To feel uncomfortable with celebrity surrogacy?

[Username91]

After reading about Amber Herd having a baby girl via surrogate it just got me thinking about the amount of famous people who have children this way. I have nothing against surrogacy, it just seems to me that a lot of rich women choose to have children this way and I’m not convinced they ALL have problems carrying children themselves. I find it a bit disturbing and wondered if I’m alone in thinking this?

Once again I’d like to point out I’m not surrogacy bashing here. I just don’t think it should be something that is used by women with money as they don’t like the idea of carrying their own babies, of course it’s very different for women who struggle to conceive/carry themselves.

@Youdiditanyway

Ronaldo situation is outright bizarre. He did eventually marry and have a child with his wife but decided to have three children as a single man through a surrogate first? Weird.

Yes really weird

I always thought his girlfriends were beards and assumed he had babies through surrogate to provide grandchildren as otherwise he would never have had kids

The picture of amber heard and her baby was so fake
It’s set up to look like she’s lying in bed against a pillow with her newborn lying on her as if she’d just given birth , obviously reality couldn’t be further from this.

Fake and sterile

@Youdiditanyway

I don’t believe both Kim and Khloe Kardashian have medical issues and ‘need’ to use a surrogate. Kim already had 2 children, she didn’t need to have 2 more and Khloe has 1 so again, doesn’t need to have another. They haven’t disclosed exactly what the issues are but I think most women (if this were true) would just be happy with their existing children rather than paying a poor woman to carry their next child.

Amber Heard story is a bit weird. Mid 30s, maybe has medical issues but again seems more like she doesn’t want stretch marks so has paid another woman to do that for her… In her position I’d be more inclined to adopt if I were truly desperate to have a child but maybe that’s just me.

I don’t agree with surrogacy on the whole either. I think it’s different if it’s a close relative who offers to carry the baby for someone who cannot do it, that is pure altruism with zero financial benefit. Renting a poor woman’s womb seems unethical.

I think Kim K had placenta acreta and pre eclampsia (definitely with her first who was born at 34 weeks and from pap photos of that pregnancy she did look swollen) but yeah you’re right, she had 2 children already, was there a need for more- Absolutely not. Whilst I know it’s not verified, there have been many reports about the strict list of conditions her surrogates had to adhere to which has an exploitative feel. Khloe used a surrogate this far just sounds like I don’t want to gain weight 🤷‍♀️

@Pinuporc

I think it can be quite exploitative to vulnerable women (even in this country) and is not always in a babys best interest.

I agree. 100%

It is not always poor women acting as surrogates. I have a friend who was a surrogate. She loved being pregnant, wanted to give back and knew a couple who could not get pregnant themselves. My friend is a nurse, living in the US, so not poor, or poorly educated. She carried two children for that couple and describes it as the most rewarding thing she ever did.

For movie stars - being pregnant may mean losing work, so I can see why surrogacy would be attractive.

@TinaYouFatLard

All surrogacy is a hideous business. Nobody should be able to rent a woman’s body or buy a baby.

Do you ever hear of a rich, famous woman carrying a baby for a poorer woman? It’s exploitative and revolting.

This

@VestaTilley

YANBU, but I don’t agree with surrogacy at all.

It trafficks babies away from their mothers, exploits the poverty of women in favour of richer women and men or male couples, and commodifies babies and motherhood.

It’s an inherently misogynistic practice, as the birth mother is left recovering, bleeding, often damaged while the parents whisk the baby away, no effects on them.

There have been several stories of American and Chinese babies born to Ukrainian and other national mothers abandoned because they’re disabled.

It is unethical in the extreme, and it’s a sign of how sadly our society has become so permissive and unhealthy that so many people think this is a progressive thing to do. It isn’t.

There’s a lobby here pushing for the liberalisation of surrogacy laws. An all male panel of law commissioners produced an appalling biased consultation last year which didn’t take the needs of mothers and babies in to account at all- all viewed from the male perspective.

To say nothing of the poor babies left unbonded with when COVID meant they were left in hospitals and orphanages for weeks.

Just because you’re rich you shouldn’t get to buy a baby. It should be illegal.

I agree with every word of this. And for those who think it’s not harming anyone else so we should butt out…individual women can make choices which harm women as a class by reinforcing the view that a woman’s body is something to be commodified.

What about Hilaria Baldwin who was very pregnant when they impregnated a surrogate. The suggestion is that they did it to ensure they had another girl.

She clearly wasn't infertile as she already had 5 kids.

Or the 20 something woman in Georgia with a much older husband who had 10 surrogate babies in 12 months? She already had one (so able to be pregnant) and it only cost her £1000 per baby (which is a lot of money for those women who's womb she rented)

I'm more ok with a cousin or sister helping a family member to have a baby.

I was pro surrogacy or at best indifferent as I had not given it that much thought. In balance I am now anti it with the exception of freely given altruistic surrogacy between sisters for example although even that brings up ethical issues.

She carried two children for that couple and describes it as the most rewarding thing she ever did

It's only women who have been socialised to such an extent that the best thing they think they've done is for the benefit of someone else with a huge risk to their own health.

