Can my employer ban me from the office?

[Anothercovidthread]

NC.
I have recently started a new job. It is a non customer facing office job, based in Scotland. The company is very large. I have been working from home since I began the job due to covid restrictions. Today, we were told that we will return to the office towards the end of the month and going forwards we will do 3 days in, and 2 days from home. However, to enter the office, you must show proof of having had 2 covid vaccines. My employer will not store details of who has been vaccinated, you just need to show the info to enter. If you have not had the vaccine you are not allowed in the office unless special circumstances and permissions are agreed directly with HR.

I'm still in probation so very concerned about kicking up a fuss but I think this is very wrong.

1. Why should I have to share medical information with reception staff on a daily basis for the foreseeable?
2. Can the company legally ban people from the office for not having a non mandatory vaccine?
3. Assuming that if you have some kind of non vax agreement with HR, you are provided with some other documentation allowing entry to the office, is the company allowed to insist that its shown on a daily basis to whoever is on reception?

AIBU, the employer is just taking steps to keep people safe?

@BrainFartforthethousandthtim
Forcing people to get vaccinated when they already have significant antibodies from having covid, is not only stupid but actually extremely dangerous.

That's why after the first vaccination, a few weeks later (when you have significant antibodies) they give you a second one, and six months later (when you STILL have significant antibodies) they give you a third dose.

I mean none of this is true

Yeah but TIN HATS AND DAVID ICKE

Wish my employer would do this. They are so busy worrying about upsetting people they can’t make a decision about anything.

Given I am showing my pass to attend concerts and board an aircraft I have no issue with showing my pass at work. I’d be pleased my employer was taking action to protect people.

@driftingblue id rather not provide the info but this would make me feel far more comfortable to do it this way. I cant imagine it would be difficult either.

The situation in Melbourne appears very restrictive from how it is being reported on UK news. I would not think it best to take tips from a country in such dire circumstances approaching 2 years into a pandemic.

Dire circumstances ? We just hit 80% vaccinated and we have had 1,400 deaths over the entire pandemic.

Melbourne restrictions from this week -
No restrictions on travel around the state.
No masks outside.
People can return to work if fully vaccinated.
Outdoor public gatherings of 30 people allowed.
Gyms and retail reopen, subject to density limits.
Indoor and outdoor hospitality venue limits increase.
Indoor entertainment venues open at 75% capacity, as many as 1000 patrons.
Outdoor venues as many as 5000 patrons.
Indoor sport resume with density cap.
All schoolchildren back in classrooms full-time.

@robinsreliant we should swap jobs

@starrynight21 We are being told Australia is subject to almost draconian rule at present by the media in the UK, so that's great to hear that news is very wrong and things are almost normal over there. Very strange reporting at the mo here it seems! Apologies!

I’m still suffering from side effects of the vaccine. It does happen.

I genuinely don't see the issue.

Your (private) company has decided that none of their staff will be allowed into their (private) property without proof of vaccination. In order to stay on the right side of GDPR and so that staff do not have to make their medical records accessible, they are not recording vaccine status on the company system, instead are asking people to show their Covid pass whenever they enter.

They are not trying to insist that their staff provide their medical details in any way that can be recorded and attached to staff records (and therefore theoretically accessible to multiple people) they are just asking that staff show their Covid Passport at reception, in the same way they would have to provide photo ID/Work ID to enter.

You have the freedom to choose whether or not to have the vaccine but you do not have a freedom from consequences if you choose not to be vaccinated. Private companies can set any rules they like, provided they do not discriminate based on a protected characteristic as defined in the Equality Act 2010, and that includes making rules on employees requiring proof of vaccination to come on site. No vaccination = no entry.

If someone has a valid reason not to have the vaccine eg for medical reasons then I am sure the company will be more than happy to provide some sort of letter/form for those employees to show to the reception staff in lieu of a vaccine passport

I have both of my vaccination cards in my purse and have had the Covid Passport on my phone since it became available because I have needed it to access many different services and events. I have had both of my jabs and am actually getting my booster in 10 hours (I have been eligible for a few weeks now as I have underlying health conditions that meant I was double jabbed by early April but due to existing commitments/work/available appointments, tomorrow was the soonest I could get booked in) and I have no issue showing someone a screen on my phone, or a couple of bits of card if it means I get to go about my day with a modicum of normality.

I don't know how it will be in Scotland, but in England if you have a genuine certified medical exemption your Covid pass 'will look and work the same for people with medical exemptions as it will for people who are fully vaccinated. The pass will not show that you have a medical exemption'. This should be fully working by December 25th if it is not already. www.gov.uk/guidance/covid-19-medical-exemptions-proving-you-are-unable-to-get-vaccinated

So if you have a certified exemption noone needs to know anything other than HR who would need to see your letter once, and even then I don't think the letter specifies why you are exempt, just that you meet one of the criteria for exemption.

