Sad about DC relationship

[HeyGirlHeyBoy]

I'd love some perspective from parents who've had this and people who've been the kids in this station. I have 2 DS and I know deep down they love one another but there is a lot of squabbling, unkind words, particularly from the oldest towards the youngest. There's no sense of 'looking out for his younger brother'. Just dropped them to camp and eldest just walked on ahead of youngest (5) despite a 100m walk in same direction. I don't want to make them feel they must get on but it does make me sad to see that. He does say he feels youngest is preferred, of course that's not the case, but I hear him out and reassure him etc. Has anyone has this and come through? Is the hands off, bar obviously putting in limits with behaviour, the bear approach or should I be more insistent? Feeling a bit despondent this morning, would appreciate opinions and experiences.

I think this is more common than you'd think. It's pretty normal for the elder sibling to resent the younger one because they feel the younger one is getting the attention that would be lavished upon them if they were still an only child. This tends to lead to bullying at best and outright abuse at worst.

The best advice is to come down like a ton of bricks every time you see the elder child behaving badly toward the younger one. Take the younger one's word above the elder one's if you are unsure who is to blame in any situation. As with "male privilege" and "white privilege" there is such a thing as "eldest privilege" - the eldest child has inherent advantages in every situation and therefore the younger sibling needs to be treated more favourably simply to be treated equally.

You really need to tackle it head on and call it out every time you see it. Otherwise the elder child will see your inaction as a green light to continue his behaviour.

What's the age gap? My sister is 5 years younger than me and we haaaated each other. Full on screaming and fighting over who had more space on the couch, get out of my room, you hit me first!

So much better once I'd moved out and we'd both matured. Now we still have moments but basically have a normal relationship.

Couldn't disagree more with ChainJane. That path leads to real problems.

You can't force them to be pals. The older is not responsible for his brother, that's your job. Stay out of it unless you see overt bad behaviour on either side.

Yes I have this very much in my mind and I do call it out but I feel it's resulting in your second point exacerbating the first iyswim - he feels more and more the younger is favoured and given the benefit of the doubt while he is come down on... Seems to have only fed into the resentment more if that makes sense.. He is adored and was adored before younger sibling arrived at 3 remembers life 'before' etc. He can see too that youngest is incredibly kind hearted and I think this makes it harder again for him and puts him, in his own head, firmly in the 'worst brother' corner . He even said to him once 'Why are you so kind to me when I'm so mean to you?' Now youngest of course plays his part to, riles him up, and is the initiator of bother plenty. I know though if eldest gave the kindest, he'd respond immediately.

It's pretty common for the two to resent each other. The oldest resents the youngest because he feels supplanted. The youngest resents the older one because the older one got here first. I know a pair of twins where the older one resents the younger one (and bullies him). You can't let him get away with it though. Maybe talk to him about it? It's not YB's fault that he's here, and it's not OB's place to punish him. If he does, you will punish OB!

Response to ChainJane above. And yes thistimelastweek, that was my point really. It's a hard one.

Thanks for reassurance TimeforTeaandG! I've read Siblings without Rivalry before and thí K need to root it out again. I feel dh came down too hard on OB in first years, when he was still so young himself, and this has only upped the feeling of being the lesser one.

I found my two developed codes - yes the eldest often came out on top in brute strength but youngest developed powers of manipulation and persuasion. With disputes I tried to be fair but you don't always see exactly what is happening - don't by default punish eldest because that way low self esteem lies. Do lots of sorting it out together. As they got older if I was unsure if youngest could cope I would ask 'do you need me to step in or can you handle this yourself?' I am sensitive to fighting because of my own childhood experiences and I have to know where the boundary lies. Let your eldest be his own man, your youngest will have to win him over, he's not owed anything.

I think it depends on the age gap whether it's appropriate to always take youngest at their word.

My DSC are 9 & 11 and youngest absolutely does play on the fact that they tend to be believed by their Dad more than the eldest. I've witnessed it with my own eyes. I also hate when DH always uses 'you should know better because you're older' when 9 is also perfectly old enough to know better as well. For example the other day there was a squabble about something or nothing, youngest called eldest a name and eldest said one back but apparently eldest should be the one to know better. I don't agree with that, BOTH are old enough to know better and one shouldn't be punished whilst the other is let off simply because he happens to be 2 years younger. If the age gap was much bigger I could understand.

Things like that do make the eldest feel the least favoured and to be honest, from an outsider's perspective I can see why.

How old is the oldest one? Is the age gap simply big enough they are at different stages with different interests? Are you possibly expecting too much of him in terms of your ideals of a brotherly relationship? It sounds a bit harsh but the choice to have a sibling was presumably not your oldest son's, so although you might have had a lovely vision of him 'looking out for his little brother' he might not be on the same page!

I'm probably a bit biased because I'm the eldest one who had got very used to being an only child, who then suddenly felt a responsibility pushed upon me to entertain and almost protect a smaller, annoying, occasionally destructive person who took all the fuss and attention away from me

Unkindness is obviously not OK, so that needs to be stamped out firmly if it occurs, but otherwise I think you need to let them both have space and not expect them to be best buddies. They might well be when they're older! Definitely disagree with the concept of always treating the younger one more favourably regardless of circumstance - what a perfect way to make the oldest feel rejected and replaced - but of course there will be a higher standard of behaviour and thoughtfulness expected from the oldest. Younger siblings can be very effective at winding up elder ones to get a response from parents, so that needs to be dealt with properly too.

