Page 2 | Sexual contact when asleep - abusive?

Level75 · 2021-10-13T09:50:09+00:00

Just listened to an interesting item on Woman's Hour about people initiating sexual contact with their partner when their partner is asleep. The interviewee said all contact in this manner is without consent and therefore technically sexual assault. AIBU in agreeing with her? Loads of people contacted the program to say it wasn't an issue and some even gave blanket consent for their partner to have sex with them whilst asleep. I just thought that was a bit grim.

girlmom21 · 13/10/2021 11:27

I agree that it depends on every couple independently.

For me, sexual contact when I'm asleep is a boundary that I would end a relationship over but I know that lots of people would be perfectly ok with being woken up in certain ways that would freak me out personally.

Porcupineintherough · 13/10/2021 11:29

I'm totally happy for dh to wake me up in a sexual manner because, for us, that means stroking or kissing. I wouldn't want to be woken up by him trying to jam it in but that's not our style so Ive never had to spell it out.

Getyourownback · 13/10/2021 11:30

some even gave blanket consent for their partner to have sex with them whilst asleep

If a partner could happily get his rocks off by shagging an unresponsive person, I’d be deeply concerned. Fuck. What is happening?

fournonblondes · 13/10/2021 11:31

Only abuse if they were not given consent. Crystal clear. Wherever you think of the women or men who like this is up to them.

OttilieStonelady · 13/10/2021 11:32

@Queenie6655

I'm so confused with this guys

Also - what if someone says - I DONT THINK IT S A GOOD TIME

husband goes ahead

Wife feels too scared to speak up

What is that??

😢😢😢😢

Rape

FluffyBooBoo · 13/10/2021 11:32

@MsFogi

I think the which all tees seem to have been shown is great and covers sex with someone who is sleeping!

It doesn't cover whether someone has said they are happy to be woken up with a cup of tea though. And some people are.

EmotionalSupportBear · 13/10/2021 11:36

depends.

if you have given consent, or the 'initiating' is waking them up with kissing or caressing their stomach or thigh...etc, then i think its ok.

If you're doing what my ex was doing and undressing/groping, trying to penetrate them when they're asleep or pushed you off them once and pulled their pjs back up, moved away from you, or categorically told you not to do it again, then its assault/rape.

Abhannmor · 13/10/2021 11:36

@WhiskyXray

I assume women who give such blanket consent actually hate sex with their partners and can't face it awake, sober etc.

If it happens when you're asleep/drunk/stoned, then it's easier to dissociate from it and pretend it's not happening.

It sounds to me like a nightmarish kind of sex life to have.

That is one very large assumption.

OneTC · 13/10/2021 11:37

I'd never do it to oh, because she'd not like it

She would do it to me though, because I do like it

Runciblespoonandaring · 13/10/2021 11:37

Also - what if someone says - I DONT THINK IT S A GOOD TIME
husband goes ahead
Wife feels too scared to speak up
What is that??

Assuming that this is all one event, where the wife isn't up for it and says so, the husband goes ahead, and the wife is too scared to speak up - well that's rape I'm afraid.

Even if you had given blanket consent to let him have sex whilst you sleep, you said it was not the right time on that occasion, therefore the blanket consent doesn't apply that day. I'm not sure legally how that would stand up, but no reasonable person would ignore what you said and continue.

Assuming you have not given blanket consent, then this is rape clear and simple. It doesn't matter that you were subsequently too scared to speak up. You did not consent in any way to this. Being too scared to speak/move away is the freeze response. When scared people fight / flee / freeze, and all are valid responses. Sometimes your brain decides that the best way to survive this is to freeze. And freezing absolutely does not imply consent.

This is why the threshold for consent should not be a coerced 'yes', a nagged 'yes', or a lack of response. The lack of response, lack of 'no' or fight can be because the person is too scared to do anything but stay still. The threshold for consent should be enthusiastic consent.

ElvisPresleyHadABaby · 13/10/2021 11:38

Very early on I let DH do this with me. It wasn't long before I realised how violated it made me feel, and luckily he stopped. Friend discovered her DP was raping her in her sleep, as she used to have to take medication that knocked her out, then would find tissues and condoms in their en suite bin with no memory of it. Absolutely disgusting.

Lammysaurus · 13/10/2021 11:40

@Queenie6655

I'm so confused with this guys

Also - what if someone says - I DONT THINK IT S A GOOD TIME

husband goes ahead

Wife feels too scared to speak up

What is that??

