Aibu to think most people don't smack their children

[sqirrelfriends]

So I just read a daily mail article (I know it's trash, please don't judge me) that's saying that experts are calling for smacking to be banned in England.

The comments section really surprised me, I don't know anyone who smacks their kids but it's overflowing with people saying that its the only way to control children and that half the prison population are there because they weren't smacked. Anyone saying that its wrong to physically punish a child is downvoted into oblivion.

Am I wrong to think this should have been illegal a long time ago? It's just seems wrong to be and my understanding was that kids who have been hit are more likely to be violent themselves.

My DM has always said (since my siblings and I were adults) that she always felt that my F smacked us too hard. She never challenged him at the time, though, and she herself smacked us albeit less hard.

It meant that we thought that she was part of it. Especially since she once spelt it out to us that she loved him more than us (no idea why).

And now she wonders why my DSis and I didn’t tell us that our F was also sexually abusing us.

Smacking creates an atmosphere of fear and means that your DC won’t feel safe enough to tell you if something bad is happening.

Wouldn't even cross my mind to physically hurt my baby, who you protect since the day you have them

If I had a partner treat me the way my DDs treated me at times I would have left them. DDs are adopted and had some very extreme behaviours due to early trauma.

How long can you cope with hostility and violence and return it with care and understanding?

Yes, I knew why they were acting that way. But on two occasions I (very briefly) was not able to be a punch bag

And yes, if someone was struggling and reacted against (in a split second with a slap) a partner because they were triggered by a past experience, for example, and immediately apologised and owned that they shouldn't have done it - yes, reason to leave or to stay, depending on the rest if the relationship.

If it is overwhelmingly supportive year in, year out, despite the partners difficult behaviour, then perhaps it is an overall positive relationship, even if the other reacts every few years

I remember when I was 6 in the 80's. My mum was heavily pregnant with my step brother. Me and my elder sister were being awful. I can't remember what we were doing but I clearly and vividly remember my mum sitting there in floods of tears crying for us to stop (we were typical very close in age sisters, hating the crap out of each other) and my mum snapped. She grabbed the poker from the open fire and screamed "Don't you dare make this baby come early!" I must say now she did NOT hit us with it.

Anyhoo...fast forward a couple of years and my stepdad wanted to adopt me and my sister. So going through the formal process we had a lady come see us to sit us down and have a talk. We were sitting there and the lady asked "Does Mummy and Daddy ever hit or smack you?" We both said no (because they didn't), but then the truthful 8 year old me said: "They don't smack us, but mummy did grab the poker and scared us with it!"

My poor Mum was in bits!!!!!

I thought it was banned. Shows what I know.

I never smacked mine and don't know anyone who did or does smack.

All I am saying is that today's society is over tolerant of poor behaviour from children, and that smacking should not elicit the horrified reaction that it does from so many people.

Whether either of these points are right or wrong, why are you conflating 2 totally separate issues in an attempt to justify bullying @Lilypansy?

The fact is that we’ve gone from smacking being seen as a pretty normal part of parenting, to being seen as awful, in a fairly short space of time. So it’s not surprising there’s a large variety of views out there.

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

If someone's partner was demanding that their partner was meeting their every need and demand, and having a tantrum if they didn't, would you say they should accommodate those demands? Or would you say LTB?

If LTB, then on you r comparison if a toddler behaves like a toddler then the parent should abandon them (LTB)?

If someone's partner was demanding that their partner was meeting their every need and demand, and having a tantrum if they didn't, would you say they should accommodate those demands? Or would you say LTB?

Well, one thing you wouldn’t advise would be to give their partner a good hiding.

@Lilypansy

Utterly horrified by @Lilypansy comments, until the part when she admitted she hit her children when they were small. Of course her comments make sense now.

Thank you. I doubt she will see it, but her overly simplistic understanding and approach to this is serving as an excellent illustration of why smacking is poor parenting. It literally discourages reasoning, on all sides!
Actually no, I am quite open to reason. All I am saying is that today's society is over tolerant of poor behaviour from children, and that smacking should not elicit the horrified reaction that it does from so many people. Smacking was not the only technique I used with my own children. There was plenty of explaining why something was wrong, without smacking, but they were wary of crossing boundaries, which I don't see from many children today.
Also that there is an arrogance in so many people claiming that they 'know better,' even when they haven't yet finished bringing up their own children.
If smacking was so terrible and caused such problems, there ought to be a whole generation of people of my age with mental health issues. Clearly, this is not the case.
In addition to bringing up my own children, I am also a retired teacher with over 30 years of experience with children.

I'm glad you're not teaching now. Attitudes like yours towards hitting children are no longer welcome and I don't want anyone with your outlook teaching my daughter. It's no longer the 1970s. We do not use pain and intimidation as a means of explaining complex concepts to young children. We do not look at wayward teens and think that the only thing wrong was that they weren't hit when they were small.

And with no ageism or disrespect meant, there are plenty of mental health issues within your generation, though there has been less understanding and recognition of it in the past. Plenty of people who hit their children had mental health problems (not really surprising among hitters), frequently as a result of being hit themselves. I was raised by these people and so were many of my peers. I'm a millennial and we are always being sneered at for our apparently imaginary mental health problems and supposed lack of resilience. But we were largely raised by smackers...

You think it's arrogant to think we know better when we've spent the last 30-40 years seeing the results of smacking, even on ourselves? Even if our own children are young, we still remember what it was like for us. And we don't want to do it. Arrogance is seeing an entire generation reject the techniques you used on them, and still thinking you knew best.

