No 2 minutes silence at gym. AIBU

[Mushypeasandchipstogo]

I went to my gym today for a class in the swimming pool. I had totally expected the class to finish just before 11am so that those who wanted to could observe the two minutes silence. By 10.55am it was apparent that this was not going to happen so I just took myself out of the pool and sat in the changing room by myself.
So as to not drip feed, I am from a Forces Family and the wrong side of 50! I found this totally disrespectful of the instructor. He could have, at the very least, mentioned that he had intended to not stop before the class. AIBU to be upset by this?

@QueenofKattegat

And by "bigger thing" I mean performative, just like the standing on doorsteps for the NHS last year was performative

Very much agree with this. Performative is exactly the word.

Yep this. ^

And as for the poster who said she got dirty looks from people in Sainsburys, for being silent, but still 'moving about'... WTF? Who the hell do these virtue signalling arseholes think they are?

@notimagain

I thought the silence was on Remembrance Sunday only, I didn't even realise there were two.

I’m ready to be corrected but think that is how it used to be, I’ve got the impression also having a period of silence on the 11th (the actual anniversary) in the UK is a fairly recent thing….

FWIW by way of comparison where I am (France) the 11th is a public holiday and all commemorations/parades are done on the day, which is a public holiday.

As for the OP…I do think it’s a personal matter and I’d actually not expect an enforced silence in somewhere like a health club, but I would make my own arrangements, as indeed I did earlier today.

It is how it used to be. We had Remembrance Sunday on the Sunday nearest the 11th. Then moves were made to get Armistice Day to be a thing as well...and shortly after that Poppy Fascism started to gather momentum.

Education and quiet reflection I'm all for. I know my history. However there's nothing respectful about performance poppying.

@Lemonsyellow
I think it began to remember the tragic loss of life on all sides in WW1. Then it became about paying respects to those who sacrificed to beat fascism in WW2. A change of meaning, but perfectly reasonable. Then perhaps 20-30 years ago, it changed again into loud media proclamations of also showing “support for our troops in Iraq/Afghanistan etc”. And then even more recently it’s it’s become about mass media/social media virtue signalling plus yet another vehicle for the right wing tabloids to bash anyone perceived to be on the left of the political spectrum. Pretty tragic really.

@Suzi888

YANBU but no one seems to care anymore. Generation ❄️ We wouldn’t win a war these days!

What a nasty ageist remark. Imagine if something similar was said about elderly people. Shame on you. NEWSFLASH, the people who fought in the wars were young people you know!

And FWIW, I find younger people (35 and under) generally much more polite and less obnoxious and rude than the 50 to 75 year old age group. That age group are the rudest of the lot in my experience. And no, I am not being ageist like you, because I am in the age group. So I am not being ageist, I am stating a fact.

What @supermoonrising said. And the tabloids have popularised the virtue signalling for all they're worth.

Not ALL people 50 to 75 are rude of course, but there are more rude people in that age group than any other age group in my experience.

My Grandad fought in WW2, in fact he was on a boat that got torpedoed and just survived, a lot of his friends didn't. He only died three years ago but was very anti all of this.

He used to say that he wished people would just remember in private and not do all these forced shows of remembrance.

@Lemonsyellow

I’ve got the impression also having a period of silence on the 11th (the actual anniversary) in the UK is a fairly recent thing….

You’re right. 1995.

Thanks for confirming that - I was wondering if was imagining it.

@Libertaire

YABU.

If you wish to observe two minutes silence, carry on. Nobody is stopping you.

Others are free to ignore such public virtue-signalling if they wish.

It's not virtue signalling, it's respectful.

Does it never occur to you just how we are free in this country to be able to 'ignore such public virtue signalling'?

We must never forget them.

@Suzi888

YANBU but no one seems to care anymore. Generation ❄️ We wouldn’t win a war these days!

Oh bore off. This is literally the reason why forced shows of respect don't work - because they get hijacked.

@LiveatCityHall

I have to agree with you op. I was in tesco today and just before 11am they announced they would be observing the 2 minute silence. When it started I looked around the store and everyone I could see had stopped and bowed their heads. It was very respectful.

The same thing happened in Primark today.

@Lemonsyellow

I’ve got the impression also having a period of silence on the 11th (the actual anniversary) in the UK is a fairly recent thing….

You’re right. 1995.

That's so weird. I swear it has always been a thing, the 2 minutes silence. Well, maybe a 1 minute one pre 21 century, but I am sure it's always been a thing.

@WhenISnappedAndFarted

My Grandad fought in WW2, in fact he was on a boat that got torpedoed and just survived, a lot of his friends didn't. He only died three years ago but was very anti all of this.

He used to say that he wished people would just remember in private and not do all these forced shows of remembrance.

My great grandma was similar. My great grandfather died on a ship that was torpedoed and she had very little time for the performance of it. Their daughter (my grandma) is the same. She remembers her father but wants nothing to do with the people tutting and finger wagging over someone not wearing a poppy.

It was the 50th Anniversary of VE Day in 1995, pre Blair, that changed things

Yes. And since then it's become more performative every year. To the point that I no longer wear a poppy, because it no longer speaks of quiet respect, but of either obligation or performance wearing.

