To argue that this should is not a suitable topic for the Girl Guides

[MovedByFanciesThatAreCurled]

Girlguiding is for girls, aged 10-14. So why then do they feel the need to promote this on their social media?

This week is #AceWeek - a time to raise awareness and understanding of the asexual community. So here’s a shout-out to all of our asexual volunteers and members – thank you for everything you do in Girlguiding.

The reference to ‘members’ is quite clear. What on earth were they thinking in making reference to young girls’ sex lives (or lack of them according to the focus of the Tweet). How, as an organisation, have they strayed so far? I have two boys in the Scouts/Beavers and if this came up on either of their social media pages I would pull them out. Why is it seen to be an acceptable for Girlguiding?!!

Can’t they just talk about the many many many other aspects of life on this planet?

Most 'other aspects of life on this planet' involve casual and barely noticed references to heterosexual norms though.

I'm not sure what's so hugely problematic about the acknowledgement that other ways of being exist.

If my child told me that an adult has discussed sex with them and that it was possible to consent to sex without sexual attraction I would call the police too.

Adults should not discuss sex with children.

What if random colleague John came up to me at the coffee machine and said

“hey Pumpkin, how are you doing? Do you know that it is possible to happily consent to sex without being sexually attracted the potential partner?”

I am not sure what I would do. I would not say “that is so interesting, thank you for telling me”. If John was my boss, I would be quite uncomfortable.

A child should never have this conversation with an adult.

@Franca123

OK I'm out. This asexual thing makes no sense whatsoever. It's completely incoherent. Have your label and have your flag. But keep it away from children.

Bye. Maybe check out asexuality.org if you want to educate yourself.

@WiseUpJanetWeiss

Because asexuality is not about a lack of interest in sex. People may assume that's what it is though.

This is insane. It’s like having a conversation with Humpty Dumpty.

Why has the word “asexual” been redefined? What’s the new word for people who have no sexual desire?

From the actual dictionary

noun
a person who has no sexual feelings or desires, or who is not sexually attracted to anyone.

@PumpkinGin

I have a problem with random adults talking to children and young teens about sex or anything sex related. It crosses a boundary.

I think these discussions should only be had with parents, carers or in the context of PSHE under safeguarding supervision.

An organisation which works with younger people on something completely unconnected to sex should not have it on its social media feed and children as young as 13 (or younger) will be following it. It may lead to a discussion which the adults in the organisation shouldn’t have.

I don’t want to send my children to swimming, orchestra, football or indeed guiding and there having any conversation about sexual identity. I think it is completely inappropriate.

The more children are encouraged to discuss sexual identity and indeed sex with various adults, the more it normalises that. This is something predators will use.

I also believe that many messages get misunderstood by especially younger children. To be honest, I found the suggestion that anyone who lacked sexual attraction still could “be horny” and have sex with people sinister in this context - which is the context children and young teens. I don’t care what any consenting adults do.

Generally speaking I agree with this.

But I do think it’s concerning that young adults will likely have been heavily influenced in their understanding of these things by stonewall dogma also.

I don’t want my girls turning 18 and thinking it’s normal to have no sexual attraction to anyone but still have sex.

If they are 30 and come to their own conclusion that works fine for them, within a healthy relationship or when they are capable of autonomous decisions around consent with sexual encounters, that’s fine. But young adults are hugely vulnerable still, especially if stonewalled by schools growing up (obviously that’s why d of e changed guidance, but it happened for decade+). But like the bbc article about young lesbians feeling uncertain they had the right to say no way to tw ‘female’ penis.

It’s the children at gg this is most risky for, but normalising that message for young adults isn’t healthy either.

@Ozanj sorry, can I confirm? Your daughter had a discussion about female sexuality in her girl guiding session? Aged 10?

@Ozanj

Neice is 10 and she and I had a conversation recently where she feels she might be Asexual because she isn’t attracted to either boys or girls. She has always felt this way but girlguiding just gave her the language and the safe space needed to talk about it. Her leader made it clear that at their age it’s perfectly normal not to find people attractive at her age & it’s ok to be different to her friends & to talk through how she feels with someone she trusts where I came in and I just reiterated the message. I am so grateful they do discuss female sexuality because girls are often totally forgotten or left out of this discussion at school (as it tends to be male centric). .

The reason your 10 year old niece is worried about being asexual is because she is having sexuality forced down her throat at these events and wonders if there is something wrong with her for not being interested. There is nothing wrong with her. She is not “asexual”. She is a prepubescent child!

A child should never have this conversation with an adult.

THEY AREN'T HAVING THIS CONVERSATION.

@TheKeatingFive

Can’t they just talk about the many many many other aspects of life on this planet?

Most 'other aspects of life on this planet' involve casual and barely noticed references to heterosexual norms though.

I'm not sure what's so hugely problematic about the acknowledgement that other ways of being exist.

Nothing problematic about consensual adult sexuality. Just don’t discuss your sexual preferences with children.

I'm out. This whole thread is bad for me. I've been told mentioning my sexuality is grooming and that I'm a safeguarding issue.

Hiding this now.

Also, asexuality has fuck all to do with trans people and fuck all to do with forcing kids to have sex.