Agree completely LordyPie Thanks GoWalkAbout yes YB absolutely has learned plenty of ways to cope himself and I'm sure has learned he often gets the lighter consequence as OB's role in it is more highlighted.

Are they 5 and 8? Quite a difference in interests at that age I would think, it is hard.

How does the youngest feel about the oldest? My younger child really looks up to her big brother, he is less adoring!

Is there a skill the older one has he could try to teach the younger one? Could they do a Lego project together? Would you let them have water pistols or nerf guns and do kids v adults fight or something?

I've got a similar gap, we will sometimes play board games with the older one while the younger one potters as there are quite a few that the 4 year old won't focus for. That's quite a good way of giving them a bit of time.

It will probably get better as they get older. Good luck op!

tinydancer I absolutely went into it with that attitude - owes him nothing, won't force a relationship and I've actually never said 'Look after little brother' etc so hopefully I've done the right thing with that but it was just seeing the small one walking along slowly having been left, probably without a goodbye, and knowing how chuffed he'd be even to hear 'Have a good day', it was a sad image in my head (there had been rowing before leaving so as I say felt a bit down about it).

Thank you OwlinaTree they are 9 and almost 6. Youngest adores Lego but is fabulous to play independently and when eldest tries, he gets frustrated as he (5yo) has his way of doing it.. Exactly, he looks up to him very much, hoping for a crumb! They have nerf guns and love playing on trampling together but it almost always ends in upset.

Trampoline

I was the older sibling here albeit with a much bigger gap (8 years). I’m absolutely not disbelieving you when you say the youngest isn’t favoured but how does your treatment of them both differ?

My mum said she didn’t favour the younger but I became unheard when my sister arrived. There was no rivalry - but once she hit 2/3 life became shit, frankly.

My toys and belongings weren’t respected. We shared a room and she was allowed to take what she liked. She destroyed everything. Drew in my school books. Mashed my cosmetics into the floor.

My mum told her off in the most half hearted way but the general message was ‘you’re the older one, it’s up to you to make it work’ and to basically put up with it.

Every time I tried to tell my mum anything my sister would interrupt and my mum would never stop her. I just felt lost.

I think it’s irreparably damaged our relationship as adults.

I’m not saying this applies entirely to you as it’s an extreme example (without abuse of course) but think about if the older one is being sidelined without you realising it.

Thank you Merryoldgoat I am sorry you had all that to deal with. He was never forced to share, youngest not allowed in his room without asking but yes he does say 'They were my toys first' despite having no interest in them anymore and being allowed put any precious ones away, same with hand me down clothes. Definitely worth keeling that in mind and making sure I haven't slowly allowed 'Don't be silly he's doing no harm' creep in though it can be very annoying as you can imagine if youngest pulls out something untouched for years and there's a blow up!

We have 2 DS four years apart in age. The eldest resents the youngest because the youngest needs more support and attention because of his age, or there are things I can't do with the eldest because I have to be looking after the youngest.

We explain frequently that he got exactly the same attention when he was that age. We also make sure he gets treats that he can have because he's older - staying up to watch a film when the youngest goes to bed, going to a rollercoaster theme park, cinema trips.

You can't force them to like each other, mine rarely do. But I personally insist on looking out for each other - but I insist this to both of them, not just the eldest, even if it's a little meaningless at the age of my youngest.

I recommend the book Siblings Without Rivalry. Loads of great tips for improving relationships and helping them to solve their own problems.

Thank you GaspingGekko all really useful points. And good to know too that I've been doing lots of the same things. I allow all the feelings and yes it's worth emphasising the privileges eldest gets, and he definitely does. It's as if I can't give him enough sometimes. He and I are extremely close and I'm sure he still missing having me completely to himself. I made a point on new arrival at time, to give him daily time just us etc but of course with back to work and now him being much older, that quality time has dwindled plus often he prefers to play with friends.. Hard to get it just right.

I love it Scary hairy, mentioned it above, I'll be pulling it out - again!!

My sibling & I got on really well until the pre teens years. Now we only exchange birthday messages on WhatsApp. We’re late thirties/early forties and there’s a three year gap.

My husband and his brother didn’t get on at all, they have a three year gap as well. Unfortunately it hasn’t become any better. They tolerate each when together which happens infrequently. Only Christmas and such events where their mum says her family life is like the tv show Modern Family. She pretends they are all really close.

Don’t force it and be mindful. At 9 he’s wanting to be more grown up. Eg the camp thing are his friends there or are they in the cool 8-11 activity and he’s doing this babyish one as it takes his 5 year old brother too.

For years my sibling thought that I was favoured-I'm 4yrs younger.

For years I thought that she was the one that was really wanted & I was well, just the 2nd as a lot of people have more than one!

I think it's an age gap where it's easy for the older one to see the younger having stuff done for them , probably still wanting/needing some help themselves but forgetting that they were helped in the same way.

Often of course the younger does "get away" with more in terms of you having been more cautious with the first.

I suspect as well the age gap doesn’t help. 3 is tricky I think as they’re still very needy but more aware than 2 but not able to rationalise when a bit older.

I have two DS with a 5 year gap and it’s different because they both have ASD (and a bit like satellites on different orbits) but there is no way the younger is allowed to encroach on the older’s space but equally the older takes responsibility for some things.

For example if he doesn’t want the little one to play with something he can’t leave it around the living room. Stuff in the living room is fair game.

What are they arguing about? Mine can’t argue (younger is non-verbal) so I can’t quite imagine what the arguments are about.