To argue that this should is not a suitable topic for the Girl Guides

[MovedByFanciesThatAreCurled]

Girlguiding is for girls, aged 10-14. So why then do they feel the need to promote this on their social media?

This week is #AceWeek - a time to raise awareness and understanding of the asexual community. So here’s a shout-out to all of our asexual volunteers and members – thank you for everything you do in Girlguiding.

The reference to ‘members’ is quite clear. What on earth were they thinking in making reference to young girls’ sex lives (or lack of them according to the focus of the Tweet). How, as an organisation, have they strayed so far? I have two boys in the Scouts/Beavers and if this came up on either of their social media pages I would pull them out. Why is it seen to be an acceptable for Girlguiding?!!

@ThinWomansBrain

from some of the ignorant twattish posts on here you'd think GG had tweeted "lets celebrate paedophilia week, big shout out to all our paedophile members"

The problem is it all smells a bit like welcoming unsavoury types when taken with the fact that they disable replies and then followed up with

Earlier this year we launched our new diversity and inclusion strategic plan so Girlguiding can be a place where everyone feels welcome, free to be themselves and has an equal sense of belonging. Please be respectful whilst communicating on our social media pages.

We know that for GG ‘everyone is welcome to be themselves’ means allowing males to share sleeping accommodation with girls without parental knowledge.

Is it a surprise that concerned parents are reacting to the ‘ACE week’ tweet in the way they are?

The thing is, the Girl Guides is absolutely the wrong place to teach girls about sex and sexuality. It's mixed age groups, volunteer-led and this is not in any way it's area of expertise. If real issues arose they would not be equipped to deal in the same way a school would.

It's just uncomfortable, ill thought out woke signalling which, along with their gender identity ideology stance, is very concerning!

@Whatwouldscullydoplease read the posts from actual leaders. No where is this a subject that is ‘taught’ at meetings or anything like that

Girl guides fired two leaders who spoke up about safeguarding so excuse us fir not having much idn the way of trust in those who are left.

‘Fired’ is not actually correct

It’s not a paid role for one thing

@Flapjak

I am just trying to get my head round the idea that being asexual means you might want to have sex with someone you are not sexually attracted to. How can you be asexual and have sexual arousal for others? If its not for others then it really is fucked up to want to have sex woth someone you dont have any sexual urges for. Its a bit likr saying you are a lesbian but may want to have sex with men even though you arent sexually attracted to them. Its all a bit queer theory and blurring of boundaries in that everything means absolutely anything you want it to mean from an individual perspective and is a form of gaslighting

Asexual people can be in love with their partner, asexual people can get horny, asexual people can enjoy sex with their partner.

Not so much uncomfortable, but why does anyone who is asexual want others to know or care?

This is such a bigoted attitude and it comes up on every single thread about sexuality. It’s the implication that you can be any sexuality you like as long as you don’t make it public in any way. It’s ‘be gay / lesbian / asexual if you like, but stay in the closet so I don’t have to think about it’.

Funnily enough it’s NEVER expected of heterosexuals. No heterosexual has ever wanted to talk about their relationship and been met with ‘why do you even want people to know you’re heterosexual?’ Or ‘it’s fine for you to love who you like but why is it so important to you that other people know who you want to sleep with?’.

DO BETTER. This is pure bigotry, thinly disguised as acceptance, and it’s shit.

@RhymesWithOrange

The thing is, the Girl Guides is absolutely the wrong place to teach girls about sex and sexuality. It's mixed age groups, volunteer-led and this is not in any way it's area of expertise. If real issues arose they would not be equipped to deal in the same way a school would.

It's just uncomfortable, ill thought out woke signalling which, along with their gender identity ideology stance, is very concerning!

Totally agree.

For anyone who is not aware, and apologies if already posted, GG welcome boys and men into the fold if they say they are girls and women:

www.girlguiding.org.uk/making-guiding-happen/running-your-unit/including-all/supporting-trans-members/

@ThinWomansBrain

from some of the ignorant twattish posts on here you'd think GG had tweeted "lets celebrate paedophilia week, big shout out to all our paedophile members"

Absolutely - all the "concerned parents" bullshit smacks of section 28 hysteria again. Lots of people have it in for GG because they're not transphobic so I think you have to take all this 'concern' with a pinch of salt.



This was not posted by the Guides but it's useful to help understand what asexual looks like

@SusannaRowan

Surely what we should be teaching teens is that actually you don’t need to feel ‘crushed’ if you are asexual and that actually it’s a legitimate orientation. That way those who are genuinely asexual are being supported and those who will just take longer to discover their orientation aren’t losing anything because the focus is not on making it a bad thing people need to feel sadness or shame over, which is how your post makes it sound?

I'm sorry you've had such a difficult time and I partly agree with you. Of course being asexual shouldn't be viewed as shameful. I'm really just arguing over the semantics of age.

