Laurence Fox causing scaremonging and false information over Covid jabs

[Suetully]

He stated he is ''‘Following the tragic death of BBC journalist Lisa Shaw from vaccine-related complications, and the unending lies about the efficacy and safety of the vaccine, I will not be sending my children to school until I have received a cast-iron guarantee that my children will not be vaccinated without the consent of both parents for a disease that has negligible chance of serious illness to them.‘We are in the middle of a mass delusion and it is time for people to wake up. Children’s lives are at risk.

‘However, I fully support the provision of vaccination for children in vulnerable groups with fully informed parental consent.’

A Department of Health spokesman said: ‘No decisions have been made on vaccinating 12 to 15-year-olds and it is inaccurate to suggest otherwise. Ministers have not yet received further advice from the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation on this cohort.’

Now AIBU to be angry that he is misleading the public into thinking that the schools/govt are going to start vaccinating the kids without consent as nowhere was this ever stated as fact. And the govt have issues statements online to counteract the false reports online that this was not the case for under 16s and that the laws have not changed. Yet he is spreading false information rather than doing his research.

And precedent around children and consent to medical treatment has been around since the 1980s. No boundaries are going to be broken here.

Set in stone is not something that seems to matter when it comes to Covid vaccines

We’ve already mandated them for certain workers. The government literally saying you cannot work here unless you have vaccination

That would have been unheard of 2 years ago

So set in stone doesn’t mean anything. Indeed the whole point is about the over reach of government powers right now

How many more times. Private companies hosting who and what they want is not 'censorship', spoilt fools. Imagine having to explain the free market to right wingers.

@Suetully

''You are just spoiling for a fight *@hamsterarse*, ''

yup don't feed the troll x

Pathetic

He’s not wrong that if his twelve year old goes to school and both the child and their mother consent to a JCVI advised vaccine then there’s sod all he can do about it. Not clear whether a twelve year old in England would be able to take the vaccine without their parents’ consent - I think that 13 year olds can take the HPV jab without their parents consent can’t they? And certainly I believe that a fifteen year old should be able to override their parents’ wishes on the vaccine, in either direction.

I do feel genuinely sorry for Billie.

We’ve already mandated them for certain workers. The government literally saying you cannot work here unless you have vaccination

That would have been unheard of 2 years ago

Mandatory vaccinations for front line NHS staff have been the norm for a long time.

@CorrBlimeyGG

We’ve already mandated them for certain workers. The government literally saying you cannot work here unless you have vaccination

That would have been unheard of 2 years ago

Mandatory vaccinations for front line NHS staff have been the norm for a long time.

Give over

That’s actually fake news and you know it

"Please think that through"

I have. Twitter and Facebook are private companies and they have the right to police them as they see fit, and users on these sites have the right to be protected from the abuse that gets slinged around on them.

I had absolutely no problem with Trump being banned. That twat doesn't deserve an outlet for his poisionous shite. I also have no problems with fuckwits like Hopkins spreading complete misinformation being banned either.

@Suetully

''That hasn’t been confirmed though has it? They haven’t confirmed one way or the other''

under English law it is very much conformed as it's set on stone that kids under 16 needs parental consent. My point, for the zillionth time, is that Fox is leading people to think this has being changed when it very much has not and only had speculation online which means fuck all.

Where is it set in stone? Is this Covid specific legislation? because for all other vaccinations a 12-15 year old can consent against their parents’ wishes.

Genuine question, happy to be pointed to the rules, but if it’s been officially stated then I missed it.

Add Katherine Ryan to this list of scaremongerers only she does it under the guise of 'caring about women's health.' but then she doesn't believe in contraception and thinks you are a shit mum if you haven't potty trained by mum. Given how much she gets herself plastered all over the Daily Mail, I'm surprised she hasn't been called at yetm

@Demelza82

Add Katherine Ryan to this list of scaremongerers only she does it under the guise of 'caring about women's health.' but then she doesn't believe in contraception and thinks you are a shit mum if you haven't potty trained by mum. Given how much she gets herself plastered all over the Daily Mail, I'm surprised she hasn't been called at yetm

*potty trained by 1

@Suetully

''There actually was talk the other day of no parental consent being required, he hasn’t just made it up anyway?!? ''

yea the talk was by nobody official and completely bullshit sources.

Surely if a 12 to 15 year old is deemed Gillick competent they can consent.

I do feel genuinely sorry for Billie.

Me too - I may be wrong, but I imagine he can be very difficult and I thought the comment about both parents consenting was a pointed warning to her.

If, as it has been suggested, that there is no grounds to think that those under 16 will be immunised without parental consent -as to do so would be counter to all working practice to date, then I think the linked news articles are more culpable for sowing seeds of doubt than the rant of a professional loud mouth by quoting this no name health authority source suggesting that this could be the case and not clearly and robustly discounting the possibility.