Surrogacy makes me feel incredibly uncomfortable.

Human babies learn their mother's voice, heartbeat, scent and they are calmed and quietened by the sounds and people they have known through their time in the womb. To disregard and deny that this is important to the child, and that the commissioning parents need to be parents outweighs the baby's need to be cared for by the woman who gestates them is wrong imo. We know there are circumstances where the risk vs benefit decision is different in the case of care proceedings and adoptions BUT this should be avoided not deliberately created.

The argument about bodily autonomy and choice is absolute nonsense. You don't find women of independent means and opportunity arguing for the right to be a commercial surrogate.

The Ronaldo thing is particularly strange. MJ did similar didn’t he?

Probably going to articulate this poorly but it’s the driver to have a child that is ‘biologically yours’ above all else, including ethics both medical and more general that makes me feel uneasy.

Which makes MJ even weirder, as those kids aren't biologically his

@Twizbe

What about Hilaria Baldwin who was very pregnant when they impregnated a surrogate. The suggestion is that they did it to ensure they had another girl.

She clearly wasn't infertile as she already had 5 kids.

Or the 20 something woman in Georgia with a much older husband who had 10 surrogate babies in 12 months? She already had one (so able to be pregnant) and it only cost her £1000 per baby (which is a lot of money for those women who's womb she rented)

I'm more ok with a cousin or sister helping a family member to have a baby.

This^^ the Hilaria Baldwin thing, when she was already pregnant just to have a girl. Plain consumerism at the end of the day

I'm against surrogacy. It's baby farming and inhumane.

Once you have grown and birthed a child you are attracted to this child. Your hormones ensure that you will take care of this child... I can't imagine anyone (even the white wash surrogates) not thinking/ wondering about the little human being they have carried for 9 months.

@MolyHolyGuacamole

The Ronaldo thing is particularly strange. MJ did similar didn’t he?

Probably going to articulate this poorly but it’s the driver to have a child that is ‘biologically yours’ above all else, including ethics both medical and more general that makes me feel uneasy.

Which makes MJ even weirder, as those kids aren't biologically his

Are they not? I thought one was. Either way yeeeesssh. Basically just bought a baby.

I'm very skeptical of the stories about surrogates who found the experience amazing and had absolutely no motives for doing it besides enjoying being pregnant. Very.

I'm anti-surrogacy or at least the concept of paid for surrogacy.

I think(?) I'm okay with the British way of handling it as it means it's limited to women who really want to do it without any potential for economic coercion.

I absolutely think it should be like organ donation where you cannot be paid/pay.

@Moorelewis

All the people saying surrogacy is essentially 'buying a baby', then what is IVF?

Again, in the UK you cannot be paid anything other than expenses for sperm or eggs for the same reason.

In my opinion these mega rich celebs see babies as commodities

This is perhaps the biggest challenge celebrit babies face - not how they came into being but why

YANBU. It's buying and selling babies at the end of the day.

I don't really have a problem if it's done within families, e.g. the pp who said her cousin was a surrogate for her sister. As long as there is honesty and family connection/love, I feel like that could work. But buying a baby should not be morally acceptable. It's disturbing how this has become a 'thing'.

A lot of gay/trans couples seem to be doing this now as well.

If she did without having a medical reason why sheer couldn't carry the baby herself, I have a problem.

If the surrogate hasn't completed her own family, doesn't have a history of easy births or comes from a very low income background, I have a problem.

Otherwise, I don't.

And no….there are no wealthy educated women being surrogates

Well there are no wealthy educated women lots of jobs, that many do for pay because we all need money to live.

And to be clear, I find surrogacy exploitative, but I don't get this argument.

Maybe all work is exploitative...certainly feels like it to me 🤷🏽‍♀️

Commoditisation of less well off and poorer women's bodies again. How many wealthy women take money to be a surrogate?

There is no right to another human being's body (adult or child) and "choice" is moot when its generally poor or at least poorer women with less life changes being procured for surrogacy

"Results: Although children born through reproductive donation obtained SDQ scores within the normal range, surrogacy children showed higher levels of adjustment difficulties at age 7 than children conceived by gamete donation. Mothers who had kept their child’s origins secret showed elevated levels of distress. However, maternal distress had a more negative impact on children who were aware of their origins. Conclusions: The absence of a gestational connection to the mother may be more problematic for children than the absence of a genetic link."

@CP26 thanks for posting a link to research. Above is from the first page of the report. Which to me seems more nuanced rather than completely positive regarding surrogacy.

there are no wealthy educated women being surrogates

Interestingly, there are plenty of educated women who will probably quite soon be wealthy who have been egg donors while at college.

Wealthy educated women tend to have spent their most fertile years working. They're not necessarily against being a surrogate, that chance to carry children has just gone for them.

You'll loooove actress Lucy Liu's explanation for using a surrogate. people.com/parents/lucy-liu-gestational-surrogate-son-rockwell/

“It just seemed like the right option for me because I was working and I didn’t know when I was going to be able to stop,”

Ah, too busy, let someone else do it all.