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AIBU?

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Original poster

Two Child Limit

705 replies

MobilityCat · 09/07/2021 16:00

Will you be affected? Campaigners have lost their legal challenge to the government's two-child limit on welfare payments.
They had argued the policy breached parents' and children's human rights. The Supreme Court dismissed their case.
The rule, which came into force in April 2017, restricts child tax credit and universal credit to the first two children in a family, with a few exceptions.
It was one of George Osborne's most debated austerity measures.
The policy has affected families of about one million children. Campaigners described the decision as "hugely disappointing".
Full story here www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57776103

OP posts:
coulditbecominghome · 09/07/2021 17:30

Also if I was young now I'd be looking to another country for a better life. Far too much financial burden is being thrown at the younger generations & that was pre covid. Luckily mine have EU citizenship.

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 09/07/2021 17:31

I love how the older generation think we shouldn’t support those who want children but we should pay for their care whilst they hold on to massive family homes…..Hmm

StrangeToSee · 09/07/2021 17:32

And the fact is, children are born into these situations, whether there are benefits to help pay for them or not. So should we just shrug and say it's their bad luck that their parents can't afford to pay for them, so they will just have to suffer? That isn't my idea of a civilised society

Isn’t the aim that parents think twice before deciding to try for a third? Knowing there will be no extra benefits and financial support will make many stop at 2.

If a child is suffering because parents can’t afford housing, food, clothing etc then numerous charities and children’s services step in. The parents will also be assessed to ensure they’re not neglecting the children?

MouseholeCat · 09/07/2021 17:32

I'm so uncomfortable with this policy. Life can go tits up at any time, including when you've already had more than 2 kids, and I just don't think it's fair to force kids into poverty for the circumstances they are born in.

This disproportionately impacts women who are more likely to be reliant on welfare while having primary custody of children.

I'm in the US and as a PP said most of the programs, at least in my state, cover kids you have when you enter the program but not more.

I wish people didn't have kids that they can't afford, but the fact is these kids exist and it's not right to punish them for the actions of their parents.

coulditbecominghome · 09/07/2021 17:33

Yes people can have as many children as they want but stop expecting other people to sub this.

DH & I are higher rate tax payers. I'm far happier spending my taxes subsidising children as opposed to companies who won't pay a decent wage.

Also lots of people don't seem happy to pay their own care when older but is that ok to sub?

cogito · 09/07/2021 17:34

It sounds like most of you belief that those who can afford it and those who have a sufficient
savings for change of circumstances should have kids Hmm. So those who face financial barriers need to not have kids I.e poor people because that's who this affects. I usually don't comment but you all sound horrible no empathy. Not everyone is a benefit scrounger

coulditbecominghome · 09/07/2021 17:34

@OnlyFoolsnMothers cross posted, I find it bizarre.

TheBestPlansAlwaysFail · 09/07/2021 17:36

Prefacing this by saying I don't agree with this logic - but these policies tend to be designed with the intention to stop the "wrong" kind of large families, i.e. uneducated, parents have low-skilled jobs. The people implementing them are well aware that most (not all, obviously) degree-educated parents will be able to afford a third or fourth child. The issue there is that those families often limit number of children because both parents have a career and the women often delay having children. Germany, for example, introduced changes to mat leave that very explicitly benefitted highly-trained/educated women but punished unemployed or low-earning women. Long-term, I think the UK will do something similar.

newnortherner111 · 09/07/2021 17:36

How does it work for someone like Mr Johnson, given he probably has fathered more than two children who are presently under 18?

coulditbecominghome · 09/07/2021 17:36

Isn’t the aim that parents think twice before deciding to try for a third? Knowing there will be no extra benefits and financial support will make many stop at 2.

What percentage of people have another child simply for "free money"? It has to be tiny looking at the birth rate & number of net tax payers.
The government just don't want to support people who end up falling on hard times.

Gingerkittykat · 09/07/2021 17:36

Reminds me of that woman from gloucester, unemployed, 11 kids, demanded and got a 6 bedroom house at tax payers expense. I think they knocked 2 houses into one as didn't have any large enough

The feckless parents who have 11 kids are in a teeny tiny minority and shouldn't be used to make policies for everyone.

