To think Eammon Holmes needs to go now

[Hugolugo]

He's always been a chubby misogynist with questionable.comments to make about his wife but now he has compared a woman's afro hair to the fur on an alpaca. Has the world gone completely bloody mad? How come he still has that job? And, no, the 'I have old fashioned northern Irish charm' act doesn't make up for it. I for one am certainly not feeling charmed! I have no idea how Ruth puts up with him tbh.

[quote RobynNora]@EnidSpyton Maybe it was a super unfortunate coincidence that he chose this unusual word to describe a black American woman and he had no idea of the massively racist collocation, but it raised a red flag because a hell of a lot of us do know what it means and he has form for making dodgy comments![/quote]
Meghan Markle is mixed race, not black.

And this is the salient point - to learn something and move on

Who has the global ownership of words and dictionaries? Who can dictate what words can and can't mean?

@mustlovegin who knows what Eamonn Holmes meant. None of us are in his mind (thankfully haha)

But ok, assuming he had no idea of the collocation, it’s not a great thing for a white man to describe a black woman as ‘above her station’ or someone with airs. Even without the n word to follow it, it doesn’t look great.

Do people not know that the same word can be used differently (and sometimes even have a different meaning) in different countries? Can you not for once show a little respect and stop the navel gazing for a minute? The 'educating' brigade is intrusive and massively overbearing

If someone told me that something I said was considered to be racist, I'd listen. That's it. I wouldn't hang on to my God-given right to use a word, regardless of its impact and/or associations. I'd just use a different word, one that wasn't considered to be racist by millions of people, even if those people weren't the ones that I live alongside every day.

And with that, I'm off to bed!

Do people not know that the same word can be used differently (and sometimes even have a different meaning) in different countries? Can you not for once show a little respect and stop the navel gazing for a minute? The 'educating' brigade is intrusive and massively overbearing

Yes, maybe there should just be a list of words posted on billboards for everyone to read which a certain group of people (no one knows who these people are or why they are elected but we must obey if they say this list of words is offensive. Coz someone, somewhere is offended by it) No one can question or refute this otherwise you are a (insert word of their choice) the list is added to daily and we must check it at intervals to ensure nobody offends anybody, anywhere, ever.

I think it's best we just wear gags at all times, then there's nothing to worry about.

That is until they devise a mind-reading device....

I agree he really needs to go.

He's a liability and an embarrassment.

I don't mind him as a presenter but you just can't make silly slip ups like this.

It just means he's not properly prepared or aware of how things are in the current climate.

It's unacceptable to say things like this to someone. If he doesn't realise this then he can not be on live tv anymore

He lost a really well paid job on morning tv because he demanded more money.

The vain, greedy, entitled man was already on £450K a year but he decided he deserved more.

Oh how we all laughed when they called his
Bluff and didn't renew his contract.

@Doublestar but who is suggesting that?

It's not about religiously checking online every morning at 7am to see if there are any new words with racist connotations.

At best it's about being aware and at the least it's about 'I didn't know but now I know'.

Last year there were hundreds of articles online about all of this after the massive drive to 'educate yourself' about every day racism, systemic or structural racism and becoming anti-racist. You'd basically have to only ever use the internet for Mumsnet to have missed it. (Because MN is this strange bubble of the internet where apparently none of that happened and even if it did it doesn't apply to us Brits because didn't you know we're not America and we don't have a racism problem?).

I had no idea that in eenie meanie, it wasn't always Tiggers they were catching. And now I do. Do I know if it's offensive over in the UK when we apparently used Tiger before it was replaced with a racist word and then replaced again with a bouncy disney character? Not really. And I'm not going to spend time trawling the internet over it because I don't even use it so it's a waste of time (for me).

But if I did use it, and someone said it had negative connotations and could offend people then I'd apologise, and I'd stop.

Just like I wouldn't call a gay man a fag even though a fag in the UK is a cigarette because I know it's an American slur.

Fag and uppity are probably good examples to compare. The difference is that "fag" went from Britain to America (and eventually became a cigarette here while eventually becoming a gay slur there) whereas "uppity" came from America to Britain and eventually became associated with a racial slur there.

And to like, hammer home the point, I don't think anyone expects everyone to be an expert on every single word. But I don't think it's a bad thing to stop doing or saying something completely inconsequential to you if it hurts or offends or negatively impacts a minority group? It's not chopping of your own arm or losing half your wages - it's basic respect to another human being and it boggles my mind why some people are so completely against wanting to do this?

