To think that schools do too many "pay a pound to..." days?

[NewSwimmingMum]

It isn't an issue for us to pay £1 here and there for mufti, odd socks, Christmas jumper etc, although remembering is a different matter!

Am I wrong to think it might add unnecessary pressure to families who are struggling? There will have been 2 in October, 2 in November and then at least 1 in December.

I guess one good thing is that it is a little more anonymous now school asks us to donate via the online payment system-at least a parent can imply to child they have paid. But not sure they should have to.

@Comedycook

Don't send them in with the money...or send them in with 20p. The teachers won't say anything I reckon. One year my DC's school requested a pound for a charity I do not support. I gave my DD 10p so she'd at least have something to chuck in the bucket. Nothing was said.

This^^ This is what us poor parents do

I am so fed up of constant requests for money, we get asked for £20 per child each year for equipment for our charity school and emailed if we haven't paid. I reply nope can't afford £60.

I have 3 DCs and it's constant needing a £1. If you can't afford it, you can't. It's unfair for DCs to stand out as the poor ones who can't wear non uniform. So I give them whatever coin I have, usually one gets a 20p and two a 10p. Sometimes one gets £1 but mostly I use those for car parking . I had no way of parking near a client once as my DCs had taken all my car parking money (kept in car) so they learnt afterwards never to "help themselves"

@StucklnAMuumuuCantGetOutOflt Don’t send your child then. Keep him at home if you’d prefer. Your attitude towards the school doing something nice is horrible 😂

@ikeptgoing
How do schools pay for things the government won’t provide for?

I have no sympathy for people with multiple kids who then complain about paying for multiple kids! Some people fall on hard times, but most must have known before they had kids that they would struggle to support them.

FFS. No. I know so, so many families who did not know this. Mothers who did not know that their partner would fuck off when they got pregnant and never pay a penny. Parents who worked hard for years in precarious hospitality roles which have crumbled over the past two years. Families who did not predict that one day they were going to have to leave everything they had worked hard for and flee under cover of darkness over thousands of miles to fetch up in this cold and expensive and heartless city.

Charity begins at home.

In any case, the difficulty here is that children are caught in the middle. Whether you think their parents are feckless or miserly or impoverished by structural forces and there but for the grace of God go I, anything which shames or penalises the children of non-donaters is fucked up.

Mine don’t really care about dressing up or dress down days, 11 year old will likely just wear his uniform. I think the kids feel they have to join in lucky he doesn’t care if he’s different and it’s hard if you’re skint - I’m. Single mum 4 kids eldest is an adult but it gets expensive if they do want to. Also I don’t use cash a lot so finding change is a pain too.

fangs dream on - I work in a school - you can't ''just not send them in then'' What planet are you on? Unauthorised attendance. As for your crying laughing face, get knotted. You obviously don't know what it's like to have money worries if you don't think 25 quid on a panto your kids do not want to attend is no biggie.

@Fangsalot89

There’s nothing undignified about being poor and assuming they would feel this way is part of the problem. If it’s such a huge issue for them to take part, then an honest, Frank and confidential discussion is what’s needed.

I'm guessing you've never been poor yourself? Even if you have, surely you realise that most people in that position don't want to have to tell people about it? There's a huge social stigma to being poor, where you will frequently be told that it's your fault, wrong priorities, offered patronising 'budgeting' help etc. This may be true for some poor people, but a great many folk don't deserve to be tarred with the same brush. Nobody boasts about being poor except, ironically, some of the well off who compare themselves to millionaires.

The school doesn’t want to be in the position to make people feel like this and quite frankly, I reckon those that do are very few and far between. It’s usually an issue for those that can afford but don’t want to and dress it up under a banner of highlighting it for a good cause.

If they genuinely don't want to make people feel like this, a lot of them are doing a very bad job of ensuring that. They know that they have poor and struggling parents, but they still often apparently don't care about embarrassing them and making them feel even more inadequate than they may already do. You may live in an affluent area, but even your belief that those who can't afford these repeated requests (and associated costs) are very few in number suggests that you may be speaking from a position of privilege.

We're just back to the dignity thing again: if it's a case of your child being embarrassed - maybe bullied - at a school charity day or missing a meal or two for yourself, a lot of parents will choose the latter; just because you may not realise what they've done, doesn't mean that they haven't been put in that position in the first place.

@StucklnAMuumuuCantGetOutOflt
Ahh yes, the standard Mumsnet assumption on a total stranger. Of course 25 quid is no big deal. proceeds to burn one just for fun
🤣
Keep him off, say he’s ill. No unauthorised day off then.

@WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll

Another analysis of a total stranger based on nothing more than they simply don’t agree with you.
Are you one of these poor families?

