AIBU for thinking hating people for their political leanings is perfectly normal?

[VelvetChairGirl]

I have been reading a brexit thread on here and lots of brexit voters in it seem horrified that they are hated and families have stopped talking to each other, and cut each other off over it.

but its politics nothing affects us more then politics, we have people who cut off others for believing in conspiracy theories and things. Brexit is the biggest shake up in this country in my life time, its taken away our freedom of movement for work and education, needlessly introduced a tonne of red tape, made our rights and standards extremely vulnerable to being destroyed (tories dont like food standards and workers rights this is well documented and they are in charge right now), reduced our standing in the world and will very likely lead us to being the poor man of Europe again, not to mention the fact its cut off vital EU funding to science research, regeneration and education projects up and down the county.

it affects everyone, of course people are perfectly entitled to hate those who voted to hurt them financially, prospects wise etc as much as they would hate someone who physically stole from them, theres very little difference is there?

@Ionlydomassiveones

“Brexit has hurt me every single day since June 24th 2016.”

But that’s you. This is what the middle classes don’t get, and why remain lost. Do you even realise that the majority of ordinary people in this country are busy just putting a roof over their heads and feeding their kids? They are not crying every day because poor Sebastian and Hermione are ‘no longer able to be in orchestras, to study abroad, to get Erasmus grants.’ Ffs. What planet are you on? Privilege planet. Remainers call the working classes thick or ‘misled’ but have no idea how stupid and out of touch you really sound.

This, with great big clanging bells on

And it's pretty bad faith simply to select my references to Erasmus and orchestras, when I talked about several other areas that had been hurt as well. I talked about young musical people and students, but also talked about farmers and fishermen and EU citizens - I don't actually embody all of these demographics.

@SkinnyMirror

And it's absolute bullshit to call the Erasmus grants a middle-class issue. The middle classes and the privileged will be just fine without them. It's the poorer kids who actually needed those grants to go away and to experience how life-changing it can be to spend time in a different country.

But they didn't.....

Well, actually, quite a number did if you look at the statistics of kids going abroad from universities and where they came from. Where's your evidence that they didn't?

If you hate a group of people who voted, and won by a majority, it's going to be pretty exhausting to go around hating them all.

I don't hate them but I am cross that the lies they believed will affect so many people in a negative way.

And not just from universities actually - Erasmus was used to set up exchanges from schools. And used by students right across the spectrum from medicine to law to business studies to languages. It's absolute bullshit to try and pretend that all of these kids were middle class and that working class kids didn't benefit from it.

@Ionlydomassiveones

“Brexit has hurt me every single day since June 24th 2016.”

But that’s you. This is what the middle classes don’t get, and why remain lost. Do you even realise that the majority of ordinary people in this country are busy just putting a roof over their heads and feeding their kids? They are not crying every day because poor Sebastian and Hermione are ‘no longer able to be in orchestras, to study abroad, to get Erasmus grants.’ Ffs. What planet are you on? Privilege planet. Remainers call the working classes thick or ‘misled’ but have no idea how stupid and out of touch you really sound.

👏🏼 this

*I dont think it does if its backed up by research I.E flat earthers yeah theres no evidence for that even in the middle ages people knew the earth was round that is a scientific fact.
*
The earth being flat is empirically false. Bigotry isn't really about scientific beliefs AFAIK. But on matters that are more subjective, yes, you can be a bigot even if you think your siding with the more liberal viewpoint

I'm an academic at a university and research widening participation and social mobility.

If you look at the numbers it is very clear that those universities which attract students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds did not send huge numbers of students abroad via Erasmus ( if any). It's the elite universities that had the highest numbers and those universities are far less likely to be attended by students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds, non traditional students or first generation students.

YABU. Without at least 2 parties, how can we have a democracy? You may grow out of it and even switch sides eventually.

@adeleh

And not just from universities actually - Erasmus was used to set up exchanges from schools. And used by students right across the spectrum from medicine to law to business studies to languages. It's absolute bullshit to try and pretend that all of these kids were middle class and that working class kids didn't benefit from it.

That vast majority of there were middle class and privileged. Where is your evidence that students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds benefited from Erasmus in huge numbers?

• the vast majority of them

@SkinnyMirror

I'm an academic at a university and research widening participation and social mobility.