The benefit cap of 16 666 outside London would make life pretty miserable for this family now I've got mixed feelings about cases like that. Having 11 kids on benefits is wrong but there are 11 kids who will be living in extreme poverty now.

Cam77 · 09/07/2021 17:36

Thing is though it doesn’t stop less well off people from having 3 or 4 kids. What it will do is make the most unequal society in Europe, in which vast regions are already less well off than Poland (and hence why “benefits culture” is an attractive proposition to a small minority in the first place) even more unequal.

By cutting child benefit, you’re not giving poor, undereducated parents “a dose of reality” - you’re just condemning even more children and regions to relative social deprivation.

TheNameTheWebsiteForgot · 09/07/2021 17:37

Whereas I agree people shouldn't be having multiple children when they can ill afford to do so, I also don't want to see child poverty rising. The majority of children who will be affected by this will already have poorer life chances from the day they are born.

viques · 09/07/2021 17:37

@Eviethyme

My friend is struggling with this she had kids with a man who had a great job but he passed away and now she's raising 4 kids 2+(2 under 2 as twins) on hardly anything and can't get help with the 2 babies... Just there nappies along are costing her £15 a week and the formula is £60 a week as she can't BF... Thankfully she gets formula vouchers to help towards but its only £6 a week each which doesn't really dent it
Some people might say that a man with a “great job” and four children should have thought of taking out life insurance, but stable doors etc.

Maybe a thought for any other people with great jobs and children though.

Cam77 · 09/07/2021 17:37

So if that’s your aim, then by all means keep supporting and voting for the Tories “austerity” schemes. Not the kind of society that appeals to me, and I say that as a parent who earns a six figure salary.

coulditbecominghome · 09/07/2021 17:38

The majority of children who will be affected by this will already have poorer life chances from the day they are born.

Absolutely

Foxglovesandlilacs86 · 09/07/2021 17:39

I have 8 children and pay for them myself/ourselves. No help from the government.

I think it’s fair, especially as it was quite well publicised at the time and families that had more than two children already continued to get benefits for them as long as they were born before the cut off.

NoMoreCovidPlease · 09/07/2021 17:39

My parents would have loved having more children but they could only afford one so they only had me. It may be sad but people are responsible for their reproductive choices.

coulditbecominghome · 09/07/2021 17:40

Not the kind of society that appeals to me, and I say that as a parent who earns a six figure salary.

I really don't want to live in a society like this either.

coulditbecominghome · 09/07/2021 17:41

By cutting child benefit, you’re not giving poor, undereducated parents “a dose of reality” - you’re just condemning even more children and regions to relative social deprivation.

well said

woodhill · 09/07/2021 17:41

@NoMoreCovidPlease

My parents would have loved having more children but they could only afford one so they only had me. It may be sad but people are responsible for their reproductive choices.
Have to agree. It's selfish to have too many dc you can't afford
WrongKindOfFace · 09/07/2021 17:43

@Akire

This isn’t a well if they can’t afford don’t have it lark. If you have more than two children and lose your job or become sick or disabled or need to become a carer you will only be able claim for 2 children. Or I don’t know Global pandemic no one could plan for …
If the children were born before 2017 you can claim for as many as you like. It wasn’t a retrospective decision. So if you already have five kids and need to claim benefits you can claim for all of them as long as they were born before 2017.
claralara42 · 09/07/2021 17:43

UK child benefit wasn't very generous anyway, was it? I get CB for 5 children in the EU, it's a nice bit of money every month.

gillysSong · 09/07/2021 17:46

I think it was a bad decision then and still do.
In an ideal world accidents wouldn't happen, women wouldn't be raped, people wouldn't lose hours, or jobs etc.
It's not the child's fault they were born.
Where do I sign.

Cam77 · 09/07/2021 17:47

@NoMoreCovidPlease
The parents will be fine financially - it’s their children who will be screwed. And guess what? In 30 years those same children who having grown up in relative poverty and deprived areas and probably left school at 16 will be making huge decisions of their own.... Do you see the problem here? It’s gesture politics which actually makes the fundamental problems in society worse.