@Ozanj

Neice is 10 and she and I had a conversation recently where she feels she might be Asexual because she isn’t attracted to either boys or girls. She has always felt this way but girlguiding just gave her the language and the safe space needed to talk about it. Her leader made it clear that at their age it’s perfectly normal not to find people attractive at her age & it’s ok to be different to her friends & to talk through how she feels with someone she trusts where I came in and I just reiterated the message. I am so grateful they do discuss female sexuality because girls are often totally forgotten or left out of this discussion at school (as it tends to be male centric). .

Wasn't that all of us at 10 as we haven't developed that side of us yet ?

@Franca123

you can give enthusiastic consent without feeling sexual attraction

If anyone said this to my child I would call the police.

Yyyyy

Like pp said if this was a rl discussion many posters would be flagged up as a safeguarding risk based on what’s said here.

@Clymene

Adults who have no formal responsibility for teaching children about sex shouldn't be talking about this stuff, ever.

Teaching children about sex is difficult and complicated and needs extensive training. Girl guide leaders are not those professionals.

So nobody should ever talk to children about sex? Because teachers most definitely do not have "extensive training." Maybe an hour or two from an input group during an inset day 3 years ago. And of course parents/guardians don't have any training at all (although going by some of the responses on here they probably should)

Again - a guide leader (or anyone) going into detail about how she has sex with her partner even though she is asexual and doesn't enjoy it would clearly be inappropriate, in the same way a straight guide leader telling guides that she gives her husband blowjobs even though she doesn't like it because he does would be inappropriate. Nobody has suggested either of those things are actually happening though!

@slashlover

I'm out. This whole thread is bad for me. I've been told mentioning my sexuality is grooming and that I'm a safeguarding issue.

Hiding this now.

Also, asexuality has fuck all to do with trans people and fuck all to do with forcing kids to have sex.

Wilful misunderstanding is a safeguarding issue

Nothing problematic about consensual adult sexuality. Just don’t discuss your sexual preferences with children.

It's not 'discussing sexual preferences' but acknowledging they exist.

Which for heterosexuals happens entirely by default and backed up by every aspect of our society.

@slashlover

A child should never have this conversation with an adult.

THEY AREN'T HAVING THIS CONVERSATION.

Well at least one ten year old has on this thread. Ten. Actual ten.

@YetAnotherSpartacus

Furries are nothing to do with sexuality. Please educate yourself. My son's been a furry for years. It's just a hobby

Furry can absolutely be about sex.

www.webmd.com/sex/what-is-furry-sex

A large majority of our sample reported non-heterosexual identities (84%) and some degree of sexual motivation for being furries (99%). Male furries also tended to report a pattern of sexual interests consistent with an ETII involving anthropomorphic animals. Both sexual attraction to anthropomorphic animals and sexual arousal by fantasizing about being anthropomorphic animals were nearly universal. Furthermore, male furries tended to be sexually aroused by fantasizing about being the same kinds of anthropomorphic animals to whom they were sexually attracted, with respect to gender and species

From

link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-018-1303-7

Plus look up furry porn and some of the chat sites. It absolutely is sexual!

Can be, but is not necessarily, and certainly not in my son's case. It's a form of escapism. And yes I know about furry porn or yiff, and the young teenage furries I know think it's disgusting , and sexualising something that isn't inherently sexual.

Asexuals range from those who have never had sex and don't want to, to those who enjoy the act of sex and are married.

So people, then.

My blood is boiling. A 10 year giving themselves a label because they don't feel sexual attraction to anyone? It is not OK to have this conversation with a child. What the fuck has happened since I was a child? When i did brownies we ran around the church hall and the field at the back screaming. We didn't talk to adults about who we were or werent sexually attracted to.

If I talked to a random child and said that I enjoyed having regular sex with my husband a few times a week, I would be a safe guarding red flag.

The problem is not any sexuality or identity l. The problem is having this conversation with children in the first place.

I fear I’m probably missing the point but from some of the descriptions given I still don’t really get how this is different from adults (either heterosexual, bisexual or homosexual) who need to be in love (or at least feel a strong emotional connection to someone) to enjoy sex. Which is quite a lot of people. Should they all be classed as asexual?

@MolkosTeenageAngst

You’ll find the definitions schools use for heterosexual homosexual bisexual include being emotionally or sexually or romantically attracted - so if asexual people are feeling romantic attraction to a potential partner they will be heterosexual homosexual or bisexual, not asexual.

@slashlover

I'm out. This whole thread is bad for me. I've been told mentioning my sexuality is grooming and that I'm a safeguarding issue.

Hiding this now.

Also, asexuality has fuck all to do with trans people and fuck all to do with forcing kids to have sex.

The reason you feel like this is because as with many groups you are just way OTT . You demand and you play with words and you try to force people to think as you do but sorry it doesn't work like that in real life . I said way back on this thread that people really don't give a shit about what others get up to in their own private life BUT you want it all out there in the public . I have seen it said on this thread about heterosexuals celebrating marriage , birth of children etc and that this is wrong or offensive to others who are not . WTF ! I thought I had seen a load of crap but this thread really has taken the biscuit . If you push and you prod you will get bitten .

I know a small number of people who have never had a relationship as far as I know. And have never expressed any interest whatsoever in that side of life. We used to call them people.