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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

School conducted a LFT on my son, against my consent

999 replies

duckme · 05/07/2021 19:26

We received an email from our school to say that, due to the increase in covid cases, they are going to resume the LFT scheme in school (secondary) rather than at home. They sent an online consent form for parents to complete. I declined consent. I marked the form as such and sent it back electronically. My son was actually isolating until today as his bubble had burst, but I reminded him that he didn't have consent for the tests so he wasn't to have one. I know mistakes can happen and forms can be misplaced so I wanted to make sure he was fully aware of my consent.
He came home today and informed me that he had the test.
He said the whole class was called the the hall. The lady could see on the list that he hasn't got consent and asked him about it. He repeated what I had told him, 'my mom said, I'm not to have one'. The lady then proceeded to lecture him about protecting his family and friends. He is 13 and gave in to the person of authority in front of him. Despite them having explicit instructions to the contrary.
AIBU in being absolutely livid? That person ignored written consent, ignored the verbal consent of my son and then guilted him into having an invasive test.
I'll be contacting the school tomorrow to complain but I'd like to know if my covid fatigue is making me over react a little. But I can't imagine it being ok for a school to override parental consent in this way pre covid! Have we all surrendered all our our rights now? Even our parental ones?

OP posts:
tedsletterofthelaw · 05/07/2021 21:21

@CoopsMalloops

YANBU. I would be incandescent.

This thread is shocking, covid has broken peoples brains.

My sentiments exactly Confused
greenlynx · 05/07/2021 21:21

YANBU.
The story is obvious. School asked for consent on something, you didn’t give it, they pushed your son to agree knowing that there’s no parental consent. I would be furious and would complain. It’s the matter of principle.

By the way I was in similar situation. I didn’t give consent for DD to have LFT at school. I had reasons for this and put them into email briefly. I’ve got phone call from head of year who offered to provide us tests to do them at home. I agreed. The whole situation was managed calmly and politely.

Sylvan92 · 05/07/2021 21:22

I find it hard to believe this happened.

BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand · 05/07/2021 21:22

If he's 13, and has no SEN, he will be gillick competent to make the choice himself. Your consent or otherwise was always irrelevant, so you should never have told him that you didn't agree to it. You should have left the decision up to him.

The fact that you're kicking off about him going against your decision shows how controlling you are. Your son might well have eagerly marched in and said he wanted the test with no persuasion at all, but he won't tell you that because he doesn't want the inevitable argument.

ChloeCrocodile · 05/07/2021 21:22

OP, I’d ask for the qualifications of the person who authorised him to do the test without your consent. Assessing competency for teenagers to make medical decisions is not something school staff are generally trained to do. If it was a HCP then you probably have to accept that the correct procedure was followed. It is unlikely tho - the vast majority of people doing LFTs in my area are teachers and support staff.

thatisschocking · 05/07/2021 21:22

Assessment of Gillick competence requires an examination of how the child deals with the process of making a decision based on an analysis of the child's ability to understand and assess risks. It is a high test of competence that is more difficult to satisfy the more complex the treatment and its outcomes become.

A person has to be competent to do the assessment - ie guidelines refer to doctor or nurse practitioner. Was it a nurse practioner here? Were they competent to do the assessment, and was the assessment competent? the guidelines clearly state that this is not something to be use to just override a parent's wishes - this is a quote from the guidelines:

Gillick competence is a functional ability to make a decision. It is task specific so more complex procedures require greater levels of competence.

[...] a health professional has to decide whether the child is or is not competent to make that particular decision. It is not just an ability to choose where the child recognizes that there is a choice to be made and is willing to make it. Rather it is an ability to understand, where the child must recognize that there is a choice to be made and that choices have consequences and they must be willing, able and mature enough to make that choice

Assessment of Gillick competence requires an examination of how the child deals with the process of making a decision based on an analysis of the child's ability to understand and assess risks. It is a high test of competence that is more difficult to satisfy the more complex the treatment and its outcomes become. To date no court has found a child in need of life sustaining treatment competent to refuse that treatment. [..]

Sufficient time for the assessment must be allowed by the health professional who needs to be satisfied that a child has fully understood the nature and consequences of the [proposed treatment] and is mature enough to take account of broader health and social factors when making their decision

The right to decide on competence must not be used as a license to disregard the wishes of parents whenever the health professional finds it convenient to do so. Health professionals who behave in this way would be failing to discharge their professional responsibilities and could expect to be disciplined by their professional body.

EleanorOlephantisjustfine · 05/07/2021 21:23

You are being irresponsible and unreasonable. Of course he should have a test. We all have a part to play and that includes your son. How embarrassing for your son to have to say “my mum says no”.

GrannyRose15 · 05/07/2021 21:23

Your son should not have been aggressively persuaded to accept a test. You said no, he said no. Should have been end of.
YANBU - write a strong letter of complaint to the governors.

scrambledcustard · 05/07/2021 21:23

[quote Allington]@scrambledcustard There's a difference between a procedure that has no long term consequences (LFT) and something with long term consequences (a tattoo )[/quote]
No there isn't.

No consent was given. Doesn't matter if they asked him to eat a T bag. No parental consent was given. What was the point in the consent form when they would over ride it any way?

