Is she on another planet?

[CookieDough2017]

A bit of background info before I begin, I have a DD who has recently turned 4 and she goes to nursery 2 days a week.

My OH’s mum (a retired primary school teacher) is always telling me things like you should be booking swimming lessons for her, my boys knew how to swim at this age or about her booking piano lessons or just making comments how she is worried my DD is falling behind because so and so can do this and that blah, blah, blah!

The other day she offered to buy my daughter learning another language lessons as she is worried DD’s nursery are not providing this and should be doing so as it is the LAW!

My DD absolutely idolises her but I think keep going on like this and you will push her away in tears to come.

Am I the only one who thinks she is putting too much pressure not only on my DD and me and my OH?

I don't think grandma 'should' be telling you what your daughter 'should' be doing. Plenty of children aged four do not yet swim or learn another language. In years gone by (I'm over seventy), nobody started French until senior school and started swimming lessons then; before that they might have learned to swim with their parents but not all. I'm not suggesting we go back to those times but she is being over the top in the other direction.

If she feels so strongly, suggest she takes her granddaughter swimming and does a bit of French with her. You say your daughter adores her so she might like it, she will soon say if it's too much!

There is no legal requirement for nurseries to teach a foreign language. However, there are plenty of benefits for the child in starting a foreign language at this age. See www.pacey.org.uk/news-and-views/pacey-blog/2017/july-2017/why-teach-foreign-languages-in-early-years-setting/

My three-year-old loves her weekly swimming lessons. The children’s progress seems to be quite slow at this age (3 & 4), but they’re still learning important skills, such as star floats and climbing out of the pool. It’s great to see them grow in confidence.

I’d grab the chance to take DD to language classes. Babies can hear the subtle differences between sounds in different languages, but they lose that ability as they get older. You can become fluent in a new language as an adult, but you’re unlikely to develop a native accent.

I personally wouldn’t bother with piano lessons at this age though.

I think the swimming and language lessons seem like a fab idea!

Swimming is such an important life skill and I am not a very confident swimmer so DS has been having baby lessons since lockdown eased in the spring when he was five months old. He absolutely loves it.

I am a languages teacher and think it such a shame that on the whole, as a nation we do not recognise how beneficial learning a second language at a very young age is. In my younger years I taught English in France and their English levels (on the whole) were as good at the age of 7 or 8 as our pupils are by 15/16.
Your mother in law is wrong about it being compulsory for nursery though, it becomes compulsory at KS2. I will say though that when I visit primary schools who teach languages well, the vast majority of pupils love it and get stuck in as they haven’t had time to develop the fear of an unknown language…they really take it in their stride! It’s also beneficial for their English learning too! If someone else is offering to pay I’d say go for it and see what happens.

@simkin38

What a horrible, classist post. So you’re saying that working class parents don’t value teaching their kids life skills or extra-curricular activities? That only middle-class parents do?

What a crock of absolute unadulterated shite 💩

She's a pain in the arse, ignore her.

If you can afford it, swimming lessons are important though, and starting them young really helps.

Swimming lessons - loads of fun, great idea thanks. Second language, can be a great stimulation but unless she's supporting it all through primary and secondary there's no point as it will need continual work. Piano, yes MUSIC and learning it is of benefit, it's interesting and relaxing but piano, out of the blue is silly for a child of four, fine for a child who's around instruments all the time - but much like another language it's a massive commitment! Maybe a more appropriate instrument.

But NONE of that at all will help your child at school ..... it doesn't sound like she knows the early years at all!

Also, you think she's know more about what your child might be interested in and suggest activities there - she sounds cold and of the "empty vessel" notion of teaching. Thank goodness she's not doing that anymore

Swimming is a life skill and she's right about that. The rest is completely non-essential. My DDs are 18 and 20, never did French, ballet, judo or whatever as we live in a small town and there was nothing that wasn't inside our working/commuting time. We did archery as a family, visited museums and stuff and that was quite enough.

I now have two strong swimmers who are well rounded human beings - DD2 has just started university. Do it your way.

She’s worried you are not giving your child (her grandchild) enough stimulation, but being overbearing in how she’s expressing her concern. Just check - are you doing fun/educational things with your daughter? I’d jump at the chance for swimming and languages if she’s paying - your little one might love it! 4 is a great age to start doing a few more structured things - she’ll soak it all up like a sponge.

Does your daughter do any classes/hobbies? In my social circles it would be very unusual by four not to do anything at all, and if your MIL is on another planet then my family and friends and colleagues must all be on the same planet with her. By four, I was doing dance (ballet, modern and tap and had already been in a few shows) and swimming which my parents considered essential as my Uncle nearly drowned as a small child on a day trip. I started both around age 2.

Among my friends, they all seem to start their children in activities from that age as well. Swimming is a must for all of them and they definitely all start long before school, both for safety reasons and also so they can enjoy the pool on holidays and as an activity locally. A few of them actually started swimming sessions as really tiny babies (I think it's called WaterBabies)!

