To not think teens should be “grateful” for things they really don’t want?

[workwoes123]

We’ve just come back from our annual camping holiday. It was not fun : the weather was crap, the activities we planned didn’t work out. DS2 (10) was fine - he’s adaptable, happy go lucky, likes a challenge and he (with DH) just made the best of it. DS1 (14) was a bit of a pain - glued to his phone, cbstantly chatting with his friends / girlfriend, didn’t want to do anything we proposed unless it involved eating out, was clearly bored and barely tolerating the whole thing. He wasn’t rude - just not engaged and clearly just counting down the days till we went home.

DH is really annoyed with him. He was brought up to be grateful for what you get - to enthusiastically eat whatever’s put on your plate (even if it’s horrible), to say “thank you, that’s lovely” for gifts you don’t like, to go along with what other people want to do - whether you want to or not - especially if they are paying for it.

Me? I can see DSs point. It was a shit holiday. The only gratitude I feel is to be back in a house, with tiled floors, toilets and actual beds. Yes, I found his behaviour annoying - but I remember feeling the same on tedious family camping holidays.

Which one of us is BU? Should children be grateful for whatever we give them - whether they want / enjoy it or not?

I'm not sure we do teens any favours if we expect too little of them @PrettyLittleFlies. And I say this as the mother of a 15 year old and a 13 year old who should be called Kevin.

PrettyLittleFlies

I do

But I haven't got much patience and they know about consequences...

I would have been exactly like your DS at that age...

Being a teenager is a bit shit because you are your own person but get to make zero decisions and then are expected to be enthusiastic about shit you've been forced to endure.

I doubt that many of us as adults would do it.

Imagine your DH/DP decided where you went on holiday giving you zero input or autonomy and then they took you to your idea of holiday hell...you kept your mouth shut but distracted yourself as much as possible with your phone and chatting to friends and then you're told that's not good enough...you need to pretend to be actively enjoying it.

As it happens I'm a perfectly reasonable adult - do all the polite things your husband expects but that's because I have agency over most of my life as an adult.

I hated being a child and being subject to other people's decisions and then being expected to pretend to enjoy it.

People are different and your DH needs to see the strengths in that rather than expecting DS to be a clone of himself.

Perhaps DS is independent, strong willed, knows his own mind, is decisive...these are all strengths.

DS being a passive people pleaser might make your DH happier now but it won't set him up for success in real life!

The mistake to me is having the phone on holiday. Only one of you should have taken a phone, just so as to phone if car breaks down, check maybe on opening times or directions for things, and for relatives to be able to contact you were any to be seriously ill.

@newnortherner111

The mistake to me is having the phone on holiday. Only one of you should have taken a phone, just so as to phone if car breaks down, check maybe on opening times or directions for things, and for relatives to be able to contact you were any to be seriously ill.

Ha!

If my DH suggested this we'd never be going on holiday again.

So as a 14 year old (not that we had phones then) I would have had a massive strop about that....and as an adult I would simply not holiday with anyone who wants to impose (IMO) ridiculous and unreasonable rules and control over their holiday companions.

I’d expect them to be civil, but not overtly grateful. They must realise that a camping holiday with rubbish weather isn’t the best fun for anybody.

Difficult age, though. I well remember feeling absolutely no gratitude at sort of age, for being taken on a (compulsory) holiday which consisted largely of driving a very long way to Scotland, and then just driving around it.

My DM was endlessly saying, ‘Stop reading that rubbishy magazine and look at the beautiful scenery!’

I badly wanted to reply, , ‘Stuff the beautiful scenery! It’s so bloody boring!’
But since I’d never have heard the last of it, I didn’t.

To this day I have an aversion to holidays that include a lot of sitting in a bloody car for hours on end.

Your ds didn't need to be grateful but shouldn't have ruined the mood by being grumpy. Next time definitely leave him or arrange an alternative place to stay depending on his maturity and duration of trip.

Not taking a phone would have been cruel. My teenagers love having music at their fingertips and Spotify isn't going to work on non-Internet devices.

@GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER

For me, it was the first holiday I owned a Sony Walkman and headphones. I listened to angst music all the time and my mum was usually telling me to “get those bloody things if your head and look around you!”. Le plus ça change, le plus ça reste la même!

I think having a positive attitude and being able to take the positives from most situations and enjoy little things will take you far in life, and I'd probably be chatting to my teen about that. Not saying they will act that way but it might sink in. You and their dad can model it by talking about the positive things from the holiday, and how much you enjoyed the good parts.

We only went camping as kids and to be honest it never occurred to me to be anything but happy about it! I was always excited for the time together, off school, change of scene, trips to new places. We never ate out but we did get stuff like sugary cereal and marshmallows over a campfire that we wouldn't have normally. Ah life in the 80s

@MMMarmite

I can see both sides. Being polite and making the best of things is a nice quality to develop. But it's not fair to expect fake enthusiasm and forced gratitude, particularly for things he never asked for. He should be able to relax and be himself, so overall I'd agree with you.

Yeah and if he can't be honest and himself with his family then when can he.

@ClemDanFango

Being angry at children for having feelings is ridiculous. If we think something is shit we get the option to not do it but kids have to do shit they don’t like all the time and then people get arsey when they don’t like it

I agree. I felt like that as a child and for who? To make my parents feel better despite the fact I was awkward and uncomfortable and hating every minute!

We are departing to a self catering holiday today with DD 14.
it is raining heavily.

Fortunately our main requirements are wifi, hot water, and a washing machine.

Cannot see why any adult would camp with their children - over the age of about 5.

I don't know if I enjoyed holidays with my family as a teen.
I was the oldest, so, development wise, that brought awkwardness - at least I felt awkward.

In many photos I am in long sleeved clothes and jeans in hot countries.

Of course looking back from the perspective of being 50 in a couple of months I looked fine :)

I think as long as he’s not being actively rude then you and his Dad are the people he should be able to be honest with.

If the holiday was shit then it was shit and it’s ok to be disappointed in that.

Same with gifts/food. As long as he’s polite to the giver then I see no harm in him saying to you or his dad “I don’t know why they’d buy me this” or “I really didn’t like the look of that food”.

Constant fake gratitude is why people end up with twenty years of presents from their partners that they don’t like or surprise trips to somewhere they someone thinks they loved but actually they hated.

Perhaps DS is independent, strong willed, knows his own mind, is decisive...these are all strengths.

yep, DS1 is far from being a people pleaser, I applaud him for it and I believe it will stand him in good stead in the future. He needs to learn to do it a bit more graciously but I wouldn’t want him to lose this attribute. In his more rational moments DH can clearly see the impacts this upbringing has had on both him and his sister, but habits are hard to break.