Page 8 | Shocked at how terrible the NHS is nowadays

ConfusedBoobs · 2021-10-29T18:13:35+00:00

I had a mammogram a month ago that showed I have calcifications that they don't think are cancer but they won't know for sure until after I've had a biopsy. Today I found out that the biopsy can't be prioritised as urgent and so will still be another month away. AIBU to think it's terrible to leave people in limbo like this?

anon12345678901 · 30/10/2021 08:15

@gcgirlsrock

It annoys me when people immediately blame the government. We are pumping billions and billions into the NHS constantly. The issue is that it is a broken model and needs to be drastically reduced - it was never intended to be all things to all people. Some serious public debates need to happen to decide how we will move on with an ageing society and so many in the country using the system. The backlog was caused by Covid, but the problems were there before.

This. The NHS can be criticised. It's a broken model that is not fit for purpose at the moment. Looking to how other European countries run their healthcare would be a start.

3luckystars · 30/10/2021 08:16

I think there is the makings of a tv programme about this. There seems to be a huge amount of waste.
Surely there is a solution to it.

What if there was just a small charge on the GP, would that mean people would show up for appointments?

I think it being ‘free’ is a double edged sword, it means certain people waste resources, while others who need medical help don’t want to overburden the system any more.

Peaseblossum22 · 30/10/2021 08:19

www.onthebox.com/television/preview-clapped-out-is-the-nhs-broken-dispatches/

Sorry can’t seem to copy the direct C4 link but it’s on catch up

holidaynearlyover · 30/10/2021 08:21

@julieca

And all the public health campaigns about going to the GP with blood in your poo, for smears, etc all show that plenty of people don't go to the Dr for things they should. Those campaigns are run precisely because people are not going.

I agree that people don't go for what they should. I'm trying to get seen as I've a dodgy mole, so I've completed an econsult, I've had to chase it as no one got back to me, I then was told I'd get a phone call from the dr. I actually got a text telling me to send in another photo. It's on my back so I haven't taken another photo yet as haven't had the chance. This is now 3 weeks on.

I think you are very lucky where you live, where I am people are not being seen even at the GP so people are giving up.

You can't phone to get through and if you don't tick the correct box on the econsult it doesn't work. Sometimes people are waiting 4 days for a dr to get back to them. The econsult can only be completed during surgery hours so yet another stumbling block as if you are at work it's a pain to find the time for the lengthy form.

I've had enough of being ignored

Confiscatedpopit · 30/10/2021 08:25

Why on earth would you say ‘go private’ to someone in response to this post?

People aren’t thick, they know this is an option. Financial circumstances are the deciding factor for most.

The NHS has been shit for years. Unpopular opinion I know but it’s ridiculously bad at times. It needs a complete overhaul from top to bottom starting with its communication and ways of communicating with each other/ other hospitals. In every department I’ve seen there seems to be one person clearly working their backside off- many seem to be along for the easy ride. Time to get rid of the crap and simplify it.

anon12345678901 · 30/10/2021 08:27

@3luckystars

I think there is the makings of a tv programme about this. There seems to be a huge amount of waste. Surely there is a solution to it.

What if there was just a small charge on the GP, would that mean people would show up for appointments?

I think it being ‘free’ is a double edged sword, it means certain people waste resources, while others who need medical help don’t want to overburden the system any more.

That's a good point. The amount of missed appointments in the NHS, because people aren't seeing it come out of their pocket, it doesn't matter. In 2020, the missed appointments cost came to around £300m. If people had to pay a small fee, I bet they wouldn't miss them.

Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds · 30/10/2021 08:32

@Confiscatedpopit

Why on earth would you say ‘go private’ to someone in response to this post?

People aren’t thick, they know this is an option. Financial circumstances are the deciding factor for most.

The NHS has been shit for years. Unpopular opinion I know but it’s ridiculously bad at times. It needs a complete overhaul from top to bottom starting with its communication and ways of communicating with each other/ other hospitals. In every department I’ve seen there seems to be one person clearly working their backside off- many seem to be along for the easy ride. Time to get rid of the crap and simplify it.

Even when on a full time income of substantially less that £20K I put away money each month for dental/medical costs. Even if was £5 a month. Many people in this country are described as poor but in fact just choose to prioritise other things. (Speaking generally here not referring to OP as I have no idea what her circumstances are)

OrangeSamphire · 30/10/2021 08:33

@MalteserGeezee

I'm sick of the NHS being the sacred cow that must never be criticised. Too many people have a truly shit experience with it. There are many disinterested, badly trained staff. Hospitals are grim environments. Woe betide those who cannot stamp their feet and complain loudly enough to be seen. I am so sorry for you. I'm sick of being made to feel "grateful" for whatever care it can spare. Literally nobody is recommending a US-style system, but let's look to our European neighbors for inspiration about how a well-run, correctly funded, actually-there-reliably-when-you-need-it health service looks like. Happy to pay more, in exchange for actual customer service and treatment. We need to be able to have an honest conversation about the health service modern society wants, needs and deserves.

Totally agree with this.

The NHS has become inward looking, paternalistic, politically toxic (from within itself as well as from Westminster) and after our last few encounters with it as a family I’d also say it’s become dangerously anti-patient / anti-parent/carer.

It is as culturally sick as it is financially.

Those able and willing to provide good quality care in the NHS now seem fewer and further in between the rot.

EnidFrighten · 30/10/2021 08:41

A reminder that the Tories spent an amount equivalent to 25% of the NHS budget on test and trace, in return for zilch.

anon12345678901 · 30/10/2021 08:47

@EnidFrighten

A reminder that the Tories spent an amount equivalent to 25% of the NHS budget on test and trace, in return for zilch.