Other activities their pre-schoolers are enrolled in are Rugby Tots, Diddikicks (football), Jo Jingles (music), TumbleTots, Yoga, Drama, Ice Skating, Acro, lots of different Dance based activities. I literally don't know anyone who has a preschooler who doesn't do at least one activity, and to be fair it's usually two.

If she's a primary school teacher she will have more experience than you in encountering lots of children and knowing what helps their development. If money is an issue and she's offering to pay for swimming, allow her to. I'd agree that 4 is a little young for piano but, providing your dd is interested, it's not too young for a group sensory music class. Languages...I think can wait. Really swimming and whatever else dd shows an interest or aptitude for, whether it's
sport, arts, music etc.

It's a great time to learn, their little brains are like sponges soaking everything up, good for social skills and confidence, understanding appropriate behaviour etc. I'm still friends with people I danced with and did shows with as a toddler. There's really no
harm in a child having a couple of organised activities per week. I definitely think there's potential harm in a four year old having no water skills.

She is being pushy because it’s not her child, but she’s not wrong; your DD should know how to swim and she should be actively learning a new skill and another language.

Do you work?

If not, and effectively you have 3 days a week with her, I think we are missing some context of what do you actually do with your daughter. I could see how it could be perceived and how your MIL feels she needs to push these suggestions if all you do is sit at home/go to local park/visit friends or family occasionally (don't get me wrong - perfectly fine things to do) - especially if your household has the resources to fund some more enriching things and start working on some life skills or hobbies.

But NONE of that at all will help your child at school ..... it doesn't sound like she knows the early years at all!

It actually does, swimming will help develop motor skills, language and piano promotes brain development. So unless she doesn't enjoy them after trying, it's worth giving it a try. So I think she knows a lot about early years.

Aw, the mention of Tumble Tots further up there has made me all nostalgic. DD#1 flipping LOVED it. Happy days (thirty odd years ago)

I am a primary teacher with a gd. I have to admit l am itching at times to say l will pay for her to have lessons/ activities etc but it's not my place to make suggestions. Often it's just my over enthuasism and how much l care about her. But Its up to her parents. When they have decided on something like swimming lessons then l have offered to pay just to take pressure off them. But GPS need to stand back as is always the message here. Yes even if they are primary teachers!!! She should never be making remarks about the child being behind unless she is genuinely worried about special needs and even then l would proceed with caution.
Op you decide what you want her to do then if she offers to pay take it gratefully. Maybe your dh could advise here to back off..my ds certainly would if I was overstepping the mark.

Why don't you ask MIL if she would like to take DC to the extra curricular she is offering to pay for as a bonding time between grandma and grandchild?

It will give you an hour or two to yourself too?

I think swimming and piano are fantastic things to learn, my ds did both from about 5/6 and I'd really recommend her starting in the not too distant future- no major hurry though! Learning a language when you're not immersed in it/have no one who speaks it fluently around you is IMO a complete waste of time. It's all fairly meaningless to a child - even as a teenager after 5 years of French I wasn't understood asking where the supermarket was when I went to France. The French also hate people mangling their language and tell you to speak in English in my experience of train stations and bus stations.

4 is too generally young to learn piano. Progress will be much faster if you wait a few years. And when a child progresses faster, they usually enjoy it more.

Generally too young!

If you really feel strongly against it then kindly tell her no . If she’s paying though then I would 100% take her up on that offer . Swimming is so important at that age .

I will say one thing . My sister suffers from mental health & anxiety and her kids don’t get out enough ( basically never) and they have never been signed up for extra activities . And it shows 🙊. That’s an extreme case mind you .

I think extra activities like swimming , sports , music etc can be great for kids .

The French also hate people mangling their language

They also hate speaking English too (and mangle it themselves), so you can’t win with them. Solution; learn Spanish. More widely spoken and internationally useful for travel, too! 🇪🇸

@FloconDeNeige

The French also hate people mangling their language

They also hate speaking English too (and mangle it themselves), so you can’t win with them. Solution; learn Spanish. More widely spoken and internationally useful for travel, too! 🇪🇸

(Disclaimer: sweeping statement ahoy) I do find it funny/perplexing that French people (IME) sneer at English-speakers trying to speak French because of their accent, while themselves speaking English with a French accent... Don't get me wrong, I have no issue with anyone who's not a native speaker speaking English, or with their accents (I am a typical Brit monoglot so cannot claim the high ground). It just seems a bit… hypocritical?

It’s up to your and your OH how you parent. Personally my DD did classes and enjoyed them at that age plus went to nursery.
Mine did a kindermusic class, swimming lessons in small private pool and ballet age 4. If she’s willing to pay for a class I’d personally take her up on it.
It’s a balance but she has lots of time just to play if she’s only at nursery 2 days.

[quote curiousdesigner]Hi all, I don't mean to disrupt this great conversation, however my colleagues and I at Loughborough University in the UK are carrying out a design research project on this topic - how parents teach 2nd languages to their children/how children learn 2nd languages outside of the school setting. If this sounds like something you can speak about, then it would be greatly appreciated if you could fill out this short survey for our project. Thanks very much in advance!

lboro.onlinesurveys.ac.uk/language-learning-through-play[/quote]
The conversation ended almost 2 months ago, so you're hardly disrupting it.