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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Wedding guests

346 replies

Neapwind · 25/10/2021 19:32

My granddaughter is getting married and only has one female cousin. She is not inviting her to the wedding as she is only 11 and they want NO children there. This has hurt me and surely one little girl who thinks she is going to the wedding will be very upset. Asking her to be a flower girl would be wonderful.
Other peoples thoughts please.

OP posts:
PurpleOkapi · 26/10/2021 02:18

@Lalliella

YANBU at all OP. I really don’t like nor understand the reason for the idea of child-free weddings. To me, a wedding should be a joyous occasion, a celebration for the whole family to share in. Excluding children strikes me as pretty miserable, like people are more concerned about image than inclusion. Many children love weddings, and can’t understand why they would be excluded.

You sound like a lovely DGM, and it’s really kind of you to offer to miss the wedding to look after your DGD. Shame not everyone is as nice as you. And that includes many of the people commenting on this thread.

Many children love receptions. It's pretty rare for them to love the ceremony itself, which can be quite lengthy for some faiths. If DGD's condition is such that it's unthinkable to leave her with anyone other than her parents or grandma, then no matter her fuckwitted parent have led her to believe, she won't "love" the ceremony and will inevitably have a meltdown at the reception (if not before).

Or maybe DGD is perfectly behaved and grandma is just trying to rationalize her favoritism, but didn't really think through her excuses beforehand. Though if an 11-year-old would really wants to play "mini wedding" with her grandparents, she's probably not as high-functioning as grandma wants everyone to believe.

PurpleOkapi · 26/10/2021 02:23

@Derbee

Also, child free weddings are usually pretty joyless affairs, and it’s not even reasonable to count an 11 year old as a child. Surely the child free thing is because people don’t want unnecessary noise, not because they don’t even want to SEE an under 18 anywhere in the vicinity. It’s bizarre not to invite her either way
OP said that the 11-year-old is the only child in the family. OP also said that her autism is the reason she can't be left with anyone but her parents or OP. Reading between the lines there, I think it's likely that they don't want her there because they know she'll be disruptive. In a harmful way, not a "joyful" way.
choli · 26/10/2021 02:51

Also, child free weddings are usually pretty joyless affairs, and it’s not even reasonable to count an 11 year old as a child.
Well that's a first on MN, where 20 year olds are frequently referred to as children.

LizzieAnt · 26/10/2021 03:04

If DGD's condition is such that it's unthinkable to leave her with anyone other than her parents or grandma, then no matter her fuckwitted parent have led her to believe, she won't "love" the ceremony and will inevitably have a meltdown at the reception (if not before).
Reading between the lines there, I think it's likely that they don't want her there because they know she'll be disruptive. In a harmful way, not a "joyful" way.

Do you have much experience of ASD PurpleOkapi?

It's entirely possible the 11-year-old wouldn't be at all disruptive.
She may struggle, yes. That doesn't necessarily mean she'll have public meltdowns. Everyone with autism is different and I'm sure the OP knows her granddaughter better than you. I think you may be reading too much between those lines.

There are reasons other than disruptive behaviour that can make care by family members, rather than a babysitter, a necessity (anxiety, for example).

Even if someone with autism does struggle a lot in a setting such as a party or wedding, that doesn't automatically mean they would prefer not to attend. With careful planning (by the parents in this case, not the bride and groom) and with certain accommodations everyone can have a good time.

It's called inclusion.

That said, the guest list is up to the bride and groom of course, but I really hope they're not excluding a young girl for the reasons you describe.

PurpleOkapi · 26/10/2021 03:43

@LizzieAnt

If DGD's condition is such that it's unthinkable to leave her with anyone other than her parents or grandma, then no matter her fuckwitted parent have led her to believe, she won't "love" the ceremony and will inevitably have a meltdown at the reception (if not before). Reading between the lines there, I think it's likely that they don't want her there because they know she'll be disruptive. In a harmful way, not a "joyful" way.

Do you have much experience of ASD PurpleOkapi?

It's entirely possible the 11-year-old wouldn't be at all disruptive.
She may struggle, yes. That doesn't necessarily mean she'll have public meltdowns. Everyone with autism is different and I'm sure the OP knows her granddaughter better than you. I think you may be reading too much between those lines.

There are reasons other than disruptive behaviour that can make care by family members, rather than a babysitter, a necessity (anxiety, for example).

Even if someone with autism does struggle a lot in a setting such as a party or wedding, that doesn't automatically mean they would prefer not to attend. With careful planning (by the parents in this case, not the bride and groom) and with certain accommodations everyone can have a good time.

