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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not swap land with my neighbour?

531 replies

TreeTrials · 23/06/2021 15:44

Our neighbours are wanting to renovate their garage to incorporate it into their house. It sits alongside our garden boundary wall which is at an angle. Than angle makes it hard for them to do the changes they want because the room would be very narrow at the bottom.

They have previously talked to us about swapping land so they have a more regular shaped room. We expressed reluctance as we don't need the land they were offering and we have some mature bushes/trees growing out of the wall (it's a wide very old stone one). These trees and bushes provide privacy screening so that we don't see their house. If they are cut down, or die due to disturbed roots, we'll be staring at the side of their house rather than greenery. That was the end of the conversation.

They have now sent through technical drawings for their proposal and the proposed wall for the renovated garage appears be to on our land. It feels a bit cheeky given how we'd left things.

Should we let them proceed? The land is the corner of our garden and isn't used for anything useful - it's very dark and full of garden junk. I feel for them that the shape of the land makes their plans pretty hard to achieve with the boundary plan as it is.

My main concern is loss of privacy from the loss of the trees. But then I'm wondering what the situation would be if they change their plans to follow the boundary - they may still end up killing the trees as I imagine the roots will be disturbed whatever work they do. If this is going to be the case (not that I want them to kill our trees!) should we just suck it up?

I don't know for certain, but am reasonably sure the wall is ours as our house was built a long time before theirs. I've attached a very bad drawing.

YABU - it's only a small amount of land and makes their plans possible. Suck it up.

YANBU - you don't have to give away your land and lose your trees to make your neighbours' life better.

To not swap land with my neighbour?
OP posts:
BruceAndNosh · 23/06/2021 18:36

You CAN apply for planning permission on land you don't own.
You just can't build on it!

Cailleach1 · 23/06/2021 18:36

I don't think properties in a conservation area are necessarily listed. Some could be, but I think that is a separate thing.
There is a more general Conservation area zoning, and within that there can be an even more stringent Article 4 direction applied.

BluebellsGreenbells · 23/06/2021 18:36

I’d be taking lots of photos of the current land/wall/trees

Cailleach1 · 23/06/2021 18:36

@BruceAndNosh

You CAN apply for planning permission on land you don't own. You just can't build on it!
You're supposed to declare that on your application by ticking a certain box.
candycane222 · 23/06/2021 18:37

Just to reiterate point from PPs, you can't just 'replace' mature trees. Planting big trees for an 'instant landscape' tends not to work the trees are a nightmare to establish and will not actually get to 'mature tree' size any faster - slower in fact.

The big old stone garden wall may well be a habitat for lots of ferns, mosses, lichens, invertebrates, reptiles and even small mammals, too.

Bear in mind that construction work may need or at least want access across into your bit of land unless they kind of 'build it from the inside' (which can be done I think). So you might be facing scaffolding etc in your garden too.

FinallyFluid · 23/06/2021 18:38

Trots out the MN mantra...

No is a complete sentence.

MrsFlinch · 23/06/2021 18:38

Even before you stated the house and boundary wall were listed you were not being unreasonable to object. But given that little nugget of information then you should state it’s an outright no. Your Dh is mad to even consider this especially as it is of no benefit to you!

NewlyGranny · 23/06/2021 18:38

You need legal advice. It will be worth paying for!

MiniCooperLover · 23/06/2021 18:39

Tell your husband to stop being a wet rag! Who the fuck gives their land away to keep the peace??! What's next ?! Half the garden??

Scrambledcustard · 23/06/2021 18:40

I think your DH needs to grow a pair of balls to be honest. Its a lang grab right under your nose and he is worried he will look like a twat Confused

Its your land - you paid for it. Doesn't matter if its unused.

You can give them the land and request the do x,y,z. Doesn't mean they will do after you sign the land over Confused

Mrgrinch · 23/06/2021 18:40

I wouldn't do it for a multitude of reasons, but most of all the fact that they're incredibly cheeky when you already said no.

If it becomes awkward that's their fault not yours.

MzHz · 23/06/2021 18:40

Have you got house insurance with legal cover?

We have - NFU - specialist listed property insurance- give them a ring, superb service

candycane222 · 23/06/2021 18:41

Oh wow, just seen the wall is listed. Well, I'm not surprised if its 500 yrs old and goes with the house...

Cailleach1 · 23/06/2021 18:41

Ah, sorry. Hadn't seen your post that your house and wall are listed. Well. that makes things very simple. You have to protect them and their character.

candycane222 · 23/06/2021 18:42

If it becomes awkward that's their fault not yours

YES, THIS

ZeusandClio · 23/06/2021 18:42

It's also far too close the boundary. Absolutely stop it now - no they can't swap land and no they can't build flush to the boundary.

altiara · 23/06/2021 18:43

You say you expressed reluctance….but did you say an outright no or let neighbours believe you would consider it.

Sounds like you were a bit wishy washy and didn’t get your actual answer across.

You need to nip it in the bud now, do you actually want them to knock down the wall and build their garage. How close would this be to your house?
If it’s a no, then tell them a flat no.
If you’re considering it, then talk to them about buying it from you /solicitors fees/ conservation/listed buildings etc…

HeronLanyon · 23/06/2021 18:43

YANBU. At all!

HeronLanyon · 23/06/2021 18:46

The wall is listed ! Oh well I don’t think even you would be permitted to interfere with it let alone a neighbour ! That will make it more straightforward to say a very flat no. Explain you don’t want to and that in any event it is listed etc. I would do this in writing somehow so you have clear paper trail.

PartTimeLegend · 23/06/2021 18:47

That old wall might be the very reason that you're in a conservation area in the first place.

flippertygibbit · 23/06/2021 18:49

nrft but if you do proceed you need to change the title deeds so there will be legal implications. speaks someone who can't sell a property due to a similar situation not of her making................

hadtojoin · 23/06/2021 18:50

I am sure you CAN get planning permission to build on someone else's land.
Actually building it would be a different problem as they would be trespassing on someones land.

dodobookends · 23/06/2021 18:51

@TreeTrials

Actually just thought of another issue. Our house is listed (it's really very old) and that applies to the boundary wall as well as the house itself.
Well then there's your answer.

You cannot give permission, it is not yours to give. Nobody is allowed to do anything to that wall without proper listed building consent, which they are extremely unlikely to get. Do your neighbours actually know this?

flippertygibbit · 23/06/2021 18:51

@BruceAndNosh

You CAN apply for planning permission on land you don't own. You just can't build on it!
Don't be so sure - I applied for and was granted retrospective planning permission (for a building already in place) and yet I only own 50% of the land
Thiscantreallybehappening · 23/06/2021 18:53

I don't think this is as simple as you either saying yes or no to your neighbours. There are are a lot of things to take into account:

Does this alter the value of your property?
If you own a listed property, is this actually allowed?
Have you consulted a solicitor to see what needs to be done legally?
You say they are renovating the garage - what does this mean? what will they be using the garage for?

If you say "yes" because your DH doesn't want you to look like twats, your neighbours are just going to steam roller ahead but where does that leave you? How do you know they are going to have the deeds redone, have everything registered thoroughly. Will they pay for you to have your own solicitor to look after your interests or are you just going to be told they "will take care of everything". If you decide to sell a few years down the line you might then find out that they didn't sort everything out legally and you could then be in a position of having to pay to get everything sorted out.

Sorry, I think it is ridiculous to even consider their proposal until you have spoken to a solicitor and clearly that is going to cost you money. Have you even asked if they will cover this cost?

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