To be angry with bike shop for selling me a second hand bike as new?

[YellowBellyCat]

I bought an expensive bike last week from a well known National bike shop chain. Bike was reduced from £2700 to £2200 as I was told it was last year’s model. It’s a seriously well specced bike.

Turned up for a club ride yesterday and people there recognised the bike, it’s had custom bar tape put on it which makes it distinctive. Someone who works at the bike shop was there and made a comment about how the bike had won a National Grand Prix. I didn’t click at first and thought he meant that make/model. But later on other people were saying oh that’s x’s old bike. I’ve now found public posts from x on the bike shops fb page dated from 2019 with photos of her with the bike saying how she’s entered numerous races with the bike.

I tried to register it with the manufacturer yesterday on their registration scheme and can’t register it as it’s already registered.

So they’ve basically sold me a 2yo second hand bike and pretended it’s new. Don’t get me wrong…it looks in good condition, they’ve obviously cleaned it well, possibly they’ve put a new chain/cassette on 🤷‍♀️ But I wouldn’t have paid that amount of money for a second hand bike. At the end of the 2019 season another National chain were selling them new for £1900!

I’m going back to the bike shop today to attempt some serious price negotiation but not sure how far I’m going to get. If they don’t budge on price I think I will have to insist on a refund as it’s just making me angry now. A similar spec bike in this year’s models is about 4k though as the bike model has been seriously redesigned and upgraded (disc brakes from rim brakes) and I can’t afford 4k. They’re also all out of stock.

A friend was with me when I bought it and she’s as shocked as me, says she also thought it was a new bike. It was lined up with this year’s bikes.

@tallduckandhandsome

They have offered her a full cash refund if she returns the bike, or £200 store credit (vouchers) if she keeps it

Why is OP angry then?

The bike's the right size and spec for her and she'd have to wait weeks for a new order. And a full refund just gets them off the hook for mis-selling. They'll just sell it to someone else.

Primarily, OP is angry that she bought what she thought was a new bike, discounted because she was told that it was last years stock.

It was neither new nor last years stock.

She would not have paid what she did for a second-hand bike, and she wouldn't have sold her old bike if she hadn't believed that she'd just bought a new one.

If she accepts a refund, she won't be able to go on holiday tomorrow as she will be bike-less. The alternative is an instore voucher, which isn't even the the same amount as which she was deceived into overpaying.

That, and the fact that the head office of Giant, a major, high end bike retailer, are taking the line that their shops defrauding customers isn't their concern.

Morally I think the OP should be offered a hefty discount so she can keep the bike.

However legally she has been offered a full refund to return the bike so has the retailer not fulfilled their legal duty here. She may want to take this further but I'm not sure she has legal grounds to be able to pursue a claim.

The manufacturer also has no liability here. If you bought a Sony tv from John Lewis and found out it was not new you have no recourse to Sony. However you would think they might be sympathetic if it their name is associated with this mess.

She was mis-sold the bike.

It wasn't new nor was it last year's model.

They are trading standards/consumer affairs issue, regardless of whether they offered a refund or not.

The manufacturer also has no liability here. If you bought a Sony tv from John Lewis and found out it was not new you have no recourse to Sony. However you would think they might be sympathetic if it their name is associated with this mess.

The comparison is more buying a Sony Tv from a Sony Shop. The brand of the bike is the same as the name as the shop.

Anyway I really don't have the headspace or energy for it. So although I feel I've paid over the odds I do really like the bike. I've accepted the vouchers.

They did yesterday also offer that I can keep the bike for 12 weeks until new stock comes in and then have a refund and then buy a new bike, so guess that was quite decent of them. Issue is the new model of bike has been upgraded and the rrp for this year's model has increased by about 33%. So it would cost considerably more, though arguably the bike as well as being newer is a better spec. But I don't need the better spec.

Yes, they've offered a refund because they know they don't have a leg to stand on and they're hoping the OP will go away and won't attract any negative attention to the fact that they've sold a secondhand bike as new. But what the OP needs advice on is whether she can legally claim a partial refund, having just discovered that an otherwise ideal bike which she would like to keep is actually a secondhand bike that has been well-used and has already had repairs.

Imagine buying a the perfect handbag/ sofa/ car offered at a slight discount on the basis that it's last year's model, only to discover that someone else has owned and used it for the last two years — and that it was so well-used that it had to be refurbished before it could be passed-off as 'new'. You might want to keep the item, but you'd want the fact that it had been well-used and repaired and that you'd been miss-sold to be reflected in the price. Well, I would, anyway.

OP, they are completely wrong here.

I think you should go to the papers, one of the money/customer service writers that have been recommended.

Companies do this shit because they think they can get away with it.

I have had a couple of run ins with different companies over the years and they are all guff until they realise you are really serious AND annoyed enough to do something about it.

WITHOUT EXCEPTION I have had every single situation rectified with an apology.

They are a disgrace and people spending thousands on bikes need to know.

Go to the papers and see how they feel about their defence of defrauding/misleading customers looks when in print.

Accept deferment of a decision for 9 weeks but inform them that you intend to investigate further have they acted illegally and your intention to contact X journalist.

Years ago I was telling a friend of mine how I had recently been expecting a battle with a large company over some faulty goods when they capitulated.

She explained that most people accept the Fxxk off that they get from customer service when they complain, but when a customer actually tells them NO and they are prepared to cause a stink about what has occurred, they suddenly find the company very amenable.

I have subsequently found my first interaction now to be better to layout that I am their worst nightmare and will cause them a major problem and am bloody minded enough to do it.

They can't be arsed dealing with me, and sort it out quickly.