It's called inclusion.

That said, the guest list is up to the bride and groom of course, but I really hope they're not excluding a young girl for the reasons you describe.

Yes. Have you? How many people with ASD do you know who simply can't be left in their own home with anyone other than their parents, but would be perfectly fine at a typical wedding and reception? That isn't common, to put it mildly. Either she could be left with someone else if the parents wanted to go that route and grandma is just inventing reasons not to attend in an attempt to force the bride's hand, or the child is effectively guaranteed to have a meltdown at that wedding. I've seen more than enough full-on meltdowns to understand why no one wants that at their wedding. It's not like a toddler crying where they've usually forgotten about it and are perfectly happy five minutes later.

The problem isn't necessarily that she might "struggle" in that setting. It's not even that by using "struggling" as a very transparent euphemism for "completely ruining everyone else's experience," you're attempting to shift the burden from herself and her parents to ensure appropriate behavior, onto everyone else to tolerate whatever happens because she's just "struggling." It's that her parents clearly don't view her "struggling" as anything they need to inconvenience themselves by attempting to address or avoid.

These are the parents who told her she was invited without bothering to check - clearly they aren't too concerned about her feelings, or anyone else's. And grandma thinks the child should be a flower girl. It's apparently assumed that the bride should just rearrange her ceremony in whatever manner is needed to make having a flower girl with ASD more likely - but far from guaranteed! - to not be a disaster.

They're the bride's relatives, and the child is 11, so the bride probably knows this about them. There's a good chance things would have been different if the parents could be trusted to remove her from the situation when it started to become too much for her. This is also true of neurotypical children. I have relatives who can be trusted to promptly remove screaming babies and properly supervise older children, and relatives who can be relied upon to do neither. Guess which families I invite to things more often?

No one is obligated to include anyone, of any age, who can't be trusted to behave in a way that isn't disruptive. That's not limited to children, or to people with ASD. It also applies to ex-spouses who can't be in the same room without causing drama, alcoholics who've been known to pass out on the dance floor, etc. Whether those individuals would prefer to attend, or why they behave the way they do, is irrelevant. One could argue that attending isn't good for them, but that too is irrelevant. Those things are irrelevant because the event isn't about their wants, needs, or best interests. It's about the couple and how they choose to celebrate their day.

Albanian · 26/10/2021 04:31

There are no more cousins , just a younger brother of the bride. I realise it is the bride and grooms choice to invite whom they want so have now accepted this. I will look after my little granddaughter and her parents will get a break and a week end away.

Maybe I am a bitch, but if I was your elder granddaughter I would never forgive you for putting another of your grandchildren first on MY wedding day. I would feel the same way if I were mother of the bride also. How can you do that to her? It's wicked.

I also have three children (now adults) with autism, one very severely. Although they hate change (and have never enjoyed weddings) the time between now and the wedding day would have given plenty of time for them to get used to a new babysitter. Particularly as you say your younger granddaughter does not have any difficult behaviours that mean a babysitter could not cope with. Or as everyone else has said the non biological parent could look after their child, while the biological parent could attend their niece's wedding.

I am also thinking of the sheer joy of my daughter on her own wedding day that her granddmother (my mum) was able to be there. And sheer joy for her granddmother to witness her marry. To see her beloved granddaughter marry was one of the happiest days of her life. As she was very ill, and actually died shortly afterwards, the day involved much planning and carers attending too....but she would never, ever have contemplated not going.

As I say I'd never forgive you for making my wedding day all about another grandchild.

timeisnotaline · 26/10/2021 04:36

@Derbee

Also, child free weddings are usually pretty joyless affairs, and it’s not even reasonable to count an 11 year old as a child. Surely the child free thing is because people don’t want unnecessary noise, not because they don’t even want to SEE an under 18 anywhere in the vicinity. It’s bizarre not to invite her either way
Why would it be bizarre not to invite her either way in your world? Apparently it will be a totally joyless affair with or without her since she’s 11 not 3, best to leave her out of this miserable event then isn’t it?
Bogofftosomewherehot · 26/10/2021 05:07

