Shocked at how terrible the NHS is nowadays

[ConfusedBoobs]

I had a mammogram a month ago that showed I have calcifications that they don't think are cancer but they won't know for sure until after I've had a biopsy. Today I found out that the biopsy can't be prioritised as urgent and so will still be another month away. AIBU to think it's terrible to leave people in limbo like this?

Alot of these issues are simply caused by lack of staff.

Why is there a lack of staff?
Pay and working conditions.

After the threads recently with people begrudging NHS workers a pay rise. I don't think people are willing to pay more.

It's shocking !! I've been paying private for the last year because I can't get through to the NHS so if we went to a part funded system I would probably be better off. There's not only the USA systems people keep bleating on about theres Australia, NZ France and Singapore which are all really good.

My DD became ill over there a few years back so GM whos a Singaporean citizen took her to the hospital zero waiting time seen straightway, cost 20 dollars the equivalent of £10 our NHS people worship the NHS when it's in fact pretty rubbish for a lot of things including primary care and chronic diseases management.

@NCForthisxox yes people with private health insurance would be better off if we moved to an insurance system. It would benefit the rich and disadvantage the poor.

@NCForthisxox

It's shocking !! I've been paying private for the last year because I can't get through to the NHS so if we went to a part funded system I would probably be better off. There's not only the USA systems people keep bleating on about theres Australia, NZ France and Singapore which are all really good.

My DD became ill over there a few years back so GM whos a Singaporean citizen took her to the hospital zero waiting time seen straightway, cost 20 dollars the equivalent of £10 our NHS people worship the NHS when it's in fact pretty rubbish for a lot of things including primary care and chronic diseases management.

Yep so frustrating that people only reference the US as an alternative. We have lived in 2 other countries previously including Singapore and experienced much better care. In Singapore, after going to my gp with a breast lump I was sent to a specialist, diagnosed with a milk cyst and had it drained all within 3hours of seeing my GP. I benefited from company health insurance but likewise local Singaporeans benefited from a well run, funded and organised health system with plenty of choice.

The NHS is under immense strain and threat of attack of being privatised.
I am sorry you are having an anxious wait but surely that is better than no NHS at all?

@NCForthisxox Singapore is a tax haven that benefits rich people.
Singapore health system is quoted by some as an example without explaining how it works. The government keeps costs low by setting maximum salaries for health care workers and bulk purchasing drugs to keep costs low. It is a very heavily regulated system.
In our semi privatised NHS there is nobody setting maximum salaries.

@ChocolateDeficitDisorder

Go private - I wish there was a way to stop paying for the NHS

And if you can't afford private...what then?

Subsidised private health insurance

@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds yeah you die younger. That is what happens.

[quote julieca]@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds yeah you die younger. That is what happens.[/quote]
Not sure what you are getting at?

I am getting at the fact you pay more for your healthcare and don't get appointments because you cant afford good insurance or afford the co pay.
Insurance always has co pays.

But the current government's main aim seems to be to give money to rich friends and party donors.

[quote julieca]@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds yeah you die younger. That is what happens.[/quote]
I don’t think it helps anyone - rich or poor - to keep a system that is failing. The outcomes in the NHS are shockingly poor - people should pay for private insurance if they can and be given tax exemptions for doing so. People who cannot afford it should be subsidised to get it. Making everyone pour money into the current system and still pay for private is just ludicrous.

@julieca

I am getting at the fact you pay more for your healthcare and don't get appointments because you cant afford good insurance or afford the co pay. Insurance always has co pays.

Yes and they can be very low. The expectation that healthcare should be free for all is outdated and unrealistic. We maintain this so called ideal while the waiting times get longer and longer. With the population we have and the demands on the system we need to see healthcare as something that worked for a time but no longer. And the fact of the matter is that is there is a co pay system it is less likely to be abused.

@julieca

I am getting at the fact you pay more for your healthcare and don't get appointments because you cant afford good insurance or afford the co pay. Insurance always has co pays.

And no one is getting appointments now anyway! Referral times are just appalling.

No the NHS is chronically underfunded. We pay way less than most other countries. Canada pays four times more per person for their health system. Why do you expect an incredibly underfunded system to deliver best care in the world?
And we all know what not being able to afford means. It would mean those on incredibly low incomes. For anyone working it would mean we pay way more, while rich people pay less.
Taxation is much fairer. Increase taxes and allow immigration for medical staff.
The middle-class and rich people will do well. Everyone else will be worse off and not be able to access much healthcare.
It sounds like you are well off so you will not understand what life is like for most of us.
The vaccine rollout went so well in the UK because of the NHS.

@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds I and my family have been getting appointments and surgery. And you use private healthcare. What the hell do you know about using the NHS!!!

@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds You dont understand things at all, your ignorance is showing. Saying a co pay system means health services are less likely to be abused.
I partly care for a relative who works with serious mental health problems. It is difficult to get him to go to the Dr anyway, co pay would make it way harder. My dad like many older men wont go to the Dr with new things and needs lots of persuading. Co pay would mean he would go less.
Personally, I go to the Dr when I need to, not for every tiny thing. I also have a serious health problem. I would just go to A and E for free treatment rather than co pay.
Co paying would be about rationing healthcare to those who can easily afford it.

