To ask how drivers of massive SUVs square it with themselves in terms of climate change?

[Bleepingtons]

Same goes for those who go long haul on the regular? Buy loads of cheap, disposable fashion? Etc etc? Do you just not worry about climate change?

I know I sound sanctimonious but I am genuinely baffled by people driving massive diesel SUVs like there isn't a major issue.

I honestly think that many people driving SUVs don't care. As long as they've got their comfort, their status symbol/ elevated driving position/ extra space for family and pets, they're happy. Or they explain it away in their heads and that's satisfactory.

Same as the other things you mentioned.

Decades of consumerist propaganda has programmed us not to.

We have 2 large engined petrol SUVs and an electric SUV. Of those vehicles the electric one is by far the least versatile. I try not to buy diesel vehicles where possible as a token effort to reduce particulate pollution.I use a non suv electric car as my daily drive.

We love to travel both long and short haul.

I never buy 'designer' labelled clothing.

I'm not in the least bit concerned about climate change. Part of that position comes from actually reading through these infernal climate change 'catastrophe' reports themselves and not the reporting on what they supposedly say.

While it’s a reasonable question overall, from a climate change perspective a diesel will generally emit less Co2 than the petrol equivalent. It’s on particles (so air quality) that they’re more problematic. A lot of people driving older diesels were encouraged to do so for climate change reasons…

I always find it interesting that people latch on to totems - SUVs, long haul flights - rather than equivalents which may be just as damaging or more so. There are plenty of saloons (even under the same marque) with higher emissions than the SUVs.

For me, I fly long haul (when it’s possible) because that’s where my family all live. For Europe, we tend to take trains.

I don’t drive a ‘massive SUV’, though I do drive a smaller crossover because it suited our needs at the time; the emissions aren’t hugely out of whack with other, less loathed types of car that met our needs at the time (lower than a lot, actually.) We’ll replace it in the next few years when we can afford to.

We drive relatively little. Have both stopped driving to work, ever, even though it would be massively more convenient for DH at least. Walk or cycle where we can.

Prefer to buy fewer, good quality clothes less often.

I’m no saint. We still eat some meat as a family, and consume a lot of dairy. I’ll keep flying to see my parents and siblings for as long as I can afford to, assuming they ever let us back in. I can’t promise my next car will be fully electric or my next heating system a heat pump, because life has complexities. I would love it if they didn’t exist.

What do you consider to be a “massive SUV”?

Do you have children, OP?

Acceptance, mainly. The planet changes. Species die out. It’s been happening for literally billions of years. I don’t see the end of humanity as being some great tragedy. And on a personal level, bluntly, I’ve chosen to be child free so once I’m gone that’s that, and don’t feel like I owe anything to the children of people who haven’t.

SIL has a Wrangler and her DH drives a huge pick-up. Both are diesel.

They reckon they really need them for doing the school run in commuter belt Surrey.

I'm really surprised you're baffled tbh. Do you honestly believe that the majority of people consider the environment when making their lifestyle choices (beyond basic, easy stuff like putting the recycling out)? I really don't think they do.

You can say the same thing to people who go on regular holidays abroad, people who chose to eat meat, who buy clothes from high street stores.

No point pinning it down on one group of people, we are all to blame.
Everyone is a little bit of a hypocrite when it comes to going green

I'm not in the least bit concerned about climate change. Part of that position comes from actually reading through these infernal climate change 'catastrophe' reports themselves and not the reporting on what they supposedly say.

I am very worried about climate change because I’ve read the IPCC reports in detail rather than the reporting which at least half the times minimises the findings.

But I’m also very flawed.

I think for a lot of people (me included, though I don’t have an SUV!) it comes down to, “it’s only one plastic bottle… said 10 million people.”

I’m intelligent, I am aware, and I care. But despite that, honestly the scale isn’t compelling. I look at my one thing (my many one things: the steak, the diesel car, the not turning back for my water bottle) and know I’m part of the problem - but don’t really feel that it makes that much difference.

Not sure if I’ll get my arse handed to me for that! I’m certainly not arguing that I’m right, just trying to give insight. I think it’s maybe 90% that I don’t really FEEL the urgency and impact of my one thing in the moment, and 10% that I’m selfish and want it anyway.

To be clear: I might be making 95% good choices. I’m not saying I’m a walking (driving?!) environmental disaster! But in my 5% of bad choices - it’s the 90% don’t feel it, 10% selfish moment.

I'd feel a bit of a tit driving round in a big gas guzzler. Just get an electric car fgs, yes more expensive but if they can afford a big ugly range rover then EVs will obviously be in their price range too.

We have one family car- a diesel SUV. We will replace it for a more climate friendly car. But I’m sure people judge me for driving it. But those who judge me don’t know: we are a one car family which means lower production impact; we deliberately chose to live near a good train station and never drive to work; and our diesel SUV is actually more economical than many smaller vehicles.

I wonder how many people who judge SUV drivers are three-car families and drive to work every day?

It’s best not to judge without knowledge.

Let’s not demonise massive SUV drivers - none of us are perfect.