You should insist on using the bike for 9 weeks and get the new model in exchange plus your 200 voucher.

If they laugh at you, say fine I will go to the papers about Giant's policy of selling old used bikes as new.

Find your anger, do NOT accept this.

Thats a decent offer @YellowBellyCat, is yours the rim braked model?

if so, disc in the wet, is a massive improvement plus the lay up of the frame will be newer, possibly a newer R8000 groupset, better than the 6800 - well, i think so, can get a bigger cassette on it as standard (i need the gears!)

@jasjas1973

Thats a decent offer *@YellowBellyCat*, is yours the rim braked model?

if so, disc in the wet, is a massive improvement plus the lay up of the frame will be newer, possibly a newer R8000 groupset, better than the 6800 - well, i think so, can get a bigger cassette on it as standard (i need the gears!)

Yes, mine's the rim braked model.

But the new one they're getting in is the Langma advanced not the advanced pro. So no carbon wheels. It's £2500. Then looking at another £1000 for carbon wheels. So £3500. Which is £1300 more than what I've paid but yes disc brakes and the new more aero dynamic, lighter Langma frame.

I was talking to a friend yesterday and saying is disc brakes worth the extra money....she reckons no. She rides on rim brakes all year, points out that the pro riders have being riding rim brakes for years down some serious descents. I do 90% of my riding in the flatlands with minimal hills. Certainly not lengthy hills.

I'm a bit lost at group set talk. I get the new one might be better but I think what I have is good enough? I think I can get a bigger cassette on it if I need to - cassette is 11-30, so I might need 11-34. But I think I read that can be put on. I'm not racing, or doing serious riding....I'm a keen, slow amateur pleasure rider who is probably very out classed by her bike as it is! :)

I would have taken this option:
They did yesterday also offer that I can keep the bike for 12 weeks until new stock comes in and then have a refund and then buy a new bike, so guess that was quite decent of them. Issue is the new model of bike has been upgraded and the rrp for this year's model has increased by about 33%. So it would cost considerably more, though arguably the bike as well as being newer is a better spec. But I don't need the better spec.
You would be getting a brand new, straight out of the box bicycle that would be registered as yours and not someone else's bike. They should then offer you a discount on the new bike due to the hassle they and only they put you through.

@YellowBellyCat Yes rim work perfectly well but sooner rather than later, hi quality rim braked wheels will be history and spares harder to get hold of, rims brakes do wear out the rims so you'll need new wheels eventually.
Disc wheels allow for bigger tires, which are better for uk crappy roads too.
If its the older groupset, then 11-30 is (usually) the max unless you change the rear derailleur.

£1300 is a lot but you may be able to get a discount, offer them 1k and go for the "better" newer bike! You know it makes sense!!

Infuriating. I think as they have admitted that the bike was not new, and you have plenty of evidence of it being used, all you can do is leave reviews EVERYWHERE warning others not to be caught out like you have been.

Sorry @LookItsMeAgain you beat me too it!

As they say @jasjas1973 - great minds think alike :)

Lol! not always in my case!

OP, glad you've got an acceptable solution, but I'm gobsmacked at their deceit.

If someone has been riding the bike, then it is secondhand and should have been priced accordingly. I can just imagine a car salesroom trying to get away with that one! And failing.

Enjoy your holiday OP, whatever else happens.

I think you've handled this well by being assertive but not going at it like a dog with a bone.

Bloody annoyed on your behalf though.

Hope you enjoy your bike. Lincolnshire is a big place but a small community and I'm sure word will get around regardless, you will have to perfect your wry smile.

I'd suggest that they as a gesture of goodwill sell you the brand new updated model at a reduced price.

You know full well they'll be making massive profits on it. You also know come the end of season they'll be selling it reduced.

Now they’ve conceded this, they know they don’t have a leg to stand on.
They will go further if you force them to.

How will they sell your bike when you return it in 12 weeks?

They are still trying to get more money from you. Stand your ground.

I don’t think rim brakes will entirely go out. Discs are a bit of a fashion IMO. And if they do it’ll be donkeys years.

I also don’t think you’ve paid over the odds, particularly. It was well dodgy what they did but that’s a separate issue. Langmas don’t tend to be 34’s do they? I have a 34 but mines an Avail.

Meh, I have a 2019 Liv avail Advanced 2 that I paid 1250 for in the sale but have spent 800 on upgrading the wheels. It has disc brakes but your rims and ultegra instead of 105 will be lighter 🤷🏻‍♀️. Someone else would have bought it anyway.

I'd use it for the cycling holiday and then get a full refund. If it's good for them then I don't see why it shouldn't be good for you

I've just been relaying this to my DH as he is a biker. He recommends naming and shaming all over the forums. Singletrackworld being the main one he uses and has lots of folk on.

If I was you I'd go for a discount and keep it, it obviously in good condition because you didn't notice any paint scratches on it. 1000 miles is nothing,, thats 2 months riding for me. As long as the cables/brakes pads have been renewed sound like a great bike.

As to 2nd hand- I suspect he may be right if it was not 'sold' to the staff member but it should have been said it was ex-demo where demo meant it went out for weekend not just the car-park.

WRT to carbone wearing out, yes and there are horror stories but I have mate riding a 1st generation carbon TCR which has got to be at least 20yrs old.

Wow, wow, wow. Just read the whole thread aghast. Never thought I’d post a mumsnet thread on my cycling forums, but I am going to post this one, Giant have a shop where I live too and are a popular local choice. Personally I am a Canyon fan but my new bike just arrived yesterday after I ordered it in January! So totally understand the issue with waiting for a new bike. I hope you enjoy your bike after all this though.