Shocked at how terrible the NHS is nowadays

[ConfusedBoobs]

I had a mammogram a month ago that showed I have calcifications that they don't think are cancer but they won't know for sure until after I've had a biopsy. Today I found out that the biopsy can't be prioritised as urgent and so will still be another month away. AIBU to think it's terrible to leave people in limbo like this?

My personal experience has been good, even in recent months. I know thats not the same for everyone.

But we need to be paying more for healthcare, like they do in other European countries. We also need to stop the waste of resources. Prior to covid my GP practice used to list the number of missed appointments per month. It would be several hundred each month which is disgraceful.

And for those suggesting I go Private there are reasons I can't do that and not just for money reasons. I have quite a complex case and they would need to gather my notes/ scan results from 3 different hospitals and by the time all that is done I might as well wait for this appointment to come through.

@Feedingthebirds1 yes the Tories said the exact same under Thatcher. Then when Labour got in suddenly the NHS got a lot better and the amount of people buying private health insurance plummeted.

Please will you find me the evidence for that? I am genuinely (not goadily) interested to read it and to see what was done differently.

However just because the Tories said it (and in 1979 when the Tories came in, there still wasn't anywhere near the treatments we have now) doesn't mean it's not true today. The evidence of inefficiency, of demand out stripping supply, is there for all to see. I'm definitely not a Tory apologist. Unlike the Tories I'm not shrugging my shoulders and saying 'so what can we do?'. I'm saying that we need to, as I said, go back to the first principles and design an NHS which combines the ideals of 1946 with the capability of 2021. That may include some or all of what Labour did when they were in power. But how can we find a long term solution if we don't first understand the extent of the problem?

You are so right OP, GPs are useless, miscomunication between hospitals, A&E takes the piss, full of inexperienced junior doctor that cant even take blood samples from children, referrals take forever when the GP finally decides to grace you with one. The worse health system in Europe, not to mention some non european countries too. But hey, its "free" 🤔
Good for those who can afford to go private, even tho still need to pass thru dreaded GP

@Feedingthebirds1 I am older, I remember all the same arguments when Thatcher was in. Then when Labour was in the NHS gradually got better and better. Not perfect. But for my condition the treatment was very fast. And private health insurance numbers plummeted. There were articles about it in the press.
Starting from scratch sounds a nice idea. It would be horrendously expensive to do and would need to keep all existing staff on board and on side. Look at even a small reorganisation in a private firm and how much it costs to do well? It is very expensive. There is no way the government or taxpayers would pay for that. INstaed it would be a cheap bodge job with good pr.

Whilst we absolutely love to blame the tory funding in the current state you could throw money at the NHS all day long you might as well set fire to it.Waste is astronomical ask any NHS staff how much money wasted .

My friend is a rota coordinator for 2 hospitals after the lockdown they upped to consultant rate temp for 2 hour clinic to £650 from £500 to encourage the consultants to work more than 2 hours a day .
more clinics on patients getting seen.
They have now stopped the enhancement and taken it back down to £500 and they are refusing to work unless they get £650 again holding them to ransom .

Also locum doctors demanding extortion fees litteraly naming there price .
The money they are spending is eye watering

Look at even a small reorganisation in a private firm and how much it costs to do well? It is very expensive.

Absolutely. And I'm not arguing for a bodge job. I know how expensive it would be and how long it would take to do it properly. But in an ideal world, we would take the time and commit the money to achieve a long term solution that works for the NHS as it was created but in the 21st century.

Note the 'in an ideal world'. I know that what I posted originally is not going to happen. But if it could, think how much better things would be.

53 weeks to see a specialist. Now on appointment number 4 (broken equipment, staff absence, poor management) and I still haven't got a treatment plan. The NHS is awful.

@HereComesTheSun12 I am sorry to hear that.
I have waited 6 weeks to see a consultant next week and had tests in the meantime. It is not an urgent issue. I am assuming your issue is very non urgent.

Ongoing issue that could become urgent any day with the only advice being go to casualty if X happens. GP mentioned surgery as a treatment option but this is best done not as an emergency as there's less risk of complications.

Then when Labour was in the NHS gradually got better and better

No it didn't. Rose tinted glasses etc.

The NHS now treats more people, with more conditions, and with more expensive treatments than at any time in its history. It is, and will forever be a bottomless pit. It therefore needs to decide what to concentrate on. It can and does treat high risk cases, difficult cases, and cases which need lots of additional support.

It doesn't need to treat to day to day simple operations. Many Orthopaedic cases, diagnostics, could and maybe should, be farmed out to private providers. It can still be free at the point of delivery, but as with every other European system, there is nothing wrong with contracting out to private services for treatments that can be done away from, for example, a major trauma centre.