I don't drive an SUV but I live in a very rural area where the most practical thing for many people to drive is a diesel 4x4.

I do not see why they should have to feel shit about it or that climate change is their fault. Not whilst the rich are flying round the world on luxury holidays. Not whilst people are demanding avocados out of season, etc. Not whilst the only place some people can afford to shop is Primark.

This is one of the wankiest OPs I've ever read. I'm genuinely baffled that you think driving a diesel SUV makes you some kind of lower mortal.

I don't think they actually sell anything in the UK that could be counted as a massive SUV.
They don't even sell my mid-range suv there.

When we were in the UK had owned a small diesel suv it was because we were told diesel was better for the environment and the car met our needs.

It isn't hard to understand why people do things, because they want to and it meets their needs.

Some people will give no thought to emissions, some will give some thought and others will base their decision on it.

Most people probably try and balance out a range of issues from totally personal to global when making decisions. Likely leaning towards personal for most important.

I drive a large SUV, DH has a smaller car. We live in a rural part of Suffolk, at times we swap cars so DH can get to work.

I use my car to tow our caravan, which we use for holidays rather than flying. Instead we holiday in areas where we support the local community in a lower impact environment than huge hotels with all the required energy usage.

I have one child.

I have been vegetarian since 1990. I buy many clothes pre-loved. I shop locally and grow our own vegetables considering eating in season and minimising food miles. We all shower and avoid baths. We have a savings account to work towards a heat pump system.

I assume you can say the same OP?

@VainAbigail

What do you consider to be a “massive SUV”?

Driven by the people who eat MN-sponsored “massive salads”?

Don’t go to the supermarket OP. I weep every time I see an avocado or bunch of asparagus in a trolley. 😭

I feel like you've started this thread to kick off a pile-on but I'll bite.

My SUV is large, and a diesel. I bought it (secondhand) because we needed something comfortable and spacious for extremely long journeys Edinburgh to London, etc that would have enough go and refinement for long motorway drives and also be economical on those long journeys. IMO it is also nice looking and well-equipped.

The dealer had better incentives on the SUV than they did on the equivalent estate car that day, so that's what I bought. When I bought it a few years ago, electric car options weren't as numerous and varied as they are now. A Leaf didn't have the range or the space for what I wanted at the time.

I'm actually open-minded about changing to an electric car now. I would quite like one of those Hyundai Ioniq 5 things that have just come out -- very 80s cool.

But at the moment there's virtually no charging infrastructure around me. The street I live on is protected and the council is dragging its heels about installing street chargers. This is happening city-wide. And I live in a flat in the middle of the city so it's on-street parking only, so no trailing cables out of the window or door. Charging it would just be a great big nuisance.

Also, changing the car for an electric is money that I don't have at the moment. For the kind of car we need I'd struggle to spend less than fifty grand and I don't have fifty grand, either upfront or in the monthlies. I own my current car outright so it costs me nothing besides tax, fuel and maintenance.

I also feel, rightly or wrongly, that I have it now so I might as well keep it until it breaks completely. Repair, reuse, extend the life, etc.

I'm careful about how I use it. Most journeys are city centre, and we walk. Or I bike it. The car gets used for long-distance trips only -- which makes sense because this is where it is most economical.

Swapping it for a new car, even an electric one, feels like just more consumerism to me. I don't need new stuff, there's nothing wrong with my current car. It's reliable and economical. I run it on the cleanest diesel I can get, keep it maintained so that the emissions are well within tolerances. It is EU5 compliant, so I can drive it in central London without paying the ULEZ charge, and (hopefully) in Edinburgh with the forthcoming CAZ which will follow the same rules. So my council, and the council where I lived previously, thought it was green enough. So to my mind, it is.

Would I choose something different if I were buying now? Yes, probably. The era of the big diesel is rapidly disappearing, which is fine. It wasn't when I bought my current car, which is also fine. Things change.

But likewise I don't want to throw away a perfectly good item just because it might not be seen as the greenest thing any more. I will replace it on my timescale.

'I wonder how many people who judge SUV drivers are three-car families and drive to work every day'

No we have a biggish electric car and a small 1L runaround

I see flappy women on the school run who often seem utterly incapable of manoeuvring their big cars and I just think Jesus, why put yourself through it, get something you can actually drive fgs .

People who buy huge SUVs are not known for their eco credentials - other things are generally more important to them.

I see someone driving an SUV.
I don't think "ooh an expensive car, oh they must be really important"
I think "tone deaf dick!"

I'll judge away!!!!

Loving all the "Oh we have an SUV, but we really really need it and we recycle our leftover lettuce so that makes it ok"

I guess when there are nearly 8 billion people in the world denying yourself some luxuries seems like a pointless exercise. One person in the UK choosing not to drive an SUV is just not going to have any impact on anything - and I say that as a non driver. Huge policy change is what is required and finding real solutions to problems - not moving from petrol to diesel or from petrol to electricity. Look how quickly we came up with a vaccine for covid when we really needed it - but often there needs to be a real and huge negative impact on our way of life for these things to happen, or at least to happen quickly.