Interesting, why

I only learned last year that watermelons and fried chickens can be racist. I had no idea. None.

Just as my American neighbours had no idea about sectarianism. They grew up in a place steeped in racism, we kicked the shit out of each other over religion.

They don't see the flute or orange as oppressive tools in the way I do. And I was oblivious about their discomfort over my KFC and vodka filled watermelon.

What that combo showed was I was common, not racist.

Those defending his use of the word Uppity as not having racist connotations because of the difference between the UK and the USA seem to be forgetting that the woman he was describing is from the USA.

He knew exactly what he was doing.

Some of you are so committed to your refusal to acknowledge that racism is more than just the N word that it's actually laughable.

Are people forgetting that in the wake of the absolute shit show that was 2020, we had every single company under the sun posting black squares and/or pledging their commitment to eradicating racism in their organisation? Did this not include ITV? Is ITV not his employer?

It is utter infantilising bullshit to suggest that he didn't know any better or it wasn't intentional or just "banter". He is a grown man in a professional setting who knows better. The "educate him" argument is crap too. For a start, nobody is obligated to educate anyone but here on this very thread we have multiple people literally spelling out in the clearest possible way why his comments have been rooted in racism yet there is post after post pushing back on what's being said. We are in the age of information and Google is free. At this point, much of this lack of understanding about what's racist is just wilful ignorance as far as I'm concerned. The "education" people claim to be so desperate for is literally everywhere.

@Snoozer11 In America, she's generally deemed as black.

@Clocktopus

It’s a scary world we’re living in now, frightened to do or say anything.

Don't do or say racist things and you'll be fine.

Yup. Don't be racist. Simple

Can't stand the man. Ruth is lovely, no idea what she sees in him.

@Sparklingbrook

This is what he posted on Twitter

Hey everyone out there. if my attempt at being humorous with my friend
@DrZoeWilliams
was misjudged I am mortified and humbly apologise to anyone who was offended

Oh come on, he was joking, can’t anyone take a joke nowadays.

I’m pretty sure Eamon will see the funny side when I joke that he’s a first class prick

Now? Should have gone about 20 years ago.

Oh FFS. It's a joke. It's not racist just because she's black. If she had been white and someone made a hair joke no one would bat an eye lid.

@Spanielstail

Oh FFS. It's a joke. It's not racist just because she's black. If she had been white and someone made a hair joke no one would bat an eye lid.

Why the need to joke about someone's hair? Full stop.

DH just reminded me of this-

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/lostinshowbiz/2010/jul/22/bbc-bans-eamonn-holmes-jokes

Wow - three pages of posts while I've been asleep!

I didnt know the history of the word uppity or a few others discussed in the last few pages. All I know is that I'm fed up to the back teeth of men like EH feeling they have the right to say anything they like to women and that it is alright because it is banter and just an observation and why are people so sensitive etc.

It really does matter to our culture and what is acceptable if one of the best paid people on daytime tv is making these comments - it sets the tone for the rest of the country. Also, just dont comment on the way people look. I made some derogatory (but accurate) comments about the way EH looks further up thread to demonstrate how offensive and unpleasant it can be. The fact that he seems to repeatedly make inappropriate comments, and then go on to make more, tells me he cannot read a country/ room and therefore should not be in his privileged role.

Surely anyone with the responsibility of that job should, at the very least, know how to be responsible?

Where's the petition then?

YANBU. He is a dick.

What’s Dr Zoe saying about it?

I think he's reflective of a whole group of society who don't get it. So while it's unacceptable there's a huge group of people who would also not realise it was a micro aggression - as they would not see anything aggressive what he said.

Oh FFS. It's a joke. It's not racist just because she's black. If she had been white and someone made a hair joke no one would bat an eyelid

This sort of bile frustrates me. Here's an example of why the person in the receiving end of a comment or 'joke' changes the context;

If someone left a banana on the front doorstep of a white person that wouldn't be considered racist - you'd probably just think it was weird.

If someone left a banana on the front doorstep of a black personal would it be so innocent now? Of course not because you know the history behind it and if you don't you must be a fool.

Ffs, the fact you cannot understand this baffles me. Absolutely, a 'joke' changes it's meaning depending on who the recipient is.