To think I've fucked up my children. Feeling really down.

[Theghostofchristmasarse]

I don't know where to start really....Split up with DH over a year ago. Was miserable for a while, about 5 years, him about 3...we were ticking along ok but he just never talked, drank too much, never helped with the kids, obsessed with work..I did everything along with working full time and I'd become resentful and miserable. We both agreed it was over and he was more devastated than me, but we got on with it, he moved out a year ago and he's been dating, me too, but the kids have never known that. He's been happy when dating but miserable when not. He's ok with the kids but doesn't really know how to deal with them. Ok for 24 hrs but can't cope with doing anything else when he's got them.

I've stayed in the house, to be honest not much has changed for them except they go to him two nights a week, he has a nice rental and we are gradually working through the legal stuff. I still do everything for the kids pretty much and work, plus I've got money worries on top of that but I'm still happier, he's been a better dad now he has to be and we are amicable, I bite my lip a lot to make everything ok for them and put myself out for them, things like doing all pick ups and drop offs as he doesn't drive, making sure they have nice days out and little camping breaks as he won't take them away, I am a teacher so I do all holiday childcare etc, he won't take time off so he sees them weekends during the holidays.
On the face of it we are all coping well.
But...DD is 11 and her mental health is shit. Anxiety, she thinks she has ADHD, she's said she thinks she's gay, bi, non binary, trans, all of it, changes every week, none of it is demonstrated in her clothes or who she seems to like, it's all a cry for help I think. I've tried getting help for her, counseling etc which we are waiting for, talking, telling her I love her regardless, doing nice things with her.
DS is 6 and the school recently asked if they could refer him for maybe ADHD or possibly ASD, he has awful trouble sleeping, they both do, I've only just sat down after getting them both to sleep, he has tantrums over the tiniest things, I'm doing what I can to help them but getting anywhere with it all is taking ages. They're both very clingy and attached to me, not surprising really as he was very distant with them, probably still is.
DD started self harming a week ago, I've chased counseling for her and contacted the GP, we've talked about ways of helping her anxiety and sensitivity to noise etc, confiscated her phone as she was talking with a friend about doing it and they were encouraging each other, and I'm trying to set up some control over it as I feel social media etc isn't helping. We've had a great week, baking, painting, camping, took her shopping and to get her ears pierced today, it's been lovely.
But they both just couldn't sleep tonight, it's always bad after they've spent time at their dads, worse as they are there two nights in a row as he won't have them during the week as it's the holidays. I'm exhausted and am trying to keep on top of DIY jobs on the house, getting work done, cleaning, plus days out so we aren't stuck inside.
I just think that if I'd just sucked it up, stayed with him, we could have maybe worked things out. I wouldn't be happy but they might. I spent Saturday at a barbeque with the guy I'm seeing, who is wonderful...had a great time, but there were kids there the same age as DD and DS and I just kept comparing them, thinking if my two were there they'd just be clinging to me, wouldn't interact etc.. there was a girl there the same age and she was so confident, so happy...I don't think DD will ever be like that.

I think I've basically fucked them up. Either because I put up with DH and his sullen, stroppy, disinterest in them and leaving it all to me, or because I got so sad and angry and exhausted because I did it all, or because I wanted out and now their lives have changed and they have to be without him, or me, for several nights.
I just can't see how things will improve, I feel like there's never going to be an improvement. I'm so much happier without him and with my BF, we've been work colleagues for 11 years and we get on so well and he's so patient and wants to eventually be a part of their lives, but I can't see a time when he will be able to, as there's no way I'm introducing anyone to them within the next year or so of course.
I just feel a bit hopeless really, sad my kids have become so anxious and sad and it's my fault. I don't know why I was so selfish to think I could do this, splitting up their family, and us all to come out unscathed.

@Shehasadiamondinthesky

Why do you think it's you, it's far more likely to be his behaviour that has caused them stress.

Or possible ADHD / ADD diagnoses as mentioned in the OP.

Ex doesn't sound great, but not sure how you can link the very specific & challenging issues to him directly.

