School conducted a LFT on my son, against my consent

[duckme]

We received an email from our school to say that, due to the increase in covid cases, they are going to resume the LFT scheme in school (secondary) rather than at home. They sent an online consent form for parents to complete. I declined consent. I marked the form as such and sent it back electronically. My son was actually isolating until today as his bubble had burst, but I reminded him that he didn't have consent for the tests so he wasn't to have one. I know mistakes can happen and forms can be misplaced so I wanted to make sure he was fully aware of my consent.
He came home today and informed me that he had the test.
He said the whole class was called the the hall. The lady could see on the list that he hasn't got consent and asked him about it. He repeated what I had told him, 'my mom said, I'm not to have one'. The lady then proceeded to lecture him about protecting his family and friends. He is 13 and gave in to the person of authority in front of him. Despite them having explicit instructions to the contrary.
AIBU in being absolutely livid? That person ignored written consent, ignored the verbal consent of my son and then guilted him into having an invasive test.
I'll be contacting the school tomorrow to complain but I'd like to know if my covid fatigue is making me over react a little. But I can't imagine it being ok for a school to override parental consent in this way pre covid! Have we all surrendered all our our rights now? Even our parental ones?

@Macncheeseballs

It is wrong but I think in the scheme of things you need to let it go

Why?

Who did the test? The school or your son?

@ForeverSausages

But surely some sort of "test" would be required, by a medical professional, to determine Gillick competency? Not just someone saying to a 13 year old "don't you care about your friends or family enough to do the test?" This whole thread has blown my mind.

For something as simple as a LFT, all that is needed is for a trained healthcare professional (e.g. school nurse) to have a short conversation in which the child demonstrates that they understand the benefits and potential consequences. For a swab test, a couple of sentences would do it. It's not bloody rocket science - I would expect any 13 yr old without SEN to be deemed competent for the purposes of a LFT.

[quote WhenISnappedAndFarted]@ObviousNameChage he could have been coerced by his Mum, he could have been coerced by teachers, school mates or whoever.

From everything the OP has said the son wasn't bothered and would have done it to get a few minutes out of the classroom.[/quote]
So how far are we willing to go or let things slide ?

Think of any other situation where a school needs parental consent. Parent refuses. Kid says no but is not too bothered. Kid is then pressured into saying yes.

Is that really ok? In any and all situations?

YABVU

And we only have the OPs son's account of what happened. Given his mother's reaction to him having the test, it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if he is trying to deny that he consented freely. He is trying to avoid the inevitable argument that would ensue.

@BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand

And we only have the OPs son's account of what happened. Given his mother's reaction to him having the test, it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if he is trying to deny that he consented freely. He is trying to avoid the inevitable argument that would ensue.

This!

Yanbu. Your response on the consent form should be the final word. Otherwise the school should tell parents they intend to test regardless of parents wishes, then parents who object can consider their response.

What do you plan to do OP?

For something as simple as a LFT, all that is needed is for a trained healthcare professional (e.g. school nurse) to have a short conversation in which the child demonstrates that they understand the benefits and potential consequences.

There aren’t many schools nurses around these days. The VAST majority of schools have teachers and support staff administrating the LFTs. And they are not trained healthcare professionals!

@BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand how do we know it was a trained healthcare professional and that they had a conversation with the child about the benefits and potential consequences?

@BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand

And we only have the OPs son's account of what happened. Given his mother's reaction to him having the test, it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if he is trying to deny that he consented freely. He is trying to avoid the inevitable argument that would ensue.

Her other child is getting tested, which doesn't exactly point to a "biting head off " reaction.

OP's issue is with how the school/the person administering the test dealt with this.

Strangely enough , a lot of school staff agree with her stance on consent, even if they disagree with her opinion on LFT's.

Because it's not about the tests necessarily , it's about the principle of it.

"I really take exception to this. I have always fully supported each of our children's schools. I sent messages of thanks and support throughout lockdown because I genuinely appreciated how much they were doing for the kids."

But you don't appreciate them enough to protect them from covid.

However I do agree if you withheld consent, they should respect that.

It’s not ok. You didn’t give consent. If they were going to do it regardless than asking for consent was pointless.

I would complain as I don’t think overriding your decision is ok.

No, consent shouldn't have been overridden and it was inappropriate to use emotive language to put him under pressure like that. YANBU at all about that.

YA also NBU in that we can't go on like this forever and we need to figure out a workable way to live with an endemic virus.

