To think this class should be closed?

[Jenster03]

I'm a part time primary teacher and in the space of two weeks, 14 children have tested positive out of 30 in my class.
We've had 2 or 3 return in that time, but more and more are testing positive. Now my teaching assistant has it.
AIBU to think we should be sending the class home and remote learning? How would you feel if you were a parent of a child in my class?
Oh, and I'm pretty anxious about my level of exposure too!

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.imperial.ac.uk/news/224853/over-million-adults-england-have-long/amp/

This article says 6% had what is classed as long COVID symptoms. So that is a tiny minority in my book, maybe not yours. So what 80-90% of the population who would be affected by classes being sent home because of 6%?

Plus- the road safety analogy is valid. We have spent millions trying to reduce the risk of covid and there aren't no measures. My dcs school have put measures in place from advice from the Health authorities once cases began to rise, we have tests, Windows are left often, hands are washed, track and trace are still contacting people and giving advice to schools. These may not be the preventions you believe in or want but it is incorrect that there are no preventions.

Yes- I would much rather have clubs, pubs, concerts closed before they close schools. How can anyone justify these being open and classes being sent home?

Ya! I wouldn’t bring my kid to a school I know has meningitis either.

Well no, because the outcomes are significantly more serious than covid. That's my point.

@gingercatsparky a lot of people complain about mitigation in schools eg masks.

I have known schools close for a few days when norovirus has taken hold and they want to do a deep clean and also hopefully break the cycle.

@TheKeatingFive

Ya! I wouldn’t bring my kid to a school I know has meningitis either.

Well no, because the outcomes are significantly more serious than covid. That's my point.

The difference is in the reflection on safety. There are NO mitigations in UK schools. Therefore the analogies don’t work!!!

You are right that humans are bad at risk. Esp when there is a risk to others and a benefit to selves. That’s what government is for - to balance the incentives. I can see you understand this and jst obfuscating for own ends. I wouldn’t send my kid to a polio party either.

There are NO mitigations in UK schools. Therefore the analogies don’t work!!!

That doesn't mean the analogies don't work.

The risk to children from Covid is very small. Everyday greater risks are run with no thought given to them. I see an RTA as much more likely to result in poor outcomes for my children than covid (and that stands even with minor mitigations in place on the roads and none for Covid).

When it comes to covid mitigations in schools it's like everything else, about weighing up costs and benefits. The costs of disruption to education and its knock on for everything else are very significant for a disease likely to impact children only very minimally.

@Wondergirl100

It's not 'never ending' - it's a virus ciruclating as bugs do every winter. There is no zero covid - it's a fantasy. We don't close schools every winter when flu knocks out whole classes - which I remember very well happening pre covid - I remember a virus knocking out the teacher and half the kids one winter in my sons school.

nobody talked about closing down the rest of the class.

In Australia and NZ they are now accepting they will have covid ciruclating just as we do here once they open up. The vaccine does not stop people passing it on - it stops people ending up in hospital. There is no eradication we have to live with it.

Exactly. Do we close schools for cases of D&V? Flu? RSV?

I wish people would just stop worshipping at the covid altar.

It's so boring.

Get a new hobby

They can close for Norovirus.

There are mitigations in my dcs school. When the cases rose they went back to some regulations from before in terms of picking up and dropping off. Sporting events against other schools were postponed as were activities which involved mixing lots of year groups. Now children are being tested and have to contact the school with results, track and trace contact people, hand washing and windows open. Events where parents might come and watch annoyingly have also been stopped.

It is not true there are no mitigations.

There are mitigations in my dcs school. When the cases rose they went back to some regulations from before in terms of picking up and dropping off. Sporting events against other schools were postponed as were activities which involved mixing lots of year groups. Now children are being tested and have to contact the school with results, track and trace contact people, hand washing and windows open. Events where parents might come and watch annoyingly have also been stopped.

It is not true there are no mitigations.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

They can close for Norovirus.

Isn't norovirus more dangerous to children than COVID is?

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

They can close for Norovirus.

Isn't norovirus more dangerous to children than COVID is?

@BeardyButton

www.google.ie/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/virginia-child-covid-death-schools-b1932393.html%3famp

Just putting this here. The story of a mother’s rage at selfish parents after her child died of COVID. But it’s ok, right, as statistically it’s rare? So, although some children will die, it’s highly unlikely to be YOUR child. That makes it ok. For You! That is the definition of selfish.

This is the risk we all take every day though.

The idea that it is possible to live life without risk is frankly bizarre.

There is a chance that any one of us will die from a random event, we need to become more comfortable with this idea, not bring the whole of society to its knees in an attempt to prevent it.

What odd thinking some people have.

No idea. Maybe little reception kids, but not teens.

Yes! So odd.... to argue agn sending children into schools with rampant Covid and no mitigations. Strange indeed!

We had our chance to make schools safe. We could have

Controlled community transmission (not had freedom Friday or whatever Boris called it)

Reviewed ventilation in schools

Provided hepa filters

Provided CO2 monitors

Provided for antigen testing

Ramped up test and trace

Contacted close contacts

Isolated close contacts

None of that was done. Statistically Covid is likely to be mild in chn relative to adults. Most cases won’t result in hospitalisation. Some will. Vast man of chn won’t die. Some will. 7 percent roughly will suffer w long Covid. We are still grappling with what that will mean. Risk profile looks more like polio or measles than flu.

What odd thinking, to send a child into a Petri dish with NO adequate mitigations in place. How ODD to actively participate in the spread of Covid amongst children.

