Excusing bad behaviour because the child ‘gifted and talented’ and bored

[WildWestWanda]

My sister has a ds who she believes to be ‘gifted and talented’

His behaviour has never been great but he is now 9yo and it is getting worse.

Just before the start of the summer holiday my ds was yet again called into school. This time he has kicked a teacher! Apparently the class were having a maths lesson and he kept getting up and running around the classroom. He was repeatedly asked to sit down and eventually lashed out and kicked the teacher!

My ds believes it was because the work wasn’t challenging him and he was bored! Instead of any kind of punishment she has sympathised with him!

It’s getting to the point where I am losing all respect for my sister! She is now upset with me because when she told me about the latest school incident I refused to accept his behaviour was ok. She isn’t doing him any favours at all. He is losing friends at school because of the way he behaves.

apparently the term gifted and talented is no longer used www.theschoolrun.com/gifted-and-talented-explained

G & T is very rare and I have only ever seen 1 G & T child. There is no glass ceiling - schools now provide work that gets progressively harder for those 'rapid graspers' or 'most able'. Maths is so easy to challenge a true G & T child in and school are very well equipped to deal with this since the new curriculum came in. Questions especially in maths are chosen specifically to broaden their knowledge on the same topic but often those who are labelled as G & T can't explain their logic and think maths is about getting an answer, which is really isn't at all.

A friend of mine's son who was definitely gifted also got bored in maths. He sat and occupied himself with his own calculations. He certainly didn't kick the teacher. As far as I remember gifted children are likely to be self motivated.

My DS is 'gifted and talented' and has AS and ADHD and is often bored at school (despite the school's valiant efforts to meet him where he's at) and he's never behaved like that. He wouldn't dream of kicking anyone let alone his teacher.

DS was easily bored at school (he was working 2 years ahead in some subjects) and his behaviour in early primary years was very impulsive and sometimes inappropriate (although thankfully never violent). The usual reinforcement / consequences had minimal effect on his behaviour. I wasn't sure whether the issue was giftedness, ASD or ADHD. It turned out to be all three.

He was not the easiest child to parent, but understanding his needs made things easier, and we got there with years of patience and consistency, and the school helped by providing differentiated work.

His behaviour settled down in adolescence, and as a teenager he has been consistently polite, hard-working and respectful.

It's possible he's gifted and has some other SEN.
My DS was a dead loss at school. Didn't engage, couldn't concentrate, very behind in everything.
No overt defiance or violence but came across as sluggish, half asleep and dull.
It used to frustrate me because I felt certain he was intelligent but the school we're seeing no evidence of that at all. It was as though they had a different child.
Come the lockdown he made really rapid progress in everything and now we home ed.
He's in the process of being assessed for ASD.
Your sis needs to get down to the school and ask what they're doing to manage the behaviour and how she can help.
If she thinks he has a SEN (including high potential) she needs to push for assesment or seek it privately.
If the school is genuinely the wrong setting for him she needs to find something else.

I don’t think I’ve been very clear in my posts.

It is only my sister who calls him gifted and talented. School haven’t given any indication that they think he is.

I don’t think my sister would agree to have him assessed. She refuses to accept that there might be any other cause of his bad behaviour other than him being gifted (in her opinion)

@TheMoth

A lot of parents use the 'oh they're bored' excuse for poor behaviour. It takes a lot of strength to smile, rather than roll my eyes. Lots of us get bored. Jesus christ, I used to have to go to church every Sunday as a kid. It was mind numbing. But I also knew how to behave. How many jobs in life are really boring?

I've not read the whole thread but thanks for this. I'll have a look. My son is really struggling at school. I don't think he's particularly "gifted" as such but at school they're learning adding to 20 and he knows his prime numbers to 1000 (for context) so it's no wonder he's bored. It was quite upsetting reading a lot of the thread before your post .

I should add, he does have SEN too.

@farfallarocks

She should read The Explosive Child and Lost at School. Both extremely interesting and practical. Disappointing to see the usual ‘oh it’s just bad parenting’, give him a wallop nonsense on here.

Definitely meant to quote this comment 🙈😂😂.

So smart people dont have to behave? What is wrong with her!

"It is only my sister who calls him gifted and talented. School haven’t given any indication that they think he is."

So...... It is possible your sister is onto something the school has missed.