@Neapwind

Yes she is the only female child in the family and her autism does not affect her behaviour. Just makes her quiet.
@Neapwind. I think you need to understand a bit more about autism. There would have been something in her behaviour that led to what is usually a very lengthy process of diagnosis. A child just "being quiet" is not a reason to seek help/diagnosis. Girls with autism often mask to try and fit into a situation and it can be the result of masking that leads to emotional disregulation and stresses the child. I also think your other grand daughter and her future husband have every right to choose who attends their wedding without feeling pressure from others. Sorry you feel hurt but it's not your wedding.
IMarchToADifferentDrummer · 26/10/2021 05:17

I've chosen not to vote either way on this because I can see both sides, and agree somewhat with both.
But, if the brides 16 yo brother can go, why not her very quiet 11 yo cousin?
Could she not be flower girl, or just a guest, for the wedding itself then leave afterwards?
Could the bride & groom tell people that only certain children are allowed as they're close family, while maintaining that guests go child free so as to enjoy themselves without having children to look after & run around after?
It is entirely up to the bride & groom of course, but if they're allowing a 16 yo boy then surely one 11 yo girl could go, too, after all you've said you're babysitting her if she doesn't go so you could take her home after the service!!

ElevenOG · 26/10/2021 05:57

@Blondebakingmumma

You are too old to have tantrums!

Be honest. You love your younger granddaughter more than your older one.

The autistic granddaughter doesn’t need you to console her about not going to the wedding when one of her parents can.

You are purposely punishing your granddaughter by CHOSING not to go to her wedding because you feel slighted.

I’m not sure if I could forgive my grandma If she did this to me (not that she would)!

THIS.
TheWestIsTheBest · 26/10/2021 05:58

@Derbee

Also, child free weddings are usually pretty joyless affairs, and it’s not even reasonable to count an 11 year old as a child. Surely the child free thing is because people don’t want unnecessary noise, not because they don’t even want to SEE an under 18 anywhere in the vicinity. It’s bizarre not to invite her either way
Ha! My childfree wedding was about as far from joyless as you can get! I do think not inviting your own child to your wedding is an absolute shocker though, but the OP needs to go to her grand daughter's wedding, another babysitter can be arranged I am sure.
VividGemini · 26/10/2021 06:22

It might not be the case here but if they invite 1 child will they have to invite others? Our venue said if there were more than 10 children in attendance we would have to provide a registered nanny/childminder (don't know why). We were lucky we don't have many friends or family members with kids.

Shoxfordian · 26/10/2021 06:27

It’s not bizarre not to invite her; parents shouldn’t have assumed she’d be invited- one of them can look after her op; you should still go

tootootaataa · 26/10/2021 07:06

@Neapwind I am sorry that you are in shock after this diagnosis, but I can understand.

It took me a while to digest it when my DC received theirs. However, these feelings won't last forever, and life will become less focused on this. I hope that now doors start to open that will help your DGD to reach her full potential.

MichelleScarn · 26/10/2021 07:25

It is entirely up to the bride & groom of course, but if they're allowing a 16 yo boy then surely one 11 yo girl could go, too

Do you interact much with tweens/teens at all? The difference between a 16 yo boy (her brother!) who could in Scotland at least be working, getting married himself, and a child who could still be at primary is immense!

Hathertonhariden · 26/10/2021 07:50

OP - has your DGD been a flower girl/bridesmaid before? Did you see this as her last chance of being one especially after her diagnosis? Is this why you were thinking of a mini wedding?

Is your husband the bride's grandfather? If so could he go and represent you both? If not, could he look after dgd so that you can go?

Which of her parents is biologically related to the bride? Are they a couple who have to attend events as a couple? Are the other grandparents unable to look after the 11 yr old? Do the parents often miss out on going to events because of your dgd? If these scenarios apply, there was always going to be an issue over who was able to attend and this inevitably would cause upset in the family and the bride made her choice knowing that.

The b&g have made their choice and as with all weddings abroad/child free weddings you have to accept that some people won't be able to attend because of your choices. Hopefully they are adult enough to understand the consequences and not throw a tantrum about it themselves - there are plenty of threads unfortunately where this is not the case.

As long as you are not trying to blackmail them into taking the 11yr old, your choice not to accept the invitation is equally as valid as theirs not to invite dgd. Plenty of grandparents now miss out on being at weddings due to weddings being held abroad and brides are not traumatised by excluding granny to get the wedding of their dreams. Weddings are less and less family occasions and more of an adult party for the couple's friends.

cosyto · 26/10/2021 07:56

Several comments on this thread saying that child free weddings are joyless affairs! Wtf? That's a terrible, judgemental statement. It's the bride and groom's day, it's totally up to them how they want the day to play out. The best weddings I've been to are the child free ones, when I can relax, let my hair down and not have to run about chasing after a child, shushing them, pandering to them etc.