If you look at the numbers it is very clear that those universities which attract students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds did not send huge numbers of students abroad via Erasmus ( if any). It's the elite universities that had the highest numbers and those universities are far less likely to be attended by students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds, non traditional students or first generation students.

Music lessons aren’t free in schools anymore. I can’t imagine many working class kids can even play an instrument or read music never mind have their dreams of playing in an orchestra in Vienna dashed.

YABU. My comment is as per title...related to e.g. 'hating Tories' just because, not to Brexit. Brexit was a cross-party issue and I actually voted Remain but accept the result.

Or you might become increasingly feeble minded and unable to think rationally with age and switch sides

Interesting that also as an academic at a university I have seen plenty of evidence of students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds and non traditional students benefitting from the Erasmus scheme across a wide range of disciplines, not only by being able to travel themselves, but also - and crucially - from being able to interact with other Erasmus students who used to be able to come and join them on UK campuses.
And I have also seen the evidence of schools, particularly in poorer areas, being supported in setting up exchanges because of Erasmus, something that independent schools will still be able to do, but that state schools are far less likely to do, especially since the loss of Erasmus sends yet another message about it being fine not to speak any languages other than English.

@lljkk

I suppose I admire OP for having no doubts in their political convictions. That most be a very comfortable position.

It sounds exhausting to me. And self-defeating.

@adeleh

Interesting that also as an academic at a university I have seen plenty of evidence of students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds and non traditional students benefitting from the Erasmus scheme across a wide range of disciplines, not only by being able to travel themselves, but also - and crucially - from being able to interact with other Erasmus students who used to be able to come and join them on UK campuses. And I have also seen the evidence of schools, particularly in poorer areas, being supported in setting up exchanges because of Erasmus, something that independent schools will still be able to do, but that state schools are far less likely to do, especially since the loss of Erasmus sends yet another message about it being fine not to speak any languages other than English.

What sort of a university do you work at? I think that makes a huge difference....the figures certainly suggest that too.

It's true that it's unlikely to be working class kids who don't get to participate in European orchestras anymore, but it still matters. It's still a big loss for somebody and for what? Until you're able to come back and point to where life has got demonstrably better for someone, from whatever demographic, it's going to be difficult to persuade anybody that Brexit was a good idea. You can be as selective about people's posts as you want, and gleefully shriek about anything that you think smacks of privilege and call people out of touch and stupid, but we're still waiting to hear of any benefits other than the crown stamp on a pint glass and a fucking blue passport.

It’s ridiculous to hate someone based on their political leanings. I find it extremely childish and immature when people are unable to accept that others have opinions that may differ from their own. The idea that only an exclusive set of political ideals is acceptable is the very definition of fascism.

@generalh

I don't hate them but I am cross that the lies they believed will affect so many people in a negative way.

This was the classic labour stance which worked so well at the last election!

The poor stupid people who are thick enough to believe the lies that were used.

Still not a clue about the reasons people actually voted for it, because for many their lives couldn’t get much worse and no one cared about them pre brexit.

Hatred is a bit extreme. I don’t hate tories or brexiteers at all, I just don’t like them very much.

@adeleh

It's true that it's unlikely to be working class kids who don't get to participate in European orchestras anymore, but it still matters. It's still a big loss for somebody and for what? Until you're able to come back and point to where life has got demonstrably better for someone, from whatever demographic, it's going to be difficult to persuade anybody that Brexit was a good idea. You can be as selective about people's posts as you want, and gleefully shriek about anything that you think smacks of privilege and call people out of touch and stupid, but we're still waiting to hear of any benefits other than the crown stamp on a pint glass and a fucking blue passport.

If this is aimed at me then you need to reign in your anger. I actually voted remain but I agreed with a PP regarding people bemoaning the loss of very middle class activities.

I guess that the point is that many of the demographic who voted for brexit aren't arsed about middle class pursuits, and didn't register them when voting. Why would they? Many held on to the promise of things getting better, as in many parts of the country and for many people it's pretty shit.

Quote OP: 'we got minimum wage because the EU was pushing for it unfortunately we could set our own minimum'.

I voted for the Blair Government that brought in the UK's first minimum wage. It was in the Labour manifesto in 1997. Nothing to do with the EU. BTW I didn't vote for Corbyn.