@gingercatsparky

There are mitigations in my dcs school. When the cases rose they went back to some regulations from before in terms of picking up and dropping off. Sporting events against other schools were postponed as were activities which involved mixing lots of year groups. Now children are being tested and have to contact the school with results, track and trace contact people, hand washing and windows open. Events where parents might come and watch annoyingly have also been stopped.

It is not true there are no mitigations.

Washing hands won’t do much for an airborne virus. This thread is about a school where the virus is running rampant. Highly unlikely that school has adequate mitigations. Almost by definition really.

Also, if your school has hepa filters then you ll be among the vast minority of schools in UK. Other countries in Europe did provide these. Part of the explanation why UKs numbers are so hideous.

The virus was running rampant in my dcs school. That's why I commented. I didn't say the mitigations would solve the problem I stated that saying their are not mitigations is simply not true. This is an outline of the mitigations my dcs school put in place during this time.

Yes- I find it frustrating that still parents are not allowed to watch key school events. I understand why but this is more mitigations put in place.

The virus was running rampant in my dcs school. That's why I commented. I didn't say the mitigations would solve the problem I stated that saying their are not mitigations is simply not true. This is an outline of the mitigations my dcs school put in place during this time.

Yes- I find it frustrating that still parents are not allowed to watch key school events. I understand why but this is more mitigations put in place.

@BeardyButton What is your answer to the current high levels of Covid at schools?
Do you want to see schools closed again?

Do you think it’s fair doctors are treating sick patients (being exposed to Covid) and going home to their families?

[quote Hyly68]@BeardyButton What is your answer to the current high levels of Covid at schools?
Do you want to see schools closed again?

Do you think it’s fair doctors are treating sick patients (being exposed to Covid) and going home to their families?[/quote]
So our chn now are to be asked to take the level of risk doctors do? Trained adult professionals??? Who are provided w ppe when needed? Etc etc.. bizarre!

@BeardyButton you didn’t answer the first question?

You seem to be hellbent on others risking lives by being at school, what do you think doctors do everyday?
Should we send them home too, as surely it’s not fair they’re putting their families at risk too, after being exposed to Covid? PPE or not, many have still got Covid, my nurse friend was another who ended up passing it on to her husband and daughter, even though she was given PPE on every shift. Should she have not gone to work and neglected the care of her patients?
The point is, where do you draw the line?

I’ll ask again, what is your solution to the high levels of Covid at school?

When the cases rose they went back to some regulations from before in terms of picking up and dropping off. Being outside picking up and dropping off are not high risk, so these wouldn’t make much difference.

It is quite important to put the most effective strategies in. Ventilation. HEPA filters. CO2 monitors. Keeping within bubbles. Eating lunch strictly in bubbles inside or mixing but outside. When a child tests positive, whole class immediately sent home for online teaching for at least 5 days - or if this would be seriously disruptive - antigen tests every day for that class. Masks do also cut down the risk, but especially during activities like speaking so it’s most effective if a teacher wears a good mask. Most European schools have masks for all pupils.

None of this would mean closing schools or losing out on huge amounts of education.

@Hyly68 so yes the above would greatly reduce numbers and also ensure that there wouldn’t be big outbreaks in a school or a class. Because doctors wear pretty much full PPE this is a different scenario - wearing FFP2 masks is extremely effective. If a whole class also wore these masks there would be close to zero risk of transmission within a classroom - however ventilation plus bubbles plus above would also mean a very low risk of transmission.

Schools do not have adequate mitigations now in the UK. Most do not have even good ventilation. Most do not have HEPA filters (which some studies have shown a 90% reduction in transmission). Almost none have masks.

@CherryBlossomWinter

When the cases rose they went back to some regulations from before in terms of picking up and dropping off. Being outside picking up and dropping off are not high risk, so these wouldn’t make much difference.

It is quite important to put the most effective strategies in. Ventilation. HEPA filters. CO2 monitors. Keeping within bubbles. Eating lunch strictly in bubbles inside or mixing but outside. When a child tests positive, whole class immediately sent home for online teaching for at least 5 days - or if this would be seriously disruptive - antigen tests every day for that class. Masks do also cut down the risk, but especially during activities like speaking so it’s most effective if a teacher wears a good mask. Most European schools have masks for all pupils.

None of this would mean closing schools or losing out on huge amounts of education.

Oh my goodness. Did I say it would? Did I say I agree or disagree with these mitigations? I have said several times these are simply and outline of what mitigations my school put into place as people are saying there are no mitigations. I didn't say they work/didn't work.

BUT these small changes did mean that cases fell rapidly and we were able to go back to normal pretty quickly as the spread didn't happen to other year groups and DOH was satisfied the measures had reduced the spread significantly. So that they don't work might not strictly be true. This is obviously my experience in one school though.

There is no eradication we have to live with it. Complete nonsense. It is not a binary choice, completely give up and do nothing or completely eradicate it. We mitigate, we reduce levels and we vaccinate. We do that for almost all viruses. There is a flu plan every year to reduce levels of flu for example, there is a norovirus plan, measles, chicken pox, HIV, hepatitis, meningitis, protocols in places for all of these where we put in place action to reduce the levels are much as possible.

The simple fact is that we are not putting enough action, or the right ‘action’ in place. Which isn’t lockdowns. It’s public health. If this was the lowest level possible of Covid achievable then we wouldn’t be having most of Europe with less than half of our cases, hospitalizations and deaths. It’s not rocket science.

And the parents of the well children are meant to magically get time off work how? Furlough is long gone. If kids are well they should be in school