You have not fucked them up. I’m the child whose parents stayed together for the kids. It was hell. My DD is very quiet and I often compare her to other kids and think she just wouldn’t do that etc. But it’s personality too, we are all different

Op, you sound amazing, don't think I would have dealt with this as well as you. You made a really difficult choice and it sounds like it had affected the children. But that doesn't mean they are forever damaged. All the best people I know have been through something difficult and come out the other side, troubles make us, they give us understanding and with the right support better understanding of ourselves.
At the age of your DC I was totally suicidal (with good reason, I was being enjoying abused at home) I self harmed (though I didn't know that's what it was, I used to bang my head against the wall to drown out the distress I was feeling).
The reason I've come through is that I had protective factors that stopped me going under (parents who loved me, though they made mistakes and were the cause of the problem), I had some positive life experiences and unconditional love from my amazing dog (I literally wouldn't be here if it wasn't for her). Some teachers who were great at teaching critical thinking so helped me get through the gas-lighting, and books which helped me recognise certain paths and actions lead to certain outcomes. At 18 I escaped my situation and was able to heal.
However, growing up happens whatever is going on, and emotional maturity, greater understanding can come out of great pain if you have a way through it and are given the language to frame and understand what you are feeling.
Your DC have a stable and safe loving home, keep giving them the understanding and support you are doing and they will come through.
Would it help them if they didn't sleep at their dads for a while and just saw him during waking hours? I know that might not appeal for various reasons but with also being such an issue it might make the time they are at home easier if it helps their sleep patterns.

Enjoying abused = emotionally abused. Cheers autocorrect for that one!

You are doing a great job and your children are lucky to have you. You should be patting yourself on the back - we have the same career and number of kids and bloody hell, it is not easy even with a partner who pulls his weight. Children face so many challenges - I work with teenagers from "perfect" backgrounds who self-harm, have adhd etc - it isn't caused by you. What your children need is a parent to advocate for them. Chase the counselling, worry about them, show them love. You are doing a great job of that. Is your ex questioning his parenting? Beating himself up? I would guess not. Give yourself a break xxx

I’m really sorry to hear you’re going through this OP.

I am having a similar time with my DD. I would never have thought it a couple of years ago but having read up about asd in girls lots has resonated. She had a few counselling sessions re. anxiety and self harm and the psychologist also thought it could be a possibility.
Mental health wise she has improved actually, better since being back at school last term and the worst of it (so far) coincided with the time she started her period. Similar to your dd she is bright and it has not affected school work as such but I’m worried about exam anxiety.

Anyway, just to say it’s extremely likely these issues could have come up anyway! You’ll never know. Doesn’t sound like staying living with DH would’ve been that good for them anyway!

As an aside things are great with my DH. Not awful, but not great. Since coming round to thinking dd may have asd I am viewing some of my DHs behaviour and traits in a different way, if you know what I mean

I saw this elsewhere today and it made me think of this thread: “Just because you are struggling, doesn’t mean you are failing.”

Parenting is hard. Keep on keeping on

Oh my God you poor love. I don't have much sympathy and empathy for most posters on Mn because most are just inherently stupid, but not yours.

Vent away.

You mustn't think that way. Staying with Dh wouldn't have changed it. He sounds like a waste of space anyway. But you will need support because the next few years till they finish secondary is gonna be tough. I had Dh, my mum and 3 friends to cry to.

Push to get them both diagnosed ASAP. Start a thread in the ASD section and get the very helpful MN'ers to give advice.

Where is school in all of this? The Senco and HoY should be concerned at her self harming already.

I have one ASD son and one ADHD son. I have been happily married to their father for nearly 30 years. It didn't stop our children having issues. So I think blaming yourself for the divorce and your children's issues is probably unjustified. Much more likely is that there are people with issues in your husband's family or your family. These are multi-gene conditions and it may be that your children collected enough genes from one or both of you to tip into these conditions. I can see now that the ADHD came from my side and the ASD from my husband's side.

After an incredibly difficult time our children are coming into their own. Both are at university. Having ASD or ADHD is not a sentence to a miserable life though it certainly makes child rearing harder.

Believe me life for a lot of people with children is not instagram perfect. Many people are struggling through just like you. You can never know what issues people are dealing with. People thought I led a charmed life when the reality was very different.