BUT if that's the case she should WANT to have him assessed.
She should be really motivated to solve this puzzle of why his attainment and behaviour at school doesn't match the child she knows.
Wouldn't an IQ test normally form part of an Ed Psych assesment?

If the "gifted" thing only gets trotted out as an excuse for bad behaviour then she's doing him a disservice.

I’ve taught some seriously smart pupils over the years. I used to teach a scholarship class of boys applying to Eton, Harrow etc. Not ONCE did any of those highly intelligent boys misbehave because they were bright and bored. They behaved with absolute respect and used to put their hand up for extension tasks if they finished the work. If any of them had kicked me, they’d have lost their place at the school.

Bored children have no right to become rude, bratty, physically violent and disrespectful, despite what your sister is teaching him.

If she doesn’t buck her ideas up and start clamping down on him she’s going to end up with an obnoxious child who thinks he’s better than everyone else.

@twitchyyellow

My son is highly gifted and was doing similar things at school which school (were crap about) but went on about it being because he's too smart etc. He was/is autistic (school denied it was SEN) and he's now in a SEN school with a lot more support than they were giving and funnily enough, he hasn't lashed out once in 2 years.

There is a lot of evidence around dysregulation and G&T but it's also highly correlated with SEN. Any attempts to actually have him assessed to ensure everyone is on the right tracks?

I have taught children that sound just like your son. Unfortunately mainstream schools are not designed to mange this type of child effectively as there is not enough funding / knowledge about how to support them effectively. Special schools tend to not accept them if their achievement academically is high. Double whammy!

What a shilouh, surley as a teacher then you can see straight away this dissent sound like normal behaviour and instead of clamping down, she needs to start thinking "why" this is not neuro typical?.

Op, with the greatest respect, it sounds like non of you suspect sen and it does sound like he has needs that need to be addressed.

Why don't you start to look up asd, adhd etc and see what you think?
Things at least need to be ruled out, perhaps even encouraging her to ask if they feel he is neuro typical?

• as a very quick example let's say he has asd then his "triggers" would be looked at and managed before he started to run round the room kicking people.

My ds was a pain at primary school but we worked constantly with them and backed them. He actually went to a selective school at secondary where he did well, but considering he was in the top 1% in his CATs probably not as well as he should have done.
At the age of 21 he has just got a diagnosis of ADHD. Your sister really needs a educational assessment.

What is PBF syndrome?

It's horrific that it's not been suggested really but they could be thinking about budgets but if a teacher has been attacked then they need to be sort it.

My eldest is a “very able” child as determined by his school and - they don’t use the term G&T any more. It definitely does cause some behavioural issues, for example he is generally very intense, can be argumentative and has quite poor self esteem and confidence, which sounds counter intuitive but 🤷🏻‍♀️ At times at school he can be difficult to motivate and downright lazy (if you ask me!). There is also a massive disparity between his ability to learn and his maturity which I think causes a lot of issues. I have worked carefully with school to make sure that we are doing the right things for him at home as well.

However it is absolutely not an excuse for something like kicking a teaching and running around. Assuming your nephew is gifted, both your sister and the school need to work together to make sure he’s challenged, motivated and knows how to behave appropriately. “Gifted” children are more than capable of understanding that. Also if he is identified as such by the school they should have a programme in place for him. My son is given “challenge” work to do after after he’s completed the tasks given to the rest of the class, for example. Sounds like something isn’t quite right here…particularly that she defends behaviour like kicking!

One of mine is definitely bright and was bored at school.
He never behaved like that in primary. What is going to happen when he is a teen and still bored?

Even though if he is still disruptive and not listening he won’t carry on doing well for very long….

@Littleclue

What is PBF syndrome?

precious first born

@Gladimnotcampinginthisweather

A friend of mine's son who was definitely gifted also got bored in maths. He sat and occupied himself with his own calculations. He certainly didn't kick the teacher. As far as I remember gifted children are likely to be self motivated.

My son was noted as academically G&T when he started senior school about 13 years ago and they did say that he may get bored and his behaviour may reflect him not being challenged.

He never ever behaved like this. He had no other issues, was NT so not sure if that has any impact but The school worked with me to ensure he was challenged in lessons and was well behaved.

To be honest I didn’t really see any benefit in the label so pleased if it has stopped being used.