To teach DS a life lesson or just let it go…

[Whosthebestbabainalltheworld]

DS14 is a capable all-round student, but a bit lazy. He dislikes a particular subject, has decided he doesn’t want to study it and not surprisingly, performed poorly in his summer exam.

Teacher suggests he still aims for higher level in his state exams in 2 years (he could drop to lower level, which is an easier course, but cannot drop the subject entirely). In fact, in our schooling system it’s something he must study until he finishes secondary school (won’t be hard for some to guess the country, but not UK obviously). So once he drops to lower level that’s where he’ll stay for the next 5 years.

My dilemma is this….

Do I agree he can drop levels (despite being capable) or seek to teach him a life lesson - insist he sticks with higher level and pay for extra tuition which he will both hate and resent me for.

I’m torn, please help!

@elizabethdraper

It's clearly irish.

It's a dead, pointless language

Let him drop to a lower lower paper. Life is too short to argue over it.

I never passed an Irish test in my life, the stress and fighting it caused in my house wasn't worth it.

My children have a natural grà for the language which is brilliant but I have a total hatred for it

What an awful thing to say. It's not a dead nor a pointless language, plenty of people use it in daily life and Irish-medium schools are more and more popular and new ones open every year. There are so many young people breathing new life into the language - including young people of colour like Ola Majekodunmi and Zainab Boladale.

And look OP, if he gets a low grade at JC level we all know it doesn't matter. If he's genuinely putting in no work it might actually be a wake up call for him - so many kids coast through school and then get a shock when they hit exams. Better to learn that at JC level than LC or later on in college.

If it is Irish(and OP hasn't confirmed this) you might be able to nudge him into doing honours for JC by saying it's similar standard to ordinary LC. That's what I was told and in grinds for JC when I was really low on confidence I was given a comprehension paper to do, got it and was then told that's a LC paper question. Really gave me the boost that I wasn't shite. If he decides by LC subject choice time that he doesn't need HL he can still have the confidence that he's able to, rather than try to work up a level when it's harder and there's more pressure.

[quote OchonAgusOchonOh]**@elizabethdraper* - It's a dead, pointless language*

Learning a language is never pointless. The cognitive benefits are well established.

Irish is also very much alive in parts of the country. The increase in popularity in gaelscoileanna and Gael coláistí would also suggest many disagree with you.[/quote]
The cognitive benefits were no beneficial in my case.

They cause years of crying, unable believable stress, being told I stupid at home and school.

Singled in in class for not saying words correctly.

There was mental, emotional abuse.

Not everyone's brain is wired for languages, my children love irish as does their father. As soon as the irish homework comes out i feel the panic, dread and fear.

My 5 year old has more irish than me, he laughs at me because I cant pronounce words correctly.

My whole school experience is mark by my inability to drop irish. I left school 25 years ago and i still have nightmares about leaving cert irish.

It is Irish. Unlikely to ever be necessary for any university course but he’s more than well capable of doing well if only he turned his mind to it. He’s just being bloody minded (he gets that from DH ) and bloody lazy.

It really just irks me that he could do well but couldn’t be arsed.

Thanks for the responses though, I guess getting grinds would be like leading a horse to water, but I’ll never make him drink!

A life lesson would be allowing him to fail and deal with the consequences, not nagging him to try harder and paying for extra tuition.

I can’t see any point in the insisting and tuition for a subject he doesn’t like and won’t need.

@Whosthebestbabainalltheworld

It is Irish. Unlikely to ever be necessary for any university course but he’s more than well capable of doing well if only he turned his mind to it. He’s just being bloody minded (he gets that from DH ) and bloody lazy.

It really just irks me that he could do well but couldn’t be arsed.

Thanks for the responses though, I guess getting grinds would be like leading a horse to water, but I’ll never make him drink!

I have a 14 year old son and I literally could have written your post. He is currently in an honours class, has done dismally in Irish tests to date but has passed. If there is a normal Junior Cert this year, I hope he'll stick with it for all the reasons given here. But no way will he be doing honours for LC, that would be flogging a dead horse (again with the horse metaphors).

I think higher level JC and lower LC is what we’ll aim for.

Will put the grinds money saved into some gin instead. Thanks all.

@elizabethdraper - sounds more like a reflection of the quality of teaching you had. Abuse is not an acceptable teaching approach.

Certainly, some people are not wired for languages. I'm not and struggled similarly with french Interestingly, I am good at Irish, probably because I did the first 4 years of primary in a gaelscoil so got a proper grounding.

A bad experience by some people is not a reason to remove Irish but is instead a reason to look at how it is taught. Early immersion is the best approach.

My whole school experience is mark by my inability to drop irish. I left school 25 years ago and i still have nightmares about leaving cert irish.

While I sympathise with you, you do know that you were taught under a completely different curriculum to modern Irish teaching, right? It's night and day from what it was, certainly primary - can't speak to secondary. There's a real problem in this country with adults projecting their (totally valid) negative experiences with Irish onto their children and predisposing kids to hate Irish. Not saying you're doing that btw, clearly you aren't if your kids like it. But a general observation.

@SionnachRua

My whole school experience is mark by my inability to drop irish. I left school 25 years ago and i still have nightmares about leaving cert irish.

While I sympathise with you, you do know that you were taught under a completely different curriculum to modern Irish teaching, right? It's night and day from what it was, certainly primary - can't speak to secondary. There's a real problem in this country with adults projecting their (totally valid) negative experiences with Irish onto their children and predisposing kids to hate Irish. Not saying you're doing that btw, clearly you aren't if your kids like it. But a general observation.

It sounds like you were almost traumatised, but hitting out at the language rather than the way you were taught isn't helpful. It's sort of amazing Irish has survived and I think it's good to learn it if you can - it helps understand hiberno-english, Irish culture and history and it's a beautiful language once you get into it. It might be nice for you to do a beginner's course even just to prove to yourself that you can and so that you can understand more of what your kids are learning - face the fear and put that particular bogeyman to bed!

@Whosthebestbabainalltheworld

I think higher level JC and lower LC is what we’ll aim for.

Will put the grinds money saved into some gin instead. Thanks all.

Yes - I'd aim for HL JC and sure he might enjoy it and go for higher level LC. If Irish colleges are up and running next year he could go and might learn to appreciate the language once he sees it in a more live context.

I agree with you @justmaybenot but think you quoted the wrong person

@SionnachRua

I agree with you *@justmaybenot* but think you quoted the wrong person

Ha I couldn't figure out how to do it properly - am too hungry! Brónach

Yerra sure I reckon we understood what you were getting at anyway - was a solid point!