We applied to CAHMS for DD12 - they got in touch very quickly as she was self harming & claiming to have suicidal thoughts. The lady I spoke to was lovely & referred DD to “ Action For Children”. A friend of mine used to work for them & says they are very good. Still waiting for an appointment but it won’t be as long as for CAHMS.

I just feel like I can't relate to the other mums I know, their kids seem so happy and innocent, well behaved, happy

(I don't mean this to sound snarky, more as a serious point I don't want to sugar coat) but how on earth would you know? My eldest, when people meet him for short periods of time, will comment that he's the most polite, intelligent, interesting, well rounded young man. And he is, in small doses. He has severe ADHD, and while an onlooker might see us in a restaurant looking like the perfect family for two hours, you don't see the struggle we have with him, and he has with himself behind closed doors for the other twenty two hours that day.

Don't compare your family to what you see. I have people on my social media who are "#blessed" when I know they're up to their eyeballs in debt and their daughter is an absolute handful.

Another, always humble bragging about her charity work, and darling children. I found out yesterday that her mother (who looks after them one day a week) has to bring someone else with her every time because the children are so badly behaved that she, as their grandmother, can't handle them on her own.

Have you watched Motherland? You really should. It's great.

People might seem a lot of things. They just hide a lot to keep up appearances. I'm not a #blessed kind of person, but I know we look like the perfect family. DH on a big wage, three children, boy/girl twins ("oh, how lucky!") nice cars etc. I've literally had people say "you've got it all." And the sad thing is, people would love to see us fail, because they think it's not fair that we've got something so enviable compared to them.

DH and DS have ADHD. We nearly split numerous times over covid due to everything just getting on top of us. I'm hard work. DH is hard work. DS is very very very hard work. The twins are wonderful, but only very little. We've argued. A lot. DS has really played up. Our reality is far from the Von Trapps that people seem to think we are. I guess I take a little solace in that we don't look like a total shit show to the untrained eye we're exactly the people who you are thinking, look at those "happy, innocent, well behaved children." I'm one of the mums you think you can't relate too.

Get your ADHD assessments started ASAP. When DS became properly medicated, things improved for him notably.

I questioned a lot of DS behaviour. Thinking I'd fucked him up too. Split from his dad. Didn't feel like I was a good mother. Over compensated with holidays etc to try and make this angry, strangely behaved little boy happy. Then I got his diagnosis. It wasn't me. I mean at times I probably didn't help, but this wasn't a fucked up child, this was a child that I didn't realise had ADHD. And I was trying to square peg him into round holes. Wondering what I'd done so spectacularly badly for him to be nothing like the other children.

Honestly, you've got this. If you ever need an ear about the diagnosis process or anything ADHD related, please feel free to PM me xxx

No, you haven't fucked them up. This divorce was a year ago. That's the minimum time for mourning, for most people, and your kids are mourning not a death, but a nuclear family with Mum and Dad in the house. Never mind that they know full well that things were not good. They did and do, but this is an adjustment period for them. Also, kids are very, very good at blaming divorces on themselves. Tell them over and over again that they had NOTHING to do with this, it was between you and Dad, and that they are not at fault. And do try to find a counselor for BOTH of them, someone that they can utterly trust.

The bottom line is, as hard as things are right now, in the end, it is better to be from a broken home than to live in a broken home.

@chorizoTapas

You have not fucked them up at all!

DD is 11 and her mental health is shit. Anxiety, she thinks she has ADHD, she's said she thinks she's gay, bi, non binary, trans, all of it, changes every week, none of it is demonstrated in her clothes or who she seems to like, it's all a cry for help I think.

