Gordon Brown for PM?

[Wilkolampshade]

I don't know, just watching the Blair/Brown documentary, does anyone think we could/should bring back Gordon Brown as leader of the Labour Party for a shot at P. M?
YABU... Absolutely not, what ARE you thinking?!?!
YANBU.... Why not, how much worse could it get?

I would struggle to forgive him for this. So disingenuous. A Labour politicians, taking from the poorest for aplause from the majority, assuming he wouldn't get caught?

www.theguardian.com/politics/2008/apr/30/economy.gordonbrown

Plus we're still paying 20% vat because of his stupid short term reduction.

Despite what Rupert Murdoch would have you believe, Gordon Brown actually saved our economy during the credit crunch. He took actions which prevented a collapse. The austerity which followed was completely unnecessary.

Andy Burnham is very divisive. He loves to stoke the North South divide.

I think it's possible that every single PM in British history would have done a better job than the past two.

Still there are people other than Brown I'd rather see in post.

A large part of the problem is that the current Labour and Tory parties don't just need a better leader- they are bereft of talent at every level.

We need some new young blood in politics, we are currently governed by elderly men stuck in their ways.

@JackieWeaverHandforthCouncil

Despite what Rupert Murdoch would have you believe, Gordon Brown actually saved our economy during the credit crunch. He took actions which prevented a collapse. The austerity which followed was completely unnecessary.

Andy Burnham is very divisive. He loves to stoke the North South divide.

I agree with you re Burnham

I’d prefer someone less divisive

I could not believe the shit he got for calling that woman a bigot.

It made me really warm to him. She was a fucking bigot. He spoke to her politely but I'm relieved to know that that's the sort of person that doesn't wash with him

@Pixxie7

We need some new young blood in politics, we are currently governed by elderly men stuck in their ways.

Yes 100%

I am watching the brown/Blair bbc series at the moment which goes over the history. And you can see the energy and enthusiasm that they had back in the 1990s. It was incredible - that is missing at the moment.

@daimbarsatemydogsbone

Why is it so hard for people to understand that peoples concerns about it might be something other than racism, such as the fact that there are already numerous problems due to overcrowding and an infrastructure that can’t cope with the population. Always dismissing these concerns as racism is not right

Exactly

Because immigration isn't causing these problems, people living longer with insufficient investment in services is the root cause. So blaming immigrants for those things is just a convenient cover for your existing xenophobia. We need young people a) to pay taxes and b) to care for all the older people (in all guides, actually caring plus e.g. driving the lorries with goods in).

The infrastructure argument is a massive lie, if you fell for it, you're a big a wally.

If we need more infrastructure - we need investment, not fewer working age people. Do try to apply logic.

Sorry should have added - immigrants pay more in tax and productivity than they take out. But xenophobes are shit at maths, they never fucking bother to understand reality. They just want immigrants out.

We need some new young blood in politics, we are currently governed by elderly men stuck in their ways.
I don't think any of the current cabinet could be described as "elderly"
And of the 29, 8 are women (which isn't enough, but we're getting there), and 7 are non-white (also not enough, but getting there).

@rrhuth

Sorry should have added - immigrants pay more in tax and productivity than they take out. But xenophobes are shit at maths, they never fucking bother to understand reality. They just want immigrants out.

^this

@daimbarsatemydogsbone

Why is it so hard for people to understand that peoples concerns about it might be something other than racism, such as the fact that there are already numerous problems due to overcrowding and an infrastructure that can’t cope with the population. Always dismissing these concerns as racism is not right

Exactly

Yes lets think like imbeciles instead of thinking that the government should invest more in infrastructure, so if people are too dim to figure that out and hold the governments they vote in accountable then I imagine theyre dim enough to be racist

Housing boom? Please see M Thatcher whose actions have distorted the market ever since she got her manky paws on it. And yes I do think social cohesion is a more desirable outcome than the current hideous mess that is our housing market.

@Pixxie7

We need some new young blood in politics, we are currently governed by elderly men stuck in their ways.

We had "young blood" with Cameron, Blair and Clegg. Look how badly that ended.

