To think dd’s behaviour is a little worrying?

[WhoisRebecca]

Dd, 13 doesn’t really talk about her feelings. She’s extremely mature, conscientious and high achieving and so I haven’t noticed her odd behaviours straight away. She comes across in many ways as perfect - very responsible, on the student council at school, plays an instrument, lots of sensible friends etc.

She has a very strict routine at bedtime and constantly asks me what time it is. She said it’s because she likes to be in bed at 8 and asleep by 9. She sets an alarm for 6.30 am, even in school holidays and when we aren’t going anywhere.

She sometimes seems anxious and tearful but denies that anything is wrong. The current situation in Afghanistan has upset her, but even when I can see tears coming down her face she insists that she’s not crying. She doesn’t like listening to the news as she is extremely sensitive.

She doesn’t like going out with friends, although she does have lots of friends. She went to a sleepover once but got upset because the other girls kept her awake. She likes being at home and staying in our village.

She’s terrified of trains after a Year 6 assembly about the dangers of playing on railway tracks. Dd would never do anything like that, but unfortunately she now does not want to get on a train at all.

She enjoys baking but although she likes fresh bread, scones and cakes, she eats an extremely limited diet. There are lots of foods she doesn’t eat. She’s very slim although I don’t think she’s underweight. She doesn’t seem to have any issues with her body shape or concerns about her appearance- she’s just very fussy and quite controlled about what she will eat.

I’ve had a chat with her, but she just says nothing is wrong. I feel like something is worrying but I can’t quite put my finger on what it is.

I think I would be worried. Needing to keep control over food, sleep, where she goes etc are very worrying traits for a young person. At the moment they are undoubtably limiting but don’t affect her life unduly but if she continues to try to control the outside world by restricting her own experience then she is on a slippery slope to more extreme behaviours. It is not “normal” to have such levels of anxiety and need to control her world.

Resilience is an over used term but being able to adapt to new situations, accept change, acknowledge emotional conflict and deal with real life are essential , healthy skills that we all need to have to live full productive lives.Your daughter needs help.

@WhoisRebecca

She isn’t bad at anything really, she’s not amazing at Art but she’s academic across the board. Once a teacher was going to give a behaviour point to her because she didn’t get dressed after PE quickly enough - but quickly retracted it when she burst into tears. She does extra work at home - translating stories from German into English because she enjoys it. She would hate to fail at anything. Her sister avoids schoolwork at all costs. I do think dd2 feels she has to be the good one.

Well I'd be looking for something extra curricular where she could happily fail iyswim - some sort of sport?

@EnidSpyton me too.

@proopher

I'm autistic and this is extremely similar to how I was as a child. It was my first thought.

Yes. Same here.

Though I generally am not a fan of "Armchair Diagnoses."

Firstly I think you’re doing a wonderful job thinking and caring about your DDs. I wonder if your daughter won’t open up to you because she is concerned to be a further burden on you after your struggles with DD1. I think she’d benefit from support from an adult outside the immediate family paid or otherwise. Hiding periods and early bed times seems a bit of a red flag for wanting to remain child like. While there’s nothing wrong with being young for your age in itself id encourage early intervention if you can afford/find it rather than watch and hope for the best. And ensure your DD knows she is loved and that love is unconditional on any achievements. Wishing you all the very best OP.

It does sound like anxiety mixed with perfectionism. I had a lot of these characteristics myself, some of it 'naturally', and some of it because I had undiagnosed chronic health issues for many years, and was terrified of doing things that might in some way make me ill or aggravate my health problems.I worried about everything - at one point, even about whether the ceiling might suddenly fall in on me! I wonder whether, especially as your dd seems to be badly affected by bad things on the news, the pandemic and associated restrictions and concerns may have increased her anxiety? For example, while some people just are 'homebodies', all the recent emphasis on 'staying at home to save lives' might well have increased her nervousness about going out. And all the concerns about health might also have led to increased concern about eating and sleeping routines- which are often presented to children as important parts of 'staying healthy'. It is a good sign that she has friends and does well in schoolwork, and some of this anxiety may be just a reaction to adolescent hormones; but it might be desirable to keep an eye of the situation due to possible OCD or other anxiety disorders developing.

My first thought was autism too. My DS is autistic and a lot of this rings true.

Might be worth researching autism in girls, which can often manifest in a very different way to boys. Girls are very good at imitating 'correct' social behaviour and masking their condition. As such, frequently get diagnosed much later.

Apologies Op - just seen that you already have some knowledge of autism. Apologies for telling you what you probably already know!

Im hearing signs of Anxiety, OCD tendencies,
Poss eating disorder. She sounds very worried about lots of things, some of which she can / can’t control. I empathise.

Now is the time to seek help

I’d be concerned about ASD, OCD, anxiety. I do think she needs to talk to someone.

OP, my DD was very like yours aged 13. Now diagnosed autistic. Her presentation is completely different to my other child who is far more obviously autistic.

From about aged 13 or 14 my DDs mental health began to deteoriate with anxiety becoming a huge issue and sensory issues around food and her ability to eat at all also a huge problem. Then we moved on to confusion around sexuality and finally an interest in becoming transgender.

Along the way all extra curricular interests have been dropped and my previously popular DD now has very few friends. There came a point when she lost interest in schoolwork though she still does well due to exceptional natural intelligence. Her teachers have never noticed any autistic traits.