Does that mean the NHS can't be criticised? No it really doesn't. The criticisms are still valid.

MondayYogurt · 30/10/2021 08:53

Watched a video recently by a woman in Japan who couldn't get a biopsy for suspected cancer, went home to Canada and same situation. Had to fly to Florida in the end.
It's not just UK.

Diditreallylookawful · 30/10/2021 09:03

The NHS have been wonderful for my family! DC had a tumour removed last year - fantastic and reasonably quick treatment. My elderly mum has been seen for several thongs, and I've had smears etc when needed. Maybe it's just down to postcode?

3luckystars · 30/10/2021 09:10

@Peaseblossum22 thank you

MamanSparkles · 30/10/2021 09:25

My friend collapsed with an allergic reaction last week. The ambulance wait for someone unconscious was 16 hours. After 2 hours the ambulance station called back and tried to persuade her mum to cancel the ambulance. She could easily have died in that time! Thankfully she was ok.
I have family in France. Their healthcare system is nationalised, with a small top up payment system for those who can afford it and completely free for those on low incomes. Care is outstanding and efficient. We need to be looking to European countries and their systems. That means reorganising, funding better and accepting small payments for e.g. GP services for those who can afford it, as we do with prescriptions. It doesn't mean privatising but it does mean reforming.

BigWoollyJumpers · 30/10/2021 09:31

@Peaseblossum22

There was a very good documentary on the NHS by Matthew Syed last week it’s really worth a watch. One of the biggest problems he contends is that the NHS as an organisation always prioritises itself , systems are built which are best for the NHS . In contrast for example the Dutch system is based on patient centred care,(I am talking here about systemic care not the individual care givers ) .

Ultimately the NHS has become so big that there are so many vested interests that change has become almost impossible . But it’s not working, as someone currently wrestling with the care of 5 older people it’s a nightmare , all the parties are doing their best but they are constrained by the inability of the wider organisation to respond with any degree of nimbleness at all.

This.

DH way back when, started out working for NHS non clinical. He left and became the much vilified private consultant. He has spent his life trying to encourage the NHS to put patients first. Each and every time he is met with blank stares and silence. While the NHS continues to serve itself rather than patients nothing will change.

As a ps. He also has quite a lot of governmental contact. Not one of any of the MP's of any party, or departments he has worked with on cross part committees, want to dismantle or privatise the NHS. It just won't happen. But by God, does it need reform.

Hopeisallineed · 30/10/2021 09:33

But privatisation of some parts of the NHS is already happening @BigWoollyJumpers and has been for some time.

Changechangychange · 30/10/2021 09:43

It is failing because it does not provide adequate care. People will not pay more so another solution must be found.

There isn’t a solution that provides universal healthcare for less per capita than we are currently spending. Please point to a system in a developed country which manages this - you can’t. They all spend more than us, often significantly more.

As I say, I would be quite happy with a switch to a European-style universal insurance system. But it will cost more than currently, and the care/waiting times will be exactly the same unless we employ significantly more doctors and nurses/open more beds.

Canadian wait times are ridiculous compared to the UK - they have a staffing issue not a funding issue.

Igfdyjxzyjkv · 30/10/2021 09:47

@Changechangychange

It is failing because it does not provide adequate care. People will not pay more so another solution must be found.

There isn’t a solution that provides universal healthcare for less per capita than we are currently spending. Please point to a system in a developed country which manages this - you can’t. They all spend more than us, often significantly more.

As I say, I would be quite happy with a switch to a European-style universal insurance system. But it will cost more than currently, and the care/waiting times will be exactly the same unless we employ significantly more doctors and nurses/open more beds.

Canadian wait times are ridiculous compared to the UK - they have a staffing issue not a funding issue.

Australia

Igfdyjxzyjkv · 30/10/2021 09:49

@EnidFrighten

A reminder that the Tories spent an amount equivalent to 25% of the NHS budget on test and trace, in return for zilch.

God forbid where we would be if Labour had been in power.

Hopeisallineed · 30/10/2021 09:51

….With a better NHS probably

Igfdyjxzyjkv · 30/10/2021 09:54

@Hopeisallineed

….With a better NHS probably

I highly doubt it. They are unelectable (and I say this as a life long Labour voter)

Hopeisallineed · 30/10/2021 09:55

We will never know though so statements like yours are meaningless and not helpful.

Hopeisallineed · 30/10/2021 09:56

Personally I honestly think it can’t be any worse than it is now with Johnson, I hate what he is doing.

landroverplum · 30/10/2021 09:59

It's not totally down to serious underfunding it's also down to serious inefficiencies that should and could be corrected. Even those within the system get frustrated.

I went for an appointment because one of my legs had lost all feeling on the front.
I saw an 'old school' doctor she was so concerned I had a stroke she cleared out her appointments have me a thorough seeing to and told me she's referring me urgently to the stroke department but explained that in the NHS urgent meant two weeks and I could be dead by that time. I must find a way to go private because she couldn't reassure me otherwise and I could see she was genuinely terrified I would die because of the rubbish system.

I'm sorry you're going through this OP. If you can find a way to go private it would help put your mind at rest. It isn't right at all though.

Igfdyjxzyjkv · 30/10/2021 10:02

@Hopeisallineed

Personally I honestly think it can’t be any worse than it is now with Johnson, I hate what he is doing.

In my view and the view of many Labour voters I know, we are better with what we have. There is no viable alternative. Corbyn alienated everyone who could get Labour in power, and his effects are still being felt. They need to sort themselves out because voters may never come back. Anyway, back to the NHS…