@rrhuth, @JustAnotjerPoster00, do try to out your point across without being an insulting arse, but your side always seem incapable of this. Of course immigration is going to affect overcrowding. A friend of mine’s daughter trained as a GP but couldn’t get a job, none available, so had to retrain as an accountant. How does that fit into your “not enough people of working age”. And a lot of the issues with lower paid manual jobs are that the conditions and pay are impossible for locals to live on. This is what should be addressed, not solved by shipping in people willing to take the lower pay and live in appalling conditions.
The government don’t seem to be capable of or willing to invest in the infrastructure and with the roads, they can’t actually improve them, there isn’t the space, so cramming in more housing and people is obviously not going to help. If you can’t see that and are going to label people as racist, when it wouldn’t matter to them what race the people coming in are, still the same problem and can’t discuss without insulting, then you need to look at yourself and consider whether it’s actually you that is the racist imbecile, always assuming everything is about race to everyone, because that’s what it’s about to you.

Gawd no.

And a lot of the issues with lower paid manual jobs are that the conditions and pay are impossible for locals to live on. This is what should be addressed, not solved by shipping in people willing to take the lower pay and live in appalling conditions.

I absolutely agree with you but blaming those people that are willing to seize any available chance at securing a better life for their family isnt the way to go, its about holding the government to account for supporting the poverty wage market and their sustained attack on unions

One of my favourite letters I've seen in a newspaper simply said:

"We shouldn't be so harsh on Gordon Brown, he was at least 50% correct: no more boom."

Have we reached the point where there are literally no MP's left so we are going through the back catalogue?

@Staffy1 your post is full of nonsense.

I said xenophobia, not racism.

And I am on no side but my own.

But always, always happy to be thought an arse by anti-immigration twats.

And that story about a gp - there must be more to it. There are intense national gp shortages.

do try to out your point across without being an insulting arse

The irony

If the answer is Priti, Gove (Gove-eeee), Raab, Frost!, Javid, 'Arithmatic' Coffey, Truss and the rest of the Cabinet then I'd can honestly, astonishingly, hope for the PM's continued health and career. I expect some of those named will be holding on top office with an even-more vice like grip that usual given the desire to manage the various COVID enquiries and possible personal consequences...

@JustAnotherPoster00

And a lot of the issues with lower paid manual jobs are that the conditions and pay are impossible for locals to live on. This is what should be addressed, not solved by shipping in people willing to take the lower pay and live in appalling conditions.

I absolutely agree with you but blaming those people that are willing to seize any available chance at securing a better life for their family isnt the way to go, its about holding the government to account for supporting the poverty wage market and their sustained attack on unions

Depressing that those exploitative jobs were/are a better life for some. How is that morally ok? Employers and bed in shed type slum landlords exploiting desperate people - migrant or British. It is really not ok and should never have been viewed as acceptable.

There should've been investment in infrastructure and housing to accommodate an expanded population. Blair and Brown did the opposite (Cameron, Clegg, and Osborne too). They all continued right to buy (in England), propped up the inflated housing bubble, and cut housing benefts. There was no investment in infrastructure either.

@longwayoff

Housing boom? Please see M Thatcher whose actions have distorted the market ever since she got her manky paws on it. And yes I do think social cohesion is a more desirable outcome than the current hideous mess that is our housing market.

But every single PM who followed her has done the same - and more. Arguably worse, because they could not possibly use the excuse of not knowing what would happen.

@rrhuth

Sorry should have added - immigrants pay more in tax and productivity than they take out. But xenophobes are shit at maths, they never fucking bother to understand reality. They just want immigrants out.

This is a great example of how being abusive towards people you don't agree with and adding in a few insults about things they haven't even said/done makes us all poorer.

The question of the actual effects, viability and sustainability of immigration should be open to debate, but attitudes like this just lead to shutting down of legitimate debate in favour of insults like racist or xenophobe. Unless we actually permit and encourage real debate, shouting people down will continue to result in division and outcomes like the Brexit vote.

No doubt I'll be considered racist for being concerned about the demographic shift where a significant number of people arrive from countries where abortion is banned - or more diifficult since that may influence future government policy.