Zandathepanda · 05/07/2021 21:24

OP my healthy Dd age 15 caught an unknown virus in 2020 (possibly covid). She was in hospital a month, had so many cannulas with antivirals some of her veins collapsed, they had to find veins in her feet etc to pump stuff in. Two ‘long lines’ curled up inside her - she was in agony. She’s had mri scans, ct scans, eegs, lumbar punctures,pipes stuck down her throat, so much blood taken . She has been left with a brain injury with frequent seizures.
She’s now vulnerable at school, although double vaccinated. I won’t show her your post. But she really wouldn’t think twice about sticking something up her nose after all she’s gone through.

BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand · 05/07/2021 21:24

A 13 year old is usually sufficiently competent to consent to take medication (e.g. the pill), have an abortion, consent to a vaccine etc. Why on earth would anyone think they couldn't consent to a minimally invasive medical test?

Saltyslug · 05/07/2021 21:24

The school should have respected your decision. Ask the head to look into how this happened as you were explicit in your decision and you’re appalled they went against it. Your son is not 16 or 18 so the decision is yours not your sons

Sparklingbrook · 05/07/2021 21:24

@CoopsMalloops

YANBU. I would be incandescent.

This thread is shocking, covid has broken peoples brains.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56650125

Covid can do that...

Maggiesfarm · 05/07/2021 21:25

@ScaredNotAnxious

He's old enough to consent for himself - he doesn't need your consent. I think he's probably telling you he was pressured into consenting because you disapprove of basic, decent, normal things and he doesn't want to get into it with an irrational person. School staff have none of the time, energy, motive or willing to coerce your son.
Yes.

Well he didn't have to tell you, op. I think if I had been a boy of his age and you were my mother, I would have had it and kept schtum. It seems a silly thing for which parents have to sign a consent form. It's not going to hurt after all.

SemperIdem · 05/07/2021 21:25

Regardless of whether I agree with your lack of consent - they asked for it and you declined. That should have been respected, so yes I think you should complain.

Allington · 05/07/2021 21:25

Really? You can't see that teens should gradually have more choices based on the long term consequences of their choices ?

PumpkinPie2016 · 05/07/2021 21:26

As a parent and a teacher, you are absolutely not being unreasonable! I would be furious in your case!

People asking you why you don't want him to have it -it doesn't matter! The OP, as a parent, has not given consent for her child to have a test. That is it, end of. She didn't give consent.

The person organising had no right to essentially persuade a child to go against his parent's wishes. Many children, if pushed by an adult, would end up agreeing as they may worry they will get into trouble otherwise.

In your shoes OP, I'd be contacting the head.

WhenISnappedAndFarted · 05/07/2021 21:26

Ok so it sounds like he wasn't bothered either way and it was you who decided no. So, it is perfectly possible because he wasn't bothered that he just went with it

BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand · 05/07/2021 21:26

It is a high test of competence that is more difficult to satisfy the more complex the treatment and its outcomes become.

Which means that for a minimally invasive LFT with an extremely low risk of any adverse outcomes, the test is pretty easy to satisfy. Do you really think a 13 yr old can't understand an assess the risks and benefits of a swab test?

Mif4 · 05/07/2021 21:27

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

scrambledcustard · 05/07/2021 21:27

@EleanorOlephantisjustfine

You are being irresponsible and unreasonable. Of course he should have a test. We all have a part to play and that includes your son. How embarrassing for your son to have to say “my mum says no”.
No you play any part you want to. I will play the part for my own family. I or my children owe you fuck all - same as you and your children owe me fuck all. We are not one collective. we are hundreds of thousands of individual families who have spent the past year and half 'playing the part'.

This is massive overreach of a school nurse.

And no it wouldn't have been embarrassing if the school nurse just looked at the consent form and moved on to the next child rather than guilt tripping him to it. Its out of order.

thatisschocking · 05/07/2021 21:27

[quote Allington]@scrambledcustard There's a difference between a procedure that has no long term consequences (LFT) and something with long term consequences (a tattoo )[/quote]
You are saying that you think a teen shoudl be able to decide whehter to do LFT and because you think this, any parent who disagrees is wrong? Can you not see how bonkers your thinking is here?

Do you honestly think you have the ability to decide how other parents should parent, without any knowledge of their lives, their children's individual needs?

frumpety · 05/07/2021 21:28

Again, non of you have any actual evidence or knowledge that her son ‘blatantly overrode’ her wishes.
We don’t know that

We do because he did the test, whilst being fully aware of his Mothers wishes and opinions on LFT's. I actually feel sorry for him, because he was caught between a rock and a hard place, which is never the best place to come at consent from.

BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand · 05/07/2021 21:28

@Saltyslug

The school should have respected your decision. Ask the head to look into how this happened as you were explicit in your decision and you’re appalled they went against it. Your son is not 16 or 18 so the decision is yours not your sons
This is 100% bollocks. You don't have to be 16 or 18 to consent to a medical test, medication or procedure. That's not how it works.

Parents don't fucking own their kids. Once the child has sufficient understanding, it's for the child to decide how they look after their own body.

ObviousNameChage · 05/07/2021 21:28

@BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand

If he's 13, and has no SEN, he will be gillick competent to make the choice himself. Your consent or otherwise was always irrelevant, so you should never have told him that you didn't agree to it. You should have left the decision up to him.

The fact that you're kicking off about him going against your decision shows how controlling you are. Your son might well have eagerly marched in and said he wanted the test with no persuasion at all, but he won't tell you that because he doesn't want the inevitable argument.

If it's irrelevant, why did the school ask for it then?