I agree. I think the worse thing is the indirect pressure to spend on fancy dress outfits or Christmas jumpers etc

I do say to people (I’m a class rep - meanings I don’t choose the activities but communicate them) “don’t spend money” but of course people feel they have to

If you can't afford it fine. If you can great. Our school just updated their library with money raised and the looks on the children's faces when they saw it was a picture. Schools don't have the money to fund all the things they feel our children deserve. So if that's the way they do it ill take it. It gives children more and improves their learning surroundings. I'm not sure how we can argue with that unless you don't want improvements.

The environmental aspect bothers me a lot too. I know you don't have to buy something specially, but we know very many families will.

This!! It’s actually quite hard not to buy something for some of these things. Ours are meant to wear neon tights or socks to school next week- we don’t have any, I’ll have to buy some but can’t see us using them again- I would rather just give the money for the tights to the school, but then don’t want DD to feel left out.

fangs I have to go to work myself. Costs are collected and paid in advance. Have a word with yourself. If people are making assumptions, it's based on what you chose to write in your posts.

But the letter states (rather threateningly in my opinion) that there will be a payment check carried out at registration on the day. So basically if parents don't pay the child will be singled out either by having to wear uniform or being questioned about this in registration.

That's appalling. Who needs school bullies when the staff are right there to do it for them?

Your attitude towards the school doing something nice is horrible

It isn't a nice thing at all when you threaten/coerce others into doing it too, whether they want to or can afford it. The whole idea of charity is that it's people giving what they can and what they want - when it just effectively becomes another tax, there's nothing at all nice about it.

AS PP said, plenty of those being pressurised to give might well be more in need than some of the recipients of the donations.

@GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing

As head of our PTA we always try to make the official stance to not go out and buy things deliberately for one occasion and in fact have spent these past two terms concocting fundraising events that wouldn’t need it and are things that everyone has.
Of course people still complain.

The idea is not to upset and piss people off but a necessary evil considering the state of the educational system.

@StucklnAMuumuuCantGetOutOflt

You know what they say about assumptions don’t you 😉
Are your days off unpaid?

Children in Need is our first one this year, school have only asked for 50p, I will give £1 so that it covers another child who's parents couldn't afford it.

We also don't pay for wearing chirstmas jumpers?! They do it every Friday during December!

I think our school are mindful that we're in a deprived area and don't go in for all the different days that some schools do.

They do however have an annoying rule I don't like.... you can't just go in your own clothes, you have to stick to the theme- which I think is unfair on those whos parents can't afford to buy something for the theme/have time to create something.

@Fangsalot89 I’m sure you do

I just think people feel indirect pressure

fangs My days off are unpaid, yes, if I am not doing supply teaching and I do not take days off ill. I can imagine you being a head of the PTA - and will judge away solely based on the frequency with which you use emojis.

@GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing
I think sadly a lot of that comes from the parents themselves along with being competitive.
If the PTA or school is not understanding of financial issues cropping up then that’s a huge problem within the school and should be seriously raised but I take objection to this blanket statement on here about it all.

The secondary I teach at does about 1 a year so yours does sound a lot! Mind you, I wouldn’t chase up a student who ‘forgot’ to bring a pound in, though that’s not particularly helpful as they aren’t to know that.

@StucklnAMuumuuCantGetOutOflt

Fucking love an emoji 😉 Great way to express emotions on what can be quite a soulless form of communication. I feel people know exactly where you stand if you use them and never understand people who turn their nose up at them.

You don’t take days of ill? Crumbs, I wish I had your immune system.

Imagine being under my wing of the PTA where I tell parents repeatedly “you don’t have to get involved but we do need funds to pay for your precious ones to use laptops and read books.”
It’s unbearable. 🤪

Another analysis of a total stranger based on nothing more than they simply don’t agree with you.
Are you one of these poor families?

Where did I analyse you? I just suggested that you could be talking from a position of privilege, based on your comments, as I suppose the only alternative I can think of would be that you do know but simply don't care.

Thankfully, we are no longer one of these poor families, but we have been in that position. When you have to choose a loaf of bread carefully, because you only have 43p left in your overdraft until you get paid in three days, and then somebody tells you that you need to give 'just a pound' tomorrow for a random charity, you don't especially feel like the cock of the walk.

I'm so grateful that we're no longer in that position - we aren't wealthy, but we now have leeway in our budget - but I never intend to forget just how soul-destroying it is to live like that, nor to forget that, for many people, that is still their lives - often with no end in sight - and to brush them away as an irrelevancy or exaggeration.

I don’t see it as an issue at our kids schools as it’s not mandatory. Staff accept the money if offered but never ask for it.

If it’s for a dress up day, that’s more problematic as most people can’t make an outfit and haven’t always got £15 for one. And environmentally, it’s awful.

I can't imagine anything worse.