In my area, rather scarily, it's the right wing who seem to be trying to hijack it. The same people who post racist and anti asylum seeker lies on my local Facebook page, are the ones now posting outrage at someone not wearing a poppy. It's very disturbing.

@LaetitiaASD

Personally I had no idea there was a minute's silence today. Obviously I am aware that remembrance type activities have been going on recently, but I didn't have a clue of 11am today. I believe that there are two reasons I didn't know -

(1) I detest the jingoistic and nationalistic right wing flag waving that goes on. Remembrance day looks like an opportunity for the right to further it's aims, as opposed to a genuine attempt to commemorate the dead and consider how important it is not to stir up nationalism which itself increases the likelihood of war
and
(2) I detest the jingoistic and nationalistic right wing flag waving government, to the point that they are so despicably immoral and corrupt that I can't abide listening to the news where I get to be made depressed by their latest depravity, and which is where I might have heard that the 11 o'clock thing was happening.

I don't think anyone has the obligation to participate in remembrance day - indeed I feel obliged not to. In an ideal world the country could unite against the futility of the nationalism that lead to wars and death, and the wars and death itself.

This 100%

@Suzi888

YANBU but no one seems to care anymore. Generation ❄️ We wouldn’t win a war these days!

Ridiculous.

@Oblio I agree that it is respectful to take part in the 2 minutes silence, but it IS virtue signalling to scowl and glare at, and judge people who choose not to do it. It's a free country, and a democracy, the thing the soldiers fought for in the war(s). No-one should be judged for not wanting to take part publicly. As has been said, many people will do it privately. And anyone who judges and scowls at people for not taking part publicly is an arrogant arsehole.

[quote supermoonrising]@Lemonsyellow
I think it began to remember the tragic loss of life on all sides in WW1. Then it became about paying respects to those who sacrificed to beat fascism in WW2. A change of meaning, but perfectly reasonable. Then perhaps 20-30 years ago, it changed again into loud media proclamations of also showing “support for our troops in Iraq/Afghanistan etc”. And then even more recently it’s it’s become about mass media/social media virtue signalling plus yet another vehicle for the right wing tabloids to bash anyone perceived to be on the left of the political spectrum. Pretty tragic really.[/quote]
Yes, I basically agree with you. While the two-minute silence was a thing on 11/11 before WW2, the government in WW2 changed it and introduced Remembrance Sunday, because workers stopping working on a weekday for even a couple of minutes was harming the war effort.

We did it during our PE lesson today. It's important.

@supermoonrising

And then even more recently it’s it’s become about mass media/social media virtue signalling plus yet another vehicle for the right wing tabloids to bash anyone perceived to be on the left of the political spectrum. Pretty tragic really.

When similar observations crept into the parallel poppies debate I felt I needed to take my leave and I think care needs to be taken if politics drifts into the topic of remembrance again…

I do agree with you and others that some parts of the media and others have definitely hijacked the occasion…….

However (and I know you are not implying this) ….that does not mean everybody who commemorates the event by the wearing of a poppy or observing the silence is right of centre politically.

It's all performative nonsense, just like the cringy nhs clapping.

I think people should take the time to do if it they wish to, but equally nobody should be forced to. Part of enjoying freedom is to have those choices even if I don’t agree with them.

Personally I think the push of poppy based merchandise in recent years is quite distasteful too. I don’t see how pepperoni arranged on a pizza or images of soldiers on cappuccinos helps remember the fallen. I know a percentage of sales often goes to charity (sometimes a very small amount) but it leaves a bad taste in my mouth as it feels performative and disrespectful. But I guess money drives everything.

When I think of the fallen I often think that many soldiers throughout history didn’t know what they had let themselves in for, signed up to fight someone else’s battle and were marched to their deaths like lambs to the slaughter. I think of how frightened they must’ve been in their last moments. Wilfred Owen and Siegfried Sassoon have said it far better than me.

It's probably a case of people not realising the time and it slipping their mind. I was at a funeral at this morning, funeral was ending at that point and it was impossible to do it I think. Everyone was saying their goodbyes after the service.

@FangsForTheMemory

If you're the wrong side of 50, you'll remember that nobody in this country used to observe two minutes' silence except those attending Armistice Day ceremonies. It should be a personal thing.

15 years ago, our local town almost stopped commemorating as the parade was becoming fewer and fewer people. People just weren't doing it.

Then interest reawakened to the point there are giant poppies on all the lamp stands on my estate, and every possible uniformed service/kids group marches, now.

I personally don't need to join everyone else to reflect on the sacrifice so many made for us. I can do it all by myself, unobserved.

YABU. Complaining about people not remembering as well as you is far more disrespectful than not stopping a gym class for a 2 minute silence. Remembering the sacrifices made and the appalling loss of life is important to me, but how one chooses to do that is a matter of personal choice and no one else's business.

Objectively, being silent for 2 minutes doesn't achieve anything other than what you personally get out of it. Judging other people for their lack of, in your opinion, proper respect is in poor taste. As soon as it becomes competitive or enforced it loses its potency and meaning. It's far better to let people remember in the way that is meaningful to them without any thoughts of what other people might be thinking about how 'properly' they do it.