You say you desperately tried to fit in and are damaged because of this, but would knowing about asexuality sooner at say age 12 have helped you? Or would you still have wanted to fit in with most of your peers. We are both taking from our own experiences and mine would have been that I very much wanted to be attracted to people, have sex, a life partner and children (when I was older). Whilst obviously I know you can do all those things as an asexual person, it just seems so much harder and I know that's not how I wanted to be. As a teen whilst I felt out of step, I had hope that I would grow into attraction (and I did).
Teens are very set in stone about their sexuality and gender, how does a teen know that they will the asexual person that grows out of it? It would be offensive to suggest people grow out of homosexuality and asexuality is viewed the same way, but it isn't the same because we all start out asexual.

Yes you’re right, I probably would have still wanted to fit in. I have a schoolfriend who is gay and didn’t come out until she was 17, she knew from much younger but also wanted to be straight because she wanted a family, she was desperately trying to be straight and had boyfriends all through school. It was no doubt damaging to her and like me she now lives with poor mental health. I definitely don’t think teaching that asexuality is okay and normal will stop anybody feeling shame about it or trying to hide it or play it straight to fit in, just as knowing about being fat didn’t stop my friend from doing those things.

That said, she was at least able to come out in her late teens. I didn’t even know asexuality existed until a few years ago, in my thirties. I spent my late teens and my twenties still trying to straight pass, still thinking I was broken and defective because I didn’t realise anybody else was like me. I wish there had been some discussion of asexuality when I was younger so that I could have come to understand it when I was much younger, I agree that being asexual may be harder than being straight but I don’t think it would have been as hard as it is now if I had known about it sooner. I also think it would have been easier to ‘come out’ if I hadn’t spent years playing it straight, it feels like it would be hard to admit I am asexual to many people in my life considering I was so promiscuous in my late teens and early twenties, how would I explain I hated every sexual encounter and was trying to cure myself of a defect I thought I had?

I appreciate we all start asexual and that as such some teens who might identify as asexual might actually just be taking longer to reach that stage snd will ‘grow out of it’ as such, but to be honest whether they are asexual or just late to develop when it comes to wanting to fit in I’m not sure they would feel that different? If anything knowing that feeling no sexual attraction can be normal is surely going to be helpful in stating why you might not feel attracted to anybody regardless of whether it will be a permanent or temporary state for that person? It can surely help to be able to articulate why you’re not seeking a boy/girlfriend at the same time as your peers, even if that changes in the future. And I assume when you feel sexual attraction towards someone it is obvious and in that case their newfound sexual orientation would also be obvious? I don’t imagine straight/ gay etc people are going to think they are asexual into adulthood just because the feelings came later because my understanding is the feelings you get with sexual attraction are obvious?

Maybe I am biased but I think that the difficulties arising for asexual people from never expressing that what they feel is okay are greater than those that might arise from a non-asexual person temporarily thinking they may identify in that way and I think that ultimately teaching teens it’s okay not to feel sexual attraction to others is only going to help teens who feel like that, regardless of whether it will be a lifelong sexual orientation for them.

Photo didn't load, sorry. Looks like something I'm keen for my DDs to discuss...

My DD is a guide. She is 12 and has known about asexuality for at least a year. They talk about it at school all the time. She knows more than I do! You are entitled to be unhappy about it being introduced at guides but I am very happy.

Not transphobic?

Their first idea was to manage out any girls who identified as boys.

And they dont even tell parents their daughters could be sharing with someone male.

I.doubt as many peope would be happy with that as you think.

It’s the implication that you can be any sexuality you like as long as you don’t make it public in any way

It’s all just a bit too much information though, isn’t it? It seems for someone to be asexual they can still be in a loving sexual relationship so to know they are asexual they need to tell you how they don’t feel sexual desire for anyone.

I don’t inform my work colleagues about the strength of my sexual desire for my husband, bigot that I obviously am!

@RhymesWithOrange yep totally agree.
Funny how my experience as a guide leader has been discounted because it doesn't fit the narrative.
I have firsthand experience of how barebones the training is. Which would be fine, if GG recognised their limits and stuck to their remit.
Thing is, when something does happen because of the safeguarding mistakes GG is making, and it will happen, because predators specifically look for loopholes and GG are creating them, the organisation will blame the young leaders and volunteers and not take ownership that it is the policy that creates the opportunity.

Someone saying "I'm asexual" is no different to someone saying "I have a husband".

I can't ever remember a context in any youth group I ever attended where that came up. Spouses sometimes appeared at camps alongside other parents serving us breakfast but as kids we didn't really know more than their first names, and which kids in the group were theirs.

I'm really struggling with the concept of asexuality. How can a person who is asexual, which I understood to be absence of the feeling of attraction to another person, get 'horny' with another person and enjoy sex with another person?

I just don't understand how that isn't what everyone is like. Absence of sexual attraction until you find someone you are attracted to?

What am I missing here?

Funnily enough it’s NEVER expected of heterosexuals.

It's really important for homosexuality to be talked about because it is discriminated against in lots of ways and in order to fight against discrimination you have to name the issues and the fight is far from over. It's a similar reason to why lots of women are fighting for the word woman. If we cannot name the reason for our oppression we cannot fight against it.