YAB a bit U for 'I don't agree with them'. We're still in a pandemic. They're not a moral issue. They're tests - imperfect, but better than nothing, and it's not fair to free-ride on other people taking tests to keep you safe but not offering them the same courtesy.

@LH1987

I think some people on this thread are slightly missing the point, no one should be doing anything to or with our children without our consent. I do not agree that a 13 year old is old enough to give consent to anything, particularly something that their parent has said no to.

The law disagrees.

@ForeverSausages

But surely some sort of "test" would be required, by a medical professional, to determine Gillick competency? Not just someone saying to a 13 year old "don't you care about your friends or family enough to do the test?" This whole thread has blown my mind.

Exactly - that's designed to provoke an emotive guilt response, so of course it's coerced consent. I can't think of any other example where someone would think this kind of situation would be okay - I can think of a few where a similar situation ('I don't want to'/'but you really, really should for x, y, z reasons'/'oh, okay then') would provoke outrage, but some people struggle to remove it from the Covid situation. Whether you agree with the refusal to consent is neither here nor there!

Also, to the PP who advised teaching him about 'saying no and body autonomy' if he had said 'no' and was then convinced - seriously unfair statement! He's 13 years old and tried to say no, what more do you want him to do in the face of 'you must have this for the sake of you friends, family, and the 'greater good''?? He tried, he was talked around - again, definition of coercive consent.

@ChloeCrocodile

The tests of competency are clearly laid out and are that an individual must be able to understand the consequences of a decision and be able to communicate his/her decision. Competency for a swab will be a much lower threshold to reach than - say - a kidney transplant.

Teachers and support staff are not sufficiently trained to assess whether a child meets Gillick competency or not! Unless it was a properly trained HCP who decided he was allowed to override his parent’s refusal then it shouldn’t have happened.

Children are not the property of their parents and should be able to make medical decisions when they are competent to do so. But schools should have fuck all to do with it. Teachers do not always know best.

That makes no sense in the context of LFTs.

DoE guidance (copied in an earlier post) is that the school cannot perform an LFT on any child who withholds consent, even if the parent has consented.

To comply with this guidance, the person supervising the tests must be accepting that some children are able to withhold consent. So why would the same person mysteriously not be able to accept when a child gives consent?

TL:DR - if schools accept that children can refuse consent, they must also accept that children can give consent.

‘Think of any other situation where a school needs parental consent. Parent refuses. Kid says no but is not too bothered. Kid is then pressured into saying yes.

Is that really ok? In any and all situations’

What situations are you referring to?

BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand
Most schools haven't seen a school nurse in years and school staff who are delivering lateral flow testing aren't qualified to decide that a child in a fairly public situation is able to overrule their parents' consent form.

BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand The OP's other child has been testing. I don't get the impression that the OP's reaction is because her son might have wanted the test, she's annoyed that after filling in a consent form for an under 16 (which is what the government say should happen), a member of school staff has ignored the consent form.

Had her son expressed that he wanted to do a lateral flow test, the appropriate response would have been to speak to a Head of Year and contact home to obtain the appropriate consent.

Over-riding your consent under any circumstances is disgraceful.

@RealhousewifeofStoke

‘Think of any other situation where a school needs parental consent. Parent refuses. Kid says no but is not too bothered. Kid is then pressured into saying yes.

Is that really ok? In any and all situations’

What situations are you referring to?

I could give examples, but it's irrelevant really. Consent isn't arbitrary.

YANBU. It's wrong to ignore a parent's consent. It doesn't matter WHAT it is for. Covid seems to make everyone think it should have its own set of rules with it.

They sent home a consent form.
You declined to permit this test which was on the consent form as is your right.
They IGNORED it.

That is all. Forget the fact it's about covid. They sent home a form and completely ignored your opinion on your own child. It's wrong and fucking disgusting. Nobody has the right to make that choice on your/your son's behalf.

The fucking end.

Thank you @Rockhopper81. I do think if OP had replaced it with any other medical test, rather than a Covid test, the responses would be different.

The guidance copied below is I think from the guidance for specialist settings (like mine!) where we continue to do twice weekly testing (with appropriate person consent...). It is particularly focused on ensuring informed consent from the child/young person, even when they are aged 16 or over.

The earlier guidance for the short lived testing in all schools was "Testing is voluntary and no child or young person will be tested unless informed consent has been given by the appropriate person and the child and young person is willing to be tested." My bolding.