DD1 and friends coping with poverty in SA

[Allington]

They struggle daily for safety. And for some people food, let alone somewhere safe to live. Even a proper (I.e. Bullet proof) house often has an outside toilet with a tap to wash your hands

No one should live in the circumstances you describe OP.
Can you clarify what your AIBU is though? That people live like this? That other people are ignoring it? That others are complaining about their own situation when your DD has it so much worse?

I'm not clear where your DD currently lives. Or where you live?

@quizqueen

People live in poverty everywhere, yet they still keep producing children.

Lack of affordable/reliable contraception & sufficient education about it It’s not always the woman’s choice It’s still the most reliable/only way to ensure you’re looked after in old age or illness, in some countries Higher infant mortality rate

It was similar in most of Europe only a few generations ago.

@Allington

They struggle daily for safety. And for some people food, let alone somewhere safe to live. Even a proper (I.e. Bullet proof) house often has an outside toilet with a tap to wash your hands

I come from a country where toilets were holes in the ground in the backyard. What's your question exactly, my precious?

@3Britnee You are exactly right! The OP has been incredibly disrespectful and insensitive to the families who are hurting and anxious about what their families are experiencing in SA at the moment. I started a thread because I was worried about my family last night. She has completely hijacked the thread and has ruined what was meant to be a safe space for people to talk about their very valid fears.

OP has anyone ever looked at your overgrown Messiah/white woman saviour complex? The colonial attitude is just below the surface and your smug superiority is nauseating, thinking that you alone can speak out, making assumptions about the background of other MN users.

I come from a country where toilets were holes in the ground in the backyard.
What's your question exactly, my precious?

Yep! That ^ Well said @CastawayQueen

• Black people’s shops are also being looted.
• Black people will lose their jobs.
• Black people will go sleep hungry.
• Black people are also getting hurt in the riots.
• Black and white are standing next to each other trying to protect their properties and family.

AND

• Racism is still a massive problem in SA.
• Poverty is still a massive problem in SA.
• Crime is still a massive problem in SA.

It’s not either/or. It’s ok that people are scared, black or white or any other race. Calling those who are concerned today the white pity party, is nasty and shows that even with all your experience in SA, it didn’t help much with your being. It also implies that you think black people are all on the looters’ side, because today’s fear, worry and grieve is only for the white?
You are wrong. I have boys( nephews) out there in the streets, trying to help the police.
Yes, all the points you raise are things that need to change. But your comments today shows that deep down you are not that far away from the others who like to put POC in boxes that suits your thought patterns, beliefs and agenda.

Allington, I don't understand -- did you adopt your daughter in SA? Do you live there? Is it your daughter or your friends (or her friends?) who are coping with poverty, or someone else?

This (from another confused South African). Where are you, where’s your daughter, how old is she, who specifically are you referring to who is in poverty?

I'm so confused by your post op. Do you live in SA? Can you explain your AIBU a bit more please?

I honestly don’t have a clue if you’re reasonable or unreasonable because your update actually made me more confused. Your daughter doesn’t live in South Africa but some people have outdoor toilets there and contextual offered were made and your daughter got a scholarship?

It’s really not clear what your issue is at all.

Here is a link to the thread that sparked this thread.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4295152-My-heart-is-bleeding-for-my-country-tonight

I'm not clear what the point of the OP's post is other than virtue-signalling and performative wokeism.

[quote TrixieLou]Here is a link to the thread that sparked this thread.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4295152-My-heart-is-bleeding-for-my-country-tonight[/quote]
Very sorry that that's happening but still don't see point of this thread

Ah so is this really a thread about white people in SA shouldn't complain because black people in SA have, and had, it worse?
If you want to get into a hierarchy of oppression then yy that would be correct but as a white person, you don't get absolved from that. In fact, using your DD as a justification for why you're different, shows you're not that far removed from the privilege you're criticising.

However, personally I think opting for hierarchies of oppression misses the nuances and makes it less likely that there will be change. It's odd that you have an inter-racial household and yet have missed the subtleties. Our friends (inter-racial marriage) would never have tried to brush over the difficulties but perhaps they had a deeper understanding of the issues. Or perhaps, because they lived in a nice neighbourhood in SA, they couldn't opt for simplistic answers that said black people didn't have nice houses.
Sometimes broad brush strokes can be helpful but I think they are a misjudgement when dealing with such complicated matters. Life isn't an Avengers' movie. We don't need to divide people into good or bad, with no chance of redemption. Life is more messy than that, and in that mess there is hope for change.

@CastawayQueen OP is trying to make a point. She has said that only white people in SA get sympathy and that everyone ignores what the black citizens of SA go through on a daily basis. She has described what is happening to our families as a ‘pity party’. Apparently people only pay attention when it concerns white people.

OP has a White saviour in Africa mentality. If you are not Black in South Africa, any fears and anxiety you have on crime is irrelevant as it's experienced from a position of privilege.

OP showed very little compassion on separate thread to someone's (White) family who's life and livelihood were under threat in the civil unrest currently in South Africa.

OP implied if you are White and a victim of crime (murder, rape, etc) in South Africa, it should be discounted because Black people are the main victims of crime, so effectively stop worrying and/ or complaining.

What is your AIBU?

I don't understand the point of this thread or what you are trying to say.

Ok, this makes sense - but why is the thread title 'DD1 and friends?'
Is her DD1 back in SA or something?
IMO OP is either unbalanced or in such a hurry to post she hasn't explained herself.
Also other people seem to have more context so I'm just going to unwatch thread as I'm still confused

OP you’re implying only the white people are worried about the riots and therefore implying none of the black people are scared for their lives.

I’d say you seem pretty racist yourself.

OP seems to have assumed everyone's race and decided that only white SA is worried about the current situation. It's oddly reductive. When communities start rioting and looting, it's usually the poorest who suffer most.
OP also seems to have decided that no-one ever worries about SA at any other time. As though there aren't lots of MNers with experience of living in SA, or working in SA or with friends in SA. And as though there aren't lots of NGO staff on MN.

I lived in SA during apartheid. Glad to see that racism has lessened since it ended...oh wait!

OP is a white (British?) woman who lived in SA for a few years, and adopted 2 black girls. She therefor knows all the problems black people are going through. Apparently.
Despite being asked several times to stop being incredibly insensitive on another thread, she continued shouting from her soapbox. Not helping one single person, whether black, white or from another race.

Some of the malls that were looted no doubt would have had black staff employed! I’m sure they were pretty scared!

In the Guardian, there was a photo of a black woman in what I assume was her looted shop, standing with a black police officer, and the despair and fear etched into her face. . .

Are we also meant to believe that if OP was still living her self-admitted cushy white life in SA with all of this going on, that she herself wouldn’t be scared at the riots approaching her community?

Oh no, I’m sure she’d run up to the rioters with open arms and they’d stop after being humbled by her white saviour complex and seeing she has adopted 2 black children.