And all the public health campaigns about going to the GP with blood in your poo, for smears, etc all show that plenty of people don't go to the Dr for things they should. Those campaigns are run precisely because people are not going.

@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds why do you think the NHS is failing? Do you think the French system might also “fail” if its funding was halved? Would the Canadian system “fail” if its funding was cut to 25% of current spending? What would the German system be like with 1/3 of the doctors?

I personally don’t care how healthcare is funded. I’ve worked in both systems, they both have advantages and disadvantages (there are some very perverse incentives in the Canadian system due to the billing system).

No system will work if it is starved of funds, and chronically understaffed. Look at the number of ICU beds we have in the UK compared with other EU countries. Look how many specialists. That is the problem, not the specifics of how money is redistributed from taxpayer to healthcare system.

@julieca

I am getting at the fact you pay more for your healthcare and don't get appointments because you cant afford good insurance or afford the co pay. Insurance always has co pays.

The insurance my family has in the US doesn’t have copays, it has a high deductible for any type of appointment not covered by the insurance-so annual physicals for all of us, vaccinations, an annual mammogram and gyn visit for me, gyn for DD are completely covered. Anything else comes under the deductible until we reach a certain threshold.

I’m a huge fan of the type of universal healthcare offered by the NHS ( I grew up in the UK) but I will say that I make sure I’m getting everything I’m entitled to now that I’m paying for it-we never miss our annual physicals, I’d never skip my smear test or mammogram. We also certainly don’t abuse the system, e.g., do something daft like binge drink until We pass out, because we’ll be presented with a bill afterwards!

So having lived under two different systems, I personally think that a certain amount of accountability isn’t a bad thing-but I believe in universal healthcare.

[quote julieca]@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds You dont understand things at all, your ignorance is showing. Saying a co pay system means health services are less likely to be abused.
I partly care for a relative who works with serious mental health problems. It is difficult to get him to go to the Dr anyway, co pay would make it way harder. My dad like many older men wont go to the Dr with new things and needs lots of persuading. Co pay would mean he would go less.
Personally, I go to the Dr when I need to, not for every tiny thing. I also have a serious health problem. I would just go to A and E for free treatment rather than co pay.
Co paying would be about rationing healthcare to those who can easily afford it.[/quote]
Your examples are not applicable to the vast majority of people

[quote Changechangychange]@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds why do you think the NHS is failing? Do you think the French system might also “fail” if its funding was halved? Would the Canadian system “fail” if its funding was cut to 25% of current spending? What would the German system be like with 1/3 of the doctors?

I personally don’t care how healthcare is funded. I’ve worked in both systems, they both have advantages and disadvantages (there are some very perverse incentives in the Canadian system due to the billing system).

No system will work if it is starved of funds, and chronically understaffed. Look at the number of ICU beds we have in the UK compared with other EU countries. Look how many specialists. That is the problem, not the specifics of how money is redistributed from taxpayer to healthcare system.[/quote]
It is failing because it does not provide adequate care. People will not pay more so another solution must be found.

[quote julieca]@Dhcfisssifjrsnxfjds I and my family have been getting appointments and surgery. And you use private healthcare. What the hell do you know about using the NHS!!![/quote]
Why do you assume I don’t use the NHS? The waiting times have been utterly disgraceful.

@NCForthisxox my grandma is Singaporean, and she got a stroke. She had health insurance (my dad paid for her for years) but her month long stay in the hospital still cost us the equivalent of £5000 after insurance and all the subsidies. Its cheaper than America and maybe she would have gotten more subsidies if we didn't live in private housing (as subsidies are means-tested based on the type of housing you live in and your household income) but most singaporeans would expect to pay thousands out of pocket if they have a health condition; but we are lucky its not tens of thousands. There is a medical savings account that you have to make mandatory contributions to and mandatory insurance and also the government would pay for the truly poor people, but healthcare is something most Singaporeans budget for in a way that is alien to Britons.

@bunanarama it is very quick, my dad had an abscess operation and they arranged an operation on the same day (this was in a public hospital). My abscess operation on the NHS took 4 days despite being prioritized as 'urgent' and this was in 2017. I had 3 aunts and uncles who recovered from cancer using the public health system (including an aunt who was stage 3) so it is definitely fit for purpose

@julieca but 60% of Singaporeans don't pay any tax? It is friendly to rich people cos top rate of income tax is only 20% but at the same time, the middle class also don't pay tax. The Singapore government derives most of its income through sale of land (owns 90%) as land in Singapore is extremely expensive given the scarcity of land. 85% of Singaporeans also purchase their apartments from the government (92% home ownership rate) so there is a steady stream of income there. Most small countries wind up as tax havens because we need to attract foreign investment and the population is small enough that the government can afford to fund public services without charging high taxes.

I'm sorry you're in that situation. It's horrid and stressful while you are waiting.

I don't know where you are OP but I was recalled for a biopsy on Sept 2nd, seen on Sept 3rd, results on Sept 16th and op on the 29th. They were brilliant.

Maybe they are seeing more worrying cases first. It sounds like it. Take some comfort from that.

I hope it all goes ok xx