@ReadtheFT

You are so right OP, GPs are useless, miscomunication between hospitals, A&E takes the piss, full of inexperienced junior doctor that cant even take blood samples from children, referrals take forever when the GP finally decides to grace you with one. The worse health system in Europe, not to mention some non european countries too. But hey, its "free" 🤔 Good for those who can afford to go private, even tho still need to pass thru dreaded GP

No need to pass through GP - most private health insurance now includes private online GP, so you can completely avoid the inefficiency of the NHS (and I consider that I am freeing up an appointment for someone who cannot afford private)

[quote julieca]@Igfdyjxzyjkv yep blame people for not paying for the dentist. It will be the same when people have to pay for medical care.
Well its your own fault you didn't pay to go to the GP when you got blood in your poo. Not our fault you now have terminal cancer.
I can see the MN threads now.
If only they stopped paying for Netflix and Sky they could afford to go to the GP.[/quote]
Why do we need to infantilise people? Why shouldn’t people live within their means?

The thing about going private is that it solves the problem for the individual user, but it does not actually solve systemic issues when used on a larger scale: in fact, when too many people do this, it makes the NHS worse. One of the core problems in the UK is a shortage of providers. Private health care was designed for low-volume, high value services; generally, doctors see fewer patients in the same amount of time. By making private provision attractive, doctors' time and energy can be drawn away from NHS work.

Labour actually did some very good things with increasing the number of medical school places, but they still relied on attracting doctors and nurses from abroad to plug the gap. The Conservatives didn't continue this level of investment, which was already struggling to catch up with the needs of the service. What scares me is that the shortages in personnel and investment take so long to reverse and there seems to be no prospect of a proper plan to do it.

@Igfdyjxzyjkv live within their means? You may be happy to have a world where people die if they cant afford an operation or children are left with lifelong injuries because their parents cant afford treatment, but most people arent.

@BigWoollyJumpers Private providers already do the easy stuff. The NHS pays them to do it. That is what makes money. The NHS does the complex stuff that is not money-making.
And no rose-tinted glasses. I have a chronic condition. I can directly compare my medical treatment under Labour and under the Conservatives. Labour was much better.

YANBU but I have got used to the the NHS being so slow that a delay of a month sounds short/quick to me. Best wishes

@LagunaBubbles

Well what do people expect really voting for the Tories sadly.... hardly the party of the NHS. Hope you're OK. Thank fuck I'm in Scotland and we've got a small hope keeping our NHS Tory free.

Also not running perfectly in Scotland. I know someone who was told 2 year delay for gall bladder surgery, so he went private. www.scotsman.com/health/covid-scotland-nhs-lothian-actively-considering-request-for-army-support-3436628

[quote ChocolateDeficitDisorder]**@julieca we are the only country in the whole world to provide free at the point of service.

No, we have the Scottish NHS which is separate organisation to the English NHS and operates in a different country and under a different government.[/quote]
???and where does the funding come from......oh yes Scottish taxpayers AND rest of UK taxpayers.

@dotoallasyouwouldbedoneby Yeah I am not sure I believe that. Maybe if you were dictating you could only go in for surgery at certain specific times.

It isn't just the wait. It's the sheer incompetence too.

My 92-year-old mum has had to shlep many miles (driven by my sis) to a faraway hospital to get prisms fitted for her glasses. During a Pandemic. She's been several times over the past 2 years and still couldn't see to read. Fortunately, her appointments got moved to her nearest Hospital and she has seen someone who got them correct for the first time. When asked why she didn't go there first, she reminded them that the faraway hospital is where the NHS referred her! And as for NHS letters! They are late and incorrect more than 50% of the time.

During the pandemic a lot of staff were redeployed to help with other duties because of the pandemic.

Well what do people expect really voting for the Tories sadly.... hardly the party of the NHS. Hope you're OK. Thank fuck I'm in Scotland and we've got a small hope keeping our NHS Tory free.

I was due an examination last week involving radioisotope injection at QE Glasgow. There was none. No radioisotope in the whole of Scotland. Fortunately my consultant managed to work round the lack of information but so many people, after a long wait, must have been cancelled. I've no idea if it's been resolved. Also know someone who has waited 9 weeks for the routine mammo result. Things are going very badly ime.

@ReadtheFT

You are so right OP, GPs are useless, miscomunication between hospitals, A&E takes the piss, full of inexperienced junior doctor that cant even take blood samples from children, referrals take forever when the GP finally decides to grace you with one. The worse health system in Europe, not to mention some non european countries too. But hey, its "free" 🤔 Good for those who can afford to go private, even tho still need to pass thru dreaded GP

It doesn't work for people with private care either as the private sector in the UK (especially outside London) is basically just staff moonlighting from the NHS. If you are in a car crash it doesn't matter what private cover you have paid for, you will be taken to A&E (NHS). That's not a bad thing but if the NHS can no longer deal well with emergencies....some kind of change will be needed. I am happy to pay more tax or a top-up premium. Others say they want more tax but they really mean so long as a higher earner pays. In Scotland pre-covid I was seen on the NHS within a couple of months for an invasive diagnostic test. It was surprisingly pleasant and the staff lovely. It had been outsourced to a private company....even in Scotland....the SNP voters won't believe it. Still free at point of use.

No I don't mean as long as a high earner pays it. I am happy for us all to be taxed more. But on income so it is fair. And as I said it needs more funding, immigration in short term, and in long term training up people where there are skill shortages.

And yes lack of staff means lots of things are the same wait where I am in NHS and private sector.