It must be hard to accept that the techniques you used that seemed normal were in fact harmful, base and stultifying, but many other people have managed to look back with hindsight and realise that they would do it differently now.

No, but you wouldn't have to get into that situation. The early signs of such self centeredness you walk away. Before you have kids/a shared home.

Whereas with toddlers you don't get to walk away. That doesn't excuse a 'good hiding' and haven't said that. But if you have no break then I can understand why you might give a slap in the heat of the moment - and feel terrible afterwards.

Of course the ideal would be that having reached that point you could access help and break. But the reality is too many parents have no-one stepping up to give them a break

I’d be really surprised if it was still common. I wouldn’t hit my children and I honestly don’t think anyone I know would. But as PPs have pointed out, I suppose you gravitate towards similar people.

I was smacked (well, hit) all the time in the 80s and 90s, as was my husband by his parents.

Well, actually, you should walk away if you’re in a state where you might lash out at a toddler whilst making sure that they can’t hurt themselves. This is where the advice to count to 10 is appropriate.

The only way I’d hit my son was if I lost control and would have failed him.
Time out was very effective.
And of course lots of deserved praise when he got it right.
I know people who did give kids smack bottoms because that’s what mums did back in the 50’s
They are horrified now, glad things have changed and grateful that they get to see grandchildren, who they wouldn’t dream of smacking.

Dealing with a toddler’s tantrum is completely different to arguing with a partner anyway, so it’s impossible to compare the two. Toddlers aren’t setting out to press your buttons, so they can’t be held responsible in the same way.

I find backchat from my older DDs (12 and 9) much more maddening than I did their tantrums when they were toddlers, actually.

Anyone that thinks people don’t still smack their kids is a bit deluded tbh.

I definitely try to avoid smacking but I feel the need to almost defend it on posts like these, with some of the hysterical posts on here

Smacking or tapping or swatting will not make your child hate you and whatever else.

Smacking with a twang/leaving redness and beating your kids (with implements or hands) will affect your kids. Not the same.

I lightly smacked (yes, really) my DD when we were on the balcony and she was swinging on the edge. Me saying "get down, darling" wouldn't have got the job done. It didn't hurt and she never did it again as she knew I was serious.

It shouldn't be your go-to but it's not the end of the world ffs.

LizzieW1969 I'm so sorry you had to go through that

@minipie

The fact is that we’ve gone from smacking being seen as a pretty normal part of parenting, to being seen as awful, in a fairly short space of time. So it’s not surprising there’s a large variety of views out there.

Yes, it's happened quickly. The generation that thought it was fine has managed to raise a generation that thinks it isn't.

Funny, that!

Tbf ive heard it said that if a child bites you to bite them back and they would never do it again, NOT something I would do, but people do it they just won’t tell you.

Yep, arrested someone for doing this and that was the reason given.
He was a 50 something man that left visible bite marks in a 3 year old girls arm.

I'd have happily thrown the cunt down a flight of concrete stairs but unfortunately I work as a police officer, human rights eh 👍🏻

I'm glad you're not teaching now. Attitudes like yours towards hitting children are no longer welcome and I don't want anyone with your outlook teaching my daughter
I have never used corporal punishment in my teaching career. I said, I smacked my own children when they were young.
As to my pupils, over half of my last class, now in their thirties, are 'friends' with me on Facebook. They send me photos of their own children, and I correspond regularly with two of them. So, I can't have been quite such an ogre!

It would never have crossed my mind to smack our children , I wouldn’t even smack the dog .

I totally agree with you but what’s funny is that it’s an uncontroversial and accepted principle of dog training that you never hit them, because hitting them teaches them nothing except to associate humans with pain and fear and can make them aggressive and dangerous.

I’m not comparing parenting to dog training of course, but I don’t understand why that’s pretty much universally accepted wisdom in relation to dogs but not in relation to children!

@Lilypansy

I'm glad you're not teaching now. Attitudes like yours towards hitting children are no longer welcome and I don't want anyone with your outlook teaching my daughter I have never used corporal punishment in my teaching career. I said, I smacked my own children when they were young. As to my pupils, over half of my last class, now in their thirties, are 'friends' with me on Facebook. They send me photos of their own children, and I correspond regularly with two of them. So, I can't have been quite such an ogre!

Oh yes, Facebook, that intimate channel reserved only for people we really like and admire. Do your old students hit their own children now, do you think?

So you were able to keep control without hitting in the classroom but not at home?

I'm still glad that a person who thinks you can explain the concept of wrongdoing to a small child by hitting them, who sees nothing wrong with this 40 years later, who thinks it's "arrogance" to reject it as a technique and that wayward teenagers merely lack "discipline", isn't teaching now. It's not 1975 any more, Miss, and as far as hitting children goes, that's a good thing.

@Allington

No, but you wouldn't have to get into that situation. The early signs of such self centeredness you walk away. Before you have kids/a shared home.

Whereas with toddlers you don't get to walk away. That doesn't excuse a 'good hiding' and haven't said that. But if you have no break then I can understand why you might give a slap in the heat of the moment - and feel terrible afterwards.

Of course the ideal would be that having reached that point you could access help and break. But the reality is too many parents have no-one stepping up to give them a break

A toddler. Jesus Christ.

I’m guessing it’s also understandable in your book when a parent slaps their six month old for crying all night too. After all, nobody was around to take over for a bit.

If you can’t cope with parenting a toddler, baby or child without resorting to violence then you’re not fit to parent. End of. All of the excuses in the world don’t undo the damage to the child.