😢😢😢😢

Rape.

HollowTalk · 13/10/2021 11:41

I've just listened to this, too. I wonder how many women agreed to this in the early days of their relationships where they're having sex all the time and then find years later the guy is still doing it, on the basis "you said you liked it." Also, for women who've agreed to this, what if you'd had an argument the night before and gone to sleep without making up? Would you still agree to it then?

Ticksallboxes · 13/10/2021 11:42

The interviewee said all contact in this manner is without consent and therefore technically sexual assault.

The interviewee must have meant sex with someone who is actually asleep if it's "without consent".

I think I would have to agree. This happened to me once years ago with an ex. It was early morning but I woke up to find his fingers inside me - it did creep me out a bit and when I woke up I didn't then want to have sex, so he never did it again thank goodness.

CornishGem1975 · 13/10/2021 11:44

@Porcupineintherough

I'm totally happy for dh to wake me up in a sexual manner because, for us, that means stroking or kissing. I wouldn't want to be woken up by him trying to jam it in but that's not our style so Ive never had to spell it out.

Pretty much this.

CornishGem1975 · 13/10/2021 11:45

@HollowTalk

I've just listened to this, too. I wonder how many women agreed to this in the early days of their relationships where they're having sex all the time and then find years later the guy is still doing it, on the basis "you said you liked it." Also, for women who've agreed to this, what if you'd had an argument the night before and gone to sleep without making up? Would you still agree to it then?

If we'd had an argument and gone to sleep without making up, we'd still both be waking up with a major face on so don't think it's something I'd need to worry about.

Also, I trust my DP, he knows where the boundaries are, without even discussing them, as he's a sensible grown adult, not a chimp. He's more than capable of reading the room.

SickAndTiredAgain · 13/10/2021 11:47

Initiating sexual contact is very broad as people have said, and there’s a huge range of behaviours from initiating sexual contact to actually having sex.
I have absolutely no issue being woken by DH kissing/stroking me, for example, I think it’s a nice way to wake up. But it’s context-dependant as well. If, for example, he’d initiated sex the evening before and I’d said no, I wouldn’t be happy to wake up to that the next morning because it would feel like a way to bypass my previous decision. Even if he stopped immediately when asked, I wouldn’t be ok with it.
Obviously for some people, it’s a blanket no, which is totally fine as well.

Deadringer · 13/10/2021 11:48

I agree that couples need to set their own bounderies, but i would be horrified at any man who would want to have sex with a sleeping partner. Sex is for mutual pleasure, using the body of someone you love in this way is disgusting imo.

GitsandShigggles · 13/10/2021 11:59

My wife often wakes me up with a BJ or slides on for an early morning ride - no objections here at all!

girlmom21 · 13/10/2021 12:00

@GitsandShigggles

My wife often wakes me up with a BJ or slides on for an early morning ride - no objections here at all!

Wow, you've managed to make that sound as grim as possible. Congrats.

WhiskyXray · 13/10/2021 12:05

@Queenie6655

I'm so confused with this guys

Also - what if someone says - I DONT THINK IT S A GOOD TIME

husband goes ahead

Wife feels too scared to speak up

What is that??

😢😢😢😢

That's rape.

FatAnneTheDealer · 13/10/2021 12:06

The woman on the radio specifically stated that it was not possible to give blanket, or prior, consent. I.e. even in a relationship where one partner has said specifically that it is okay to be woken up with sexual touching, that consent was not valid and it was still an assault.

Since you can’t give anything but prior consent if you are asleep, that means she was saying in every case without exception this is assault.

I think it is on the whole unreasonable (and deeply patronising) for one person to insist to another person that they have been assaulted, when they don’t think they have!

WhiskyXray · 13/10/2021 12:09

@FluffyBooBoo I'm replying to this sentence in the OP:

"some even gave blanket consent for their partner to have sex with them whilst asleep."

That's tragic and utterly horrific.

FluffyBooBoo · 13/10/2021 12:11

[quote WhiskyXray]@FluffyBooBoo I'm replying to this sentence in the OP:

"some even gave blanket consent for their partner to have sex with them whilst asleep."

That's tragic and utterly horrific.[/quote]
After I posted, I realised that. I find it completely bizarre, unless it's (as it might be in some cases) part of a role play kink thing. I find it hard to believe that most women wouldn't wake up during that.

BanditoShipman · 13/10/2021 12:12

@GitsandShigggles

My wife often wakes me up with a BJ or slides on for an early morning ride - no objections here at all!