Showing a vaccination certificate is hardly "sharing your medical information". I think you are making a mountain out of a molehill.

[quote PrancingQueen]@Namechangedforthethousandthtim we’re all still waiting for your sources.
Thanks 👍🏻[/quote]
@PrancingQueen no need to wait for anyone to point you to the right studies in Pubmed, you can go straight to Take a Break magazine for the full data on this.

here in Australia (well Melbourne) our certificate is digital, You link to a check in app and it shows you have a valid certificate.
Easy.

No one is using this to track me down medically and access all my data.

And it pisses me off that we are being told we are in prison here. Yes it has been shit being in lockdown so long, but with tough measues, in 2 weeks 90pct of over 12years will be vaccinated out of a pop of about 6.2m (6.8m in Vic, guessing .6 are under 12?) We will be in a great place and right now is not bad.. Just get vaccinated and help everyone

The situation in Melbourne appears very restrictive from how it is being reported on UK news. I would not think it best to take tips from a country in such dire circumstances approaching 2 years into a pandemic

I just looked up the Covid deaths per million rate of Australia. I wouldn't say they are the ones in dire circumstances. 2072 UK v 68 Australia.
Scotland deaths v the whole of Australia also doesn't show them as the ones in dire circumstances 🤷‍♀️

Yeah it's so dire here in Melbourne I don't know how we stand it in this state.

Everything is open to the vaccinated or will be by next week. All you have to do is show your digital certificate or paper cert from your doctor. Masks indoors or where you can't distance. 83% are fully vaccinated and something like 92% have had the first.
Summer, Christmas and holidays are coming.
Lockdown was really hard but it's over.
The place is buzzing again.
Don't believe what you read in your newspapers it sounds like rubbish to me.

[quote Anothercovidthread]@burnto I really don't feel comfortable sharing the information. If it was a one off and the details could be added to my pass then I could maybe understand but to have to show the information 3 times a week to different people, I just don't see that its anyones business. If the vaccine was mandatory then fair enough but its not. In Scotland, care staff do not have to have it either, thats only England as far as I'm aware.[/quote]

1. You say it's a big company. That means that many, many people will be sharing their vaccine status with Reception every day. I doubt that they would really care that much on an individual level about yours, except at the moment you flash it.

1. The only way around flashing it 3 times a week would be recording it in your employee record - but you say you're comfortable sharing the information, so this wouldn't work for you, anyway.

1. An injection is not an invasive medical procedure.

1. In a pandemic, your vaccine status is your company's business. It could affect others you work with, leading to them taking sick leave, etc. if you become ill, obviously you'd need to take leave, possibly extended. These things have multiple consequences for a business, so yes - they need to know.

1. Companies in countries other than England have the same regulation.

1. I am disabled. As a new employee in the past I've had to share details of my health (that are entered permanently in my records) that I'm very certain you would not, if you can't bring yourself to simply show a card briefly as you enter a building.

It's a private company. They do what they want. They have told you that you can't attend the office, but still do your job, you've made a choice and so have they

And here (Aus) you can't get a haircut without showing proof of vaccine, sit in a restaurant or go the the gym. All healthcare, construction and service staff are mandatory- teachers and paramedics etc too. You have to show it to get in anywhere

[quote Anothercovidthread]@boredzelda that makes some sort of sense. My employer is not in the health care industry though, we don't have clients visiting and my team and I perform a non critical function. It wouldn't be ideal if the whole team came down with covid but it wouldn't be catastrophic. Showing a covid certificate wouldn't guarantee that the team wouldn't come down with covid either way though.[/quote]
Two issues with this - “non critical function” - your colleagues still deserves the protection of the company, regardless of department.

“Wouldn’t be catastrophic” so you would be perfectly fine if you passed on Covid to someone who then got seriously ill or even died?!

I agree vaccinated people don’t stop transmission completely however the risk is mitigated and it sounds like your company value that mitigation.

As other have said, you can always get another job if you disagree with their values or approach.

I’m working in a non critical function. I didn’t realise that meant my work didn’t have to provide a safe working space and it’s not a big issue if I died

Lots to improve about how COVID is managed in melb and aust generally but I don’t think we should be taking condescending advice from the uk who still have 200-odd deaths a day. You can keep your new normal just with lots more people dying every day! it’s a lovely day here. Went for a walk and got coffee while dh took dc to swimming lessons, went to a house auction around the corner to be nosy parkers, off to my parents for lunch tomorrow.

Scotland has had over 9,000 deaths in a country of about 5 million.
Australia has had 1,400 deaths in a country of about 27 million. As pp says, I don’t think we should be taking condescending advice from the UK .Hear hear.

Don't you care about your colleagues?

You're still in your probationary period. All you're doing is giving your employer ample evidence they need to be convinced you're not a good fit for their organisation. Fine, if you aren't that bothered about having a job, crack on.

They will just replace you with someone who is community-minded, who does care about their colleagues and does want to play a part in keeping the pandemic under control.