Anxiety is a symptom of autism. Just like extreme picky eating.

I wish I had had my DD assessed earlier.

I’m not sure she would talk to someone. She’s very closed. There is a school counsellor but she won’t even admit to me when she’s upset. She is happy a lot of the time and doesn’t usually appear anxious. I’m not sure it’s affecting her everyday life too much.

In terms of food - she enjoys cakes, chocolate, fresh bread and butter, scones and crackers. She doesn’t eat sandwiches, although she loves bread. She won’t eat rice, noodles or oven chips. She likes lasagne and pizza. She will eat sausage rolls. She eats grapes, strawberries, most fruit - though not bananas. She loves a cup of tea. She takes a flask to school so she can have tea at break time.

She’ll eat sausages, but only specific brands. She loves Yorkshire puddings. She doesn’t eat many vegetables- I think she’ll eat peas. She’s not bothered about avoiding fat or anything like that.

Dd15 is still a veg refuser except raw celery sticks which she eats loads off. Basically if she could eat salmon and mash and yogurt every day she would

(she's very athletic tall and slim BTW)

Sounds like OCD?

My Dd has an OCD diagnosis is quite rigid about some things - especially food. She changes the goal posts, too, so you never know where you are

OCD and ASD are not mutually exclusive. OP, maybe just ask for her to be assessed and let the professionals pick apart what names they would give to your DD's behaviour.

I have a 20 year old with mental health issues, OCD, anxiety, and he is fairly academic.
One thing I find fairly worrying from your posts is quite a lot of mentions of how academic she is and that you are 'proud' of her.
It might be worth having a very honest conversation with her that you are worried that she is putting too much pressure on herself to 'perform' and that your only wish for her is happiness and good mental health? And that she can come to you with any problem, however silly? When I approached my troubled 16 year old like that he was able to open up to me a bit and I started to get him some help.
I do agree I think your daughter might be dealing with some bigger issues that need looking at before they escalate. Good luck

Yes I’ll have a chat with her. I don’t want to overstate things though - she isn’t in a constant state of anxiety and she doesn’t seem particularly worried. It looks worse when written in a long list.

I don’t put pressure on her - but I do show I’m pleased when she does well at something. She does seem to genuinely enjoy learning for its own sake and not because I’m telling her to do it. I did have to tell her to stop working over lockdown, as she was trying to do everything perfectly and was spending hours and hours on her work. That pressure was internal to her though, not from me. I am not just proud of her academic achievements, I’m proud because she’s polite and kind, thoughtful and sensitive. I just want to make sure her anxiety doesn’t become a bigger issue.

Just as alternative thought- what happened at her dads to make her not want to go? I don't want to be unnecessarily alarmist, but friends of mine who have had traumatic experiences as kids/teens all coped with it by trying to be in control and 'perfect'. I'm sure it's nothing but can you explore whether something has happened to her? At her dads or elsewhere? I would find it worrying she is so closed. Again I don't want to worry you, this is well-intentioned. Just remember you're doing right by her just to be asking these questions. Big love xxx

Her dad was late taking her to her end of school disco when she finished year 6. The next time she was due to go, she refused, screamed and cried at any attempts to persuade her. She’s been out for tea with him and gone on a day trip quite happily.

Her dad’s house is not up to acceptable standards in my view - they have ten cats and kittens with litter trays inside the house and it smells. Dd likes her home comforts here. I’ve stopped her brother having overnights there, though dd1 is nearly 16 and still chooses to go on occasion, though not every weekend.

She’s just organised her pens and pencils and is writing down new vocabulary into a little notebook. She has a glossary of new words and copies them out with definitions. This is obviously conscientious and a good idea - but it’s mid August so not typical teen behaviour.

@WhoisRebecca

She’s just organised her pens and pencils and is writing down new vocabulary into a little notebook. She has a glossary of new words and copies them out with definitions. This is obviously conscientious and a good idea - but it’s mid August so not typical teen behaviour.

I used to do this but I was lonely and it was in the 70s so not much else to do!! It's quite sweet though, I'd be very impressed if one of mine did this. Is she happy doing it?

She seems to be. I don’t want her to put pressure on herself. I think she does like to feel organised though. She’s agreed to watch a Disney film with me now - we love to watch films together.

@WhoisRebecca

She’s just organised her pens and pencils and is writing down new vocabulary into a little notebook. She has a glossary of new words and copies them out with definitions. This is obviously conscientious and a good idea - but it’s mid August so not typical teen behaviour.

Does she watch studytubers OP? They’re YouTubers like Ruby Granger that study and show what they do to get good grades and the books they’ve read. Sometimes they have daily blogs showing what they’re eating for breakfast and reading in the mornings, how they will write a list before revising and all sorts. That kind of stuff can seem OCD but I’m reality I think it’s pretty harmless, actual OCD is if she would be anxious for not writing the words out. Do you feel she would be anxious and couldn’t get on with her day if she didn’t do these things? Or does she ever re write and re do the things to make the perfect, and if they’re not perfect , does she carry in for hours or have it interrupt her day and mood?

If you’re thinking along those lines keep a tight eye on it. If she’s just having fun with neat handwriting and colour pens then I’m sure she’ll be okay.