Why is it inappropriate to let asexual people know it’s ok to be asexual? The same as it’s ok to be gay or straight or anything else.
I wish ace week had been a thing when I was a teenager, it would have saved me years of thinking there was something wrong with me that I had no sexual attraction to anyone. I knew by 11 or 12 that the way I felt was different to my friends, but I thought I was a freak.

@nolongersurprised

It’s the implication that you can be any sexuality you like as long as you don’t make it public in any way

It’s all just a bit too much information though, isn’t it? It seems for someone to be asexual they can still be in a loving sexual relationship so to know they are asexual they need to tell you how they don’t feel sexual desire for anyone.

I don’t inform my work colleagues about the strength of my sexual desire for my husband, bigot that I obviously am!

I'm a 43 year old virgin who has been single since one date at the age of 16.

I'm really struggling with the concept of asexuality. How can a person who is asexual, which I understood to be absence of the feeling of attraction to another person, get 'horny' with another person and enjoy sex with another person?

Because libido and sexuality are different.

@lifeturnsonadime

I'm really struggling with the concept of asexuality. How can a person who is asexual, which I understood to be absence of the feeling of attraction to another person, get 'horny' with another person and enjoy sex with another person?

I just don't understand how that isn't what everyone is like. Absence of sexual attraction until you find someone you are attracted to?

What am I missing here?

The analogy that is often used is you don’t have to be hungry to enjoy food. For me I have no desire to have sex, when I’m single (which I choose to be most of the time) I don’t think about sex, I don’t want to have sex, I don’t masterbate, I just don’t have any interest. But I have had sex that I enjoyed at the time, I just don’t crave or thing about it otherwise.

Asexuality is a spextrum really, there are those who are actively repulsed by sex at one end, those who are indifferent to sex in the middle and those who enjoy it in the moment but don’t feel sexual attraction at the other.
There is also a difference in being asexual (as in not feeling sexual attraction) and aromantic which is not feeling romantic feelings. For me I like the idea of being in a relationship, but I don’t care if I never have sex.

slashlover I don't know whether it is because I'm hungover from a halloween party but can you explain what you mean?

Are you saying that when an asexual person has sex with another person it is because they want sex not because they are sexually attracted to the person they are having sex with? How is that a sexuality?

I'm just really trying to understand. I can understand that it is a sexuality to not feel attracted to anyone and that it is helpful for people to understand that from a young age so they don't feel othered but I'm struggling to understand how an asexual person can then go on to have a sexual relationship when they don't feel sexual attraction?

@Flapjak

I am just trying to get my head round the idea that being asexual means you might want to have sex with someone you are not sexually attracted to. How can you be asexual and have sexual arousal for others? If its not for others then it really is fucked up to want to have sex woth someone you dont have any sexual urges for. Its a bit likr saying you are a lesbian but may want to have sex with men even though you arent sexually attracted to them. Its all a bit queer theory and blurring of boundaries in that everything means absolutely anything you want it to mean from an individual perspective and is a form of gaslighting

I’m asexual and I don’t want or like sex or masturbation. I don’t have a sexual drive with myself or others, i have never had an orgasm. Sex just isn’t part of my life although it was when I was younger as I tried to fit in but It was never anything other than excruciating for me. I do quite like the feeling of kissing but that is as far in terms of being intimate as I have ever really enjoyed.

But that said from a purely logical perspective I can understand how a person can have sex with another person without sexual attraction. Without wanting to be crude very few women are sexually attracted to vibrators/ dildos etc but when horny many women can still enjoy stimulating sexual activity with them, the act of stimulating their genitals can still feel pleasurable without that sexual orientation there. For a horny asexual person with a sex drive I can assume that they can have enthusiastic, consensual sex with a person they don’t feel sexual attraction to in the same way, because they still have a sex drive and the mechanics of pleasure still work, plus often they may feel romantic attraction/ love towards the person they are having sex with which means they can enjoy being intimate even if that ‘I am so sexually attracted to you I want to rip all your clothes off’ feeling isn’t there. It definitely doesn’t mean having non-consensual or unenjoyable sex, but just that the motivations behind the sex may be different.

Obviously got the record I am not saying that any of these intricacies of how an asexual person may or may not choose to have sex should be taught to teens, just as hopefully nobody teaches the intricacies of straight/ gay etc sex lives to teens beyond that sex should always be safe and consensual. I am just trying to explain something I think people have managed to misconstrue into meaning asexual people will have unenjoyable and unwanted sex and that this is a key facet of it, because it absolutely isn’t.

I'm a 43 year old virgin who has been single since one date at the age of 16

Which is I think how most people understand the concept of asexuality. So in a workplace environment it would be helpful to use that term to describe your perpetual single ness. In the same way Tom brings his boyfriend Mark to the Christmas work do, because Tom is gay.

But other posters saying that asexual people can be in loving relationships and have frequent, enjoyable sex yet still be asexual and their sexuality should be recognised as such in the workplace. The only way of them telling you this is by describing their desire, or lack of, to others. I don’t want to hear about my work colleagues’ sexual arousal.