*My kids fall into the 12-15 ages range. They are not able to take paracetamol at school without my consent, they cannot go offsite without my consent, I have to give consent to allow them to watch certain videos in school , literally everything requires parental consent, but all of a sudden 12 year olds are deemed competent to consent to a vaccine (which carries risk) and possible long term side effects which are unknown ( and no one who says they’re safe know the long term impacts) and let’s face it will probably face a level of coercion and pressure to have it while at school.
That is completely unacceptable whether or not you agree this age range should be offered it

It must remain parental choice*

I agree completely with millymandymoomoo

Are they going to use Gillick competency to overrule the parents decision? If the parents say no to their child having the jab will they be 'encouraged' in school to have it? I find this deeply troubling for especially 12 and 13 year olds if that's the case.

@x2boys

Well tbh most people with half a brain will realise that schools cannot just force vaccines on kids without parental consent, they can, t even give paracetamol without loads of forms being signed, and how does he think schools can give reluctant teens vaccines without either their consent or their parents? My fourteen year looks about 18 he, s taller than both me and has dad, nobody is easily going to give him a vaccine if he doesnt want it

I suspect the issue is the other way about though. Parents say no but teenager says yes.

It's not about forcing unwilling kids, it's more about listening to what they want as opposed to their parents. It's a tricky area, but not one without precedent. Teenagers views on medical procedures are already taken into account.

There was a thread a few weeks ago on here where a parent objected to a lateral flow test being done as they had not given consent. Lots of people pointed out that the views of the teen would be considered and if they said yes, that overrides the parental consent, equally if a parent says yes, and the teen says no, then it won't happen as consent hasn't been given.

In respect of the op, it shows it's not clear cut. There could possibly be scenarios where teenagers get the vaccine as they consent but their parents didn't. I don't agree with Laurence fox and suspect that it has more to do with a) attempting to stay relevant and b) potential issues with co parenting. But just because he is a test doesn't mean there is a grain of truth somewhere in his view, albeit twisted to his own viewpoint. Censoring that is wrong and dangerous

@x2boys

You are just spoiling for a fight *@hamsterarse*, however in answer to your question, you can have capacity to consent in some areas and not others, so the average 12 has lived through nearly two years of disruption to their education, most will be fully aware of covid and will have heard of the vaccine,, very different to sex and alcohol,.

When my kids were at school I got a letter home to say if they wanted to go on the pill, or get the morning after pill the school would support them and not inform parents. This was a school for 11 to 18 year olds.

I thought it was pretty funny as they wouldn't even give them a paracetamol if they had a headache. I also suggested that giving out condoms on a Friday afternoon would be better than the morning after pill on the Monday morning. I was told that would be encouraging them.

If he's claiming he will stop the children going to school and home educate, doesn't that mean he's actually technically threatening their mother with abducting them? Otherwise, they're just going to miss a Monday morning EOW. And nobody's impressed by 'I WARNED YOU! I told you that I WILL MAKE MY CHILDREN LATE FOR SCHOOL'.

I reckon this all stemmed from her learning about grey rock techniques.

@SusieBob

"Please think that through"

I have. Twitter and Facebook are private companies and they have the right to police them as they see fit, and users on these sites have the right to be protected from the abuse that gets slinged around on them.

I had absolutely no problem with Trump being banned. That twat doesn't deserve an outlet for his poisionous shite. I also have no problems with fuckwits like Hopkins spreading complete misinformation being banned either.

Of course you feel it was fantastic to ban Trump

Of course you think it’s totally fine to hand this power to a commercial company

Even Cambridge Analytics didn’t bother you 🤷‍♀️

I hope you always agree with what Facebook and Twitter decide is The Right Way To Think

[quote hamstersarse]@x2boys

12 year old consent?
Wow, I’m truly horrified that you think that’s ok[/quote]
It's tricky and they have to show they have the capacity to make the decision. But to turn it around, especially with slightly older teenagers why should their views not be taken into account? It's their body. And to ignore that sets a very dangerous idea that their views don't matter.

I am really on the fence about the vaccine should it be offered to12-15 year olds. However, my eldest is capable of making his own mind up. We will discuss it and he knows I will support him with whatever he decides.

Consent for medical treatment for under 16s has been in place for a very long time. Whether the young person is considered capable of consent depends on the nature of the medical procedure. As mentioned by a pp, consent for the HPV vaccine can be given without parental consent, and that is as it should be. If a young person feels they cannot discuss this with their parent and get a decision they are comfortable with, then the parent has failed. It should not be any different for the COVID vaccine than it is for the HPV vaccine.

In the US, children of anti-vaxxers who are under 18 cannot get lifesaving vaccines against polio, tetanus, measles etc. in many states. Is that what we want in the UK?

That’s actually fake news and you know it

I'm aware of OH requirements for NHS front line HCPs. Hep B is mandatory in certain roles.

Are you OK? You don't normally make such bizarre, baseless posts.

He's an out and out racist. He really shouldn't be given the oxygen of publicity but of course all the broadcasters will be falling over themselves to have him come on to spew his views.

I cannot imagine for a moment that if a 12-15 year old turns up at a vaccination centre clearly saying that they want a JCVI recommended vaccine with written consent from their mother that their anti-vaccine father will be able to override it.

I hadn't realised how committed he is to children's health, well-being and education. I'll be interested in his next focus, possibly better ventilation and other COVID management measures in schools to enable all children to be safer at school, especially those with weakened immune systems and pre-existing health conditions whose health might be jeopardised by COVID infection and whom might otherwise face involuntary, hard decisions about home-schooling?