Back to the OP, I don't know really. There's been a few updates that come across as a drip feed, certain statements that turn the original post on its head a bit. But all in all, I stand by my original thoughts that the dgm comes across a bit stroppy.

brokenbiscuitsx · 26/10/2021 08:12

Several comments on this thread saying that child free weddings are joyless affairs! Wtf? That's a terrible, judgemental statement.

I find it’s often boring people who say that. Boring people who can’t just relax and have fun with adults and need children around for entertainment.

Sundaymorningfiveninteen · 26/10/2021 08:19

You are right to feel hurt . I’m assuming there is you and your husband, who had at least two children , who had three children between them . So you have three grandchildren , only one of which won’t be at the wedding . Assuming everyone is married that means out of the nine most closest members of your family from your husband , children, sil / bil / grandchildren. Only one has been excluded. That’s awful.

I also think that if having a blanket ban on children is their wish then that fine but surly having your other gran daughter as a bride maid would exempt her from the ban and stop people questioning . Ie , “we can’t exclude X obviously , she’s a bridesmaid” .
All the weddings I’ve been to were family celebrations . My own was little disrupted by an exuberant two year old was raised a few eyebrows but your other granddaughter is 11 and as you said, very quiet.
Nothing you can do but I do completely see your point of view. Flowers

Cosyblankets · 26/10/2021 08:28

@LadyGAgain

I haven't read every response. I have read everything OP has written. I understand your sadness OP. I think it's really sad that children are excluded from such a fun, exciting and positive life event. And I don't understand why. If it's for financial reasons that makes sense but I'd rather cut back on a bouquet of flowers and that would cover a few kids fish and chips. When we got married we invited all kids and left it up to their parents. We had no kids at the time. I love kids at a wedding. They're so excited and happy and first to get everyone up and dancing!! If people don't want to take their kids that's fine. Excluding children I find odd. (And no I'm not an Earth mother. I find having kids hard. Love them. The life change is a challenge)
You love kids at a wedding This bride doesn't That's the difference
PugInTheHouse · 26/10/2021 08:50

After re reading it and getting my head round the relationship I actually think this is really sad. There are not that many years between my DS and his younger cousin but I absolutely couldn't imagine DS excluding him from the wedding. When people have child free weddings quite often the immediate family kids are there and no one ever cares. If all kids were including it could potentially add 20/30 people to the guest list which often isn't practical. At my first wedding we had nieces and nephews only (we didn't have kids at that point ourselves).

I do think it is up to them though and the way the OP and following posts are worded it actually feels like you are way more bothered than the child and I find it hard to believe that in one post the child was only just diagnosed and has no behaviour issues but in another post will only stay with you or their parents.

As for the parent who couldn't give a shit about their 3 year old attending the wedding and the step parent who seems to find it admirable/amusing, I think this is vile.

Lifeisntfair2020 · 26/10/2021 08:51

Is the 11 year old your daughter's child, and the bride your son's child by any chance?

I don't why you are taking this so personally, why are you hurt?

And what kind of daughter/son makes their mother miss the wedding of their eldest granddaughter to babysit their child? Surely the one not blood related can stay home.

billy1966 · 26/10/2021 08:52

OP,

You are clearly processing some sadness about the diagnosis.

I can also understand your disappointment that a quiet 11 year old couldn't be included.

However, I think for you to give your granddaughters wedding a miss to mind her is not right.

Your child needs to make arrangements so your granddaughter can be cared for.

For you to miss your granddaughters wedding because of babysitting duties is very poor and will definitely be viewed as such.

If an alternative is difficult to find, you should be attending the wedding with your child and the other parent should remain at home with THEIR child.

It would be a VERY selfish thing for your child to leave you at home babysitting.

Flowers
PugInTheHouse · 26/10/2021 08:54

Sorry should have added that also people would expect young bridesmaids etc so even if these were a best friend's child no one would bat an eyelid. In real life I have never met anyone who expected their kids to be invited to a wedding. Things have got so expensive now that most decent people understand that.

Lorw · 26/10/2021 08:57

Has your 11yo GD been to a wedding before? If she has autism she may not handle it very well in any case and therefore not actually enjoy it. My ASD SS found our wedding extremely difficult and cried pretty much the whole day, wouldn’t eat or drink anything, it was a very hard day for him.

It is there choice and her dad or whoever isn’t blood related to bride should be looking after the 11yo not you.

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