I could have wrote this about my own dd (12) It seems to be the thing right now and I think TikTok and social media doesn't help tbh. My dd is currently bi. I try not to make a big thing about any of it but just accept what she says and tell her She can be whoever or whatever she chooses. However, Rightly or wrongly I let her know that what seems very prominent on TikTok doesn't necessarily translate into the real world... i.e she would be hard pressed to find a genuine 'non binary' person in our local village. It seemed to help. I just want her to have an open mind and some perspective as TikTok can make you feel like EVERYONE has a pronoun and everyone is gender fluid for example. I know there are people who genuinely experience this and I don't have a problem with it but 11 year olds are so impressionable I think they need to know tik tok and what they see at school isn't a great representation of real life

I think you're doing the right thing getting her help for adhd and your ds too. You might find if you can get them diagnosed and medicated that they sleep better and relax in general

The other thing I wanted to mention is my kids also come across as bloody miserable at times, try not to compare them to other kids, who knows what they're like behind closed doors.. my lot can put on a right show of innocence when in public but once they're out of earshot of strangers they transform into manic depressive, argumentative little monsters! ;)

I have teenage daughters , and their friends are constantly saying they are bi or another sexuality and then moving from one to the other. These are young teens who have never been on a date, for whom the world of boys and dating seems frightening I think. We live in such a porn soaked culture, there is so much pressure on girls to do well in school and yet also look like a shiny, painted doll. A friend’s teenager has had serious mental health problems including self harm, several friends of my dd have used chest binders and come out as trans, only to now stop and say they are non binary. I think secondary school age children are more confused than ever, more pressured than ever, and live in a much more competitive environment than when I was that age ( and I went to a very academic girls school). Both my 16 year old and a friend’s 13 year old have said that they wish they were growing up in our teenage years, not this .

Socially it is not a good time at all to be growing up as a girl. The girls I mention above are all in families with parents together, and hands on Dads, this is not all down to you or your separation OP. We don’t bring up our children in a little bubble of home. 

You sound like a very caring and thoughtful mother, you are doing your best for your children in tricky circumstances, and you also deserve some joy and happiness.

I think I've basically fucked them up. Either because I put up with DH and his sullen, stroppy, disinterest in them and leaving it all to me, or because I got so sad and angry and exhausted because I did it all, or because I wanted out and now their lives have changed and they have to be without him, or me, for several nights.

Hey xmasarse - YOU HAVE NOT FUCKED YOUR KIDS UP.
Had you stayed, who's to say that these symptoms would not have developed anyway?

It is far, far more likely that their fathers sullen, stroppy disinterest has fucked them up. That Covid & social media haven't helped.

Your kids won't have missed the fact that you did everything before the split, & still do everything now.

Because you are exhausted, & worried, & currently without professional help to give you more understanding & a toolkit out of the present difficulties, you are catastrophising.
Your kids are going through growing pains. You will access proper support for that as soon as you can, & meanwhile ... capable people tend to self-blame, because it gives them a sense of control ("if this is all my fault, I can fix it. If it is other factors ... how the hell can I fix it?")

It sounds to me as if your children are going through a period of adjustment, but also that much of it can be laid at their useless dad's feet. They are worse with sleep etc when they return from his place. He never bothered much with them before the divorce. They know this, & it is going to affect self-esteem.

Keep chasing the support for them as you already are, but meantime - how about some support for you? Can you get some form of counselling, so you have a dispassionate professional to talk to? You need a 'safe place' to vent, to ask for direction, to express your sorrow & fears.

Hold on to the fact that none of us know how our children are going to turn out, & that blips along the way are perfectly normal. AND LAY OF THE SELF-BLAMING MADAM!!!!! Honestly - what more could you be doing? Please get some independent support for yourself, so that you can deal with the anxiety, & start seeing hope & light at the end of the tunnel.

You have done nothing - NOTHING - wrong in divorcing their father.

Oh op I'd give you a hug if I could.

you did the right thing, miserable parents always transfers whether you stay together or not. My children have similar issues and they don't have divorced parents. It's a confusing time in the world to be a child - don't underestimate the impact of covid on their mental health too.

I agree you need to do something for you, that makes you happy, you need support.

ps the support for additional needs/anxiety/sleep issues can really help, I know it's a slog to get there but melatonin helped my DD so much. I hear ADHD medication is really effective too when you get the right combination. We found OT for sensory regulation hugely helpful too.

I think you need to do a bit of care and looking after yourself, OP. You sound exhausted by all you are doing. (And you sound like you're doing a fantastic job). You'll know the saying about putting your oxygen on mask on first, I expect.

