealthy to not at least question what the government and media present us.

You only have to mention that the virus felt synthetic and you get shot down and told your experience is 'nonsense'. You only have to voice a 'what if...' and you get branded a conspiracy theorist. It's a great way of shutting down any kind of serious major discussion about it.

It's more than plausible that it was leaked from a lab in Wuhan that studies coronaviruses. Chinese scientists have been silenced for speaking out so there's no clear information. But definitely not an out-there theory and actually probably the most logical one.

Because it's actually quite likely that it was made in a lab and released accidentally?

The theory was rubbished in the mainstream media at first but I understand is now being given a lot more credence.

A lay person's feelings about a virus do not equal the knowledge of a trained virologist. That is a fact.

So when they test vaccines on human subjects, do they not take the information given by those subjects on how they feel, side effects etc seriously, because they're just a 'lay person'?

Half the things we know about illnesses on this planet exists because of information gathered from people who've had that illness.

I read a while back that a group of miners became seriously ill with something very similar to Covid in 2012 after working in a mine in Mojang, China.

Samples were studied at the Wuhan Institute if Virology.

If this was related. it was probably accidentally released but I thought it was a plausible theory.

www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/chinas-mojiang-mine-its-role-origins-covid-19-2021-06-09/

@picklemewalnuts

Because some people who specialise in studying such things think it is possible.

I don't know the woman's name, and she's been severely targeted for her statements, but apparently there's a significant possibility which no one wants to dwell on.

haha well that was specific and helpful!

Half the things we know about illnesses on this planet exists because of information gathered from people who've had that illness.

Also this is a brand new illness, even the experts are struggling to get their heads around it. Dismissing the experiences/theories of those who have been through it seems remarkably short sighted.

Personally I haven't had covid, so I've no idea what this 'synthetic' feeling is like, but it sounds like an interesting point for further investigation to me. It's never smart to simply dismiss things.

It’s a conspiracy theory. Scientists have already analysed the Covid virus and concluded it is of natural origin. It is not possible to have been artificially genetically altered. The only question outstanding is whether it accidentally leaked from Wuhan lab or first transmitted to humans elsewhere.

directorsblog.nih.gov/2020/03/26/genomic-research-points-to-natural-origin-of-covid-19/

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7332915/

www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02596-2

www.factcheck.org/2021/06/scicheck-the-facts-and-gaps-on-the-origin-of-the-coronavirus/

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/06/the-lab-leak-theory-inside-the-fight-to-uncover-covid-19s-origins/amp

I think escaped from a lab is one of the more plausible theories.

the virus felt synthetic and you get shot down

This is nonsense. You cannot “feel” whether a virus is genetically altered by human geneticists or by a natural mutation. It’s impossible. That’s why you get shot down, because it’s an idiot thing to say.

I think it was made in a lab. In Wuhan.

I like to think it leaked accidentally.

It's the only "conspiracy theory" I have

@PlanDeRaccordement

the virus felt synthetic and you get shot down

This is nonsense. You cannot “feel” whether a virus is genetically altered by human geneticists or by a natural mutation. It’s impossible. That’s why you get shot down, because it’s an idiot thing to say.

Your opinion of my experience is irrelevant. But thanks anyway 👍🏻

Usually when there is a virus that leaps from animals to humans there is plenty of evidence of it or similar viruses being transmitted animal to animal. With Covid-19 there is not yet any evidence of this having happened.

?? No evidence? What about 2009 Swine Flu...coronavirus jumped from pigs to humans. What about bird flu...coronavirus jumped from birds to humans? What about MERS...coronavirus jumped from camels to humans.

@KurtWildesChristmasNamechange

It’s not an opinion. It is as impossible to “feel” whether a virus has been genetically altered by humans or nature as it is impossible to “feel” the individual bacteria currently colonising your digestive system. Impossible.

Unless you have some superpower....if you think that I know a good psychiatrist.

It isn’t a conspiracy theory, it’s actually perfectly plausible because there is a lab in Wuhan where the first outbreak occurred where they study coronaviruses. Bit of a coincidence.

The conspiracy theory part is the saying it was deliberately made in a lab and/or released on purpose.

Leak from lab, not conspiracy theory.