First thing is - don't second guess why you've left their father. It was the right thing to do.

Splitting up from their father isn't a bad thing in itself, it will have an impact but it can be handled in a better or not so good way. What the children will need, I would say, is space to talk, vent, let out their emotions, to hear loving honesty and know that you are there for them. Active listening is an art - it can be tricky to let our kids talk, not least because it often brings up our own responses./reactions/worries. We hear our child say they are unhappy (or maybe even something about their anger, that htey hate us) and our first response is fear, guilt, maybe even anger, panic. What we need to do is allow our own emotions to background for a bit to let them work it through. In a way, we need to act for a temporary time as our child's therapist - which mostly means letting them know they are safe and allowing space and time for them to talk.

This book is good:

www.amazon.co.uk/How-Talk-Kids-Will-Listen/dp/1848123094?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

All the best.

Nah, you're not to blame ...loads of people would (from the outside) think we've got those happy confident achieving type kids.. DC 1 has cried ranted and hit and kicked furniture in distress over school work (dyslexia) clicks, taps (and taps and taps) (attention focus hyperactivity issues).. DC2 has been so anxious that they've vomited (several times). DH and I have a rock solid relationship so go figure ...

OP please read your post impartially as a reader. There is no way you could ever say anything to this person except they are an exceptional person who has done everything they can.

You did what you needed to do. Your marriage was intolerable. Your kids have lived with your unhappy relationship and are now, perhaps, showing their own scars as a result of their experiences. There was/is no way you could have shielded them from all of this, they have lived this with you. Have you had any counselling as you appear to not be able to see your own strength, or you certainly write like that? I think you need to get on board with how much you have going on and have got through and perhaps rethink how hard you are on yourself. Also maybe rethink not introducing new stable bloke to your kids, he sounds like he might be a welcome addition to their lives. Please find yourself space to vent though, as you can't keep this much pressure up, you may explode at some point.

Lots of practical advice on here but I wanted to add (as parent of young adults) that childhood years, especially teens, are bound to be rocky, whether you're separated, divorced, single or in any other caring situation. Sometimes you just have to put as much in place as you can and just hold on tight.

You told your dd that Tik Tok doesn't reflect real life but you should remember yourself that neither do the smiling parents you meet with 'perfect' family lives. All sorts of stuff will be going on behind the scenes.

The best advice I can offer is keep close to your dcs and when times are difficult tell them (and yourself) when times are difficult that things will not always be this way. And listen to them without jumpin in. My biggest mistake I think with my dcs was always trying to fix their problems rather than just shutting up hearing them out - it sounds as though you are already good at that.

You have not fucked up your dcs. You are doing fine. I think the world is particularly difficult to grow up in but you are right there beside them.

Look up flare audio calmer for your daughter for her sound sensitivity.
My daughter sounds like yours. She is currently being referred to the paediatrician for an autism assessment. Has she seen an occupational therapist they can help with sound sensitivities? Unfortunately when you have SEN kids you have to push for everything and also suggest what you think it is. My daughter's school never mentioned autism until i did. As others have said autism presents differently with girls. Also with melatonin see if you can get the amount adjusted. You are not alone there are so many of us out there with the same issues x

Also found this article on sleep/sensory issues, might be of use.

What I've found is that my kids' emotional issues have a massive impact on their sensory capacities. And probably vice versa.

www.ahaparenting.com/ask-the-doctor-1/10-year-old-cant-relax-and-sleep-meltdowns-from-noise-lights

I don't know if this will help but my parents "stayed together for the kids" and my sister also had many of the problems you describe in your daughter, and that was with two caring and involved parents rather than just the one.

Try and reframe it OP: you are doing amazing. The problems they are facing are not your fault, but how they are managed are down to you, and you're doing great. Perhaps your kids are neurologically diverse, and would have been regardless. Think of how much you're helping them by being the way you are! Think how awful it would have been if both parents were like your ex-DH! You are doing exactly the opposite of fucking them up. You are parenting the kids that you have, with the individual difficulties that they face, in the best way you can for your family.

It sounds like you have an awful lot on your plate. I wouldn’t worry too much about bf/DIY right now, concentrate on the children.