AIBU To feel this scarred me - *Content warning: concerns child abuse*

[baroqueandblue]

A thread about tapping a child because the child hit another child has brought something up for me which I’ve always wondered about. I’m male, early 50s, so this was in the early/mid 70s.

Friends of my parents came to visit with their children one weekend. I was 5, my brother was 4, and we didn’t get on. When he was born I was neglected (from what I’ve been told) and my father (an addict) was violent towards me but not my brother, which further destabilised me. This day we were playing with the visiting couple’s children, all primary age but older than us. I threw a book across the bedroom and it hit my brother on the nose, causing a bleed. I don’t remember if I meant to hit him with it, but it’s possible. What I remember next is a discussion between my parents and their friends about who should beat me as a punishment. I sat on the sofa waiting for the verdict, and it was decided that the visiting father should have the honour. He took me into the bedroom and thrashed me. I have an image of him removing his belt but that could be a false memory. What I do recall is feeling fear, shame and humiliation.

This episode is the tip of the iceberg in terms of abuse and bullying I suffered growing up, but it gives a flavour of what I went through. I’ve had significant problems as an adult making relationships and holding down jobs, although I’m fairly bright academically and have some long-standing close friends. But whereas both my siblings have successful marriages and steady jobs and their own homes, I’ve struggled to survive in the world of work, always rented and had short-lived relationships that ended unhappily in one way or another. I’m gay and, growing up when I did, suffered from ignorance and rejection within my family and among school friends which I think went quite deep.

But I suppose what I’m interested to discover is if the example of the beating I was given surprises many people, or if it was fairly common back then.

YABU – this was acceptable then and fairly common, get over it

YANBU – this wasn’t widespread and was abusive, no wonder you’ve struggled

The answers aren’t as black and white as that. It was fairly common back then. It was considered acceptable even though it wasn’t. And of course you can’t just ‘get over it’.

I'm really sorry about what happened to you. I hope you can get the support you need, maybe from a therapist if you feel it would help?

I think you need a trigger warning on your title.

I think physical punishment from parents was more normal back then than it is now although I don’t know that it was widespread (I am your age). But the particular scenario you describe, with family friends weighing in, is most definitely not and is particularly nasty.

I was physically abused a lot as a child (and up until the age of 21) whilst my siblings were not. It will always be with me, but it doesn’t define me and hasn’t stopped me having a relatively decent life with some successes. I found some help that I needed when I was in my early 30s and it laid some ghosts to rest for me. I hope you can find some help, it is never too late.

I'm sorry that you suffered physical abuse growing up, @Aprilx - thank goodness the later support you found helped as much as it did. Thank you for confirming that the scenario I described was especially disturbing. Having lived for so long with the impact of abuse and violence in my childhood I still feel some deep confusion about it, and about myself.

@Hsurbbrb you're right, I guess my question was echoing what I was so often told as a child, which is how many adults dealt with hurt children's feelings, sadly.

@takealettermsjones thank you for your empathy. How do I give the thread a TW, please?

@baroqueandblue you can report your own post and ask MNHQ to change it. I reported my own comment for that reason

I'm a little older than you, this wasn't widespread when I was a kid, it was abuse even if not named as such back then in the 70's and it was frowned upon but nothing was done about parents who parented this way.
I wasn't ever hit for anything and got up to allsorts.

Hi @baroqueandblue we've added the content warning for you now.

It's absolutely weird that they got someone else's father to thrash you. Don't get me wrong, your own father doing it would have been awful, but the fact he got another man to do it is quite sickening. I can't believe that man actually agreed to do it, what kind of man agrees to thrash another mans 5 year old child!

This is very far from normal. I grew up in the same era as you and although I was smacked a visiting father wasn’t invited to beat me.
Shocking level of abuse I’m sorry you went through it.

Another old (ish) woman here, chiming in to agree that what you were subjected to was appalling, and NOT the norm. A smacked bottom or legs was "normal", but never ever from someone else's parents, and never ever with a belt (lucky sheltered life). There was a boy in my infant school whose mum spanked him with a slipper if he was naughty.

Even if it was ‘normal’ at the time, it was abuse and fucking disgusting behaviour from all of the parents involved. The fact that it has continued to affect you now shows how awful it was.

I’m a similar age to you and that was not normal at all! What on earth was wrong with your parents? I’m so sorry this happened to you.

Beating a five-year-old child with a belt was certainly recognised as child abuse even in the 70s.

I'm so sorry you went through that. It's made me feel physically sick for you. They were extremely abusive and vile. How frightening for you to have to listen to them discuss it first too. What kind of an animal would beat a child?! Let alone allow someone else to beat their child?!! That's so disturbing, it's one of the worst things I've read on here. My heart bleeds for the little boy you were. I'm sorry to hear it's affected you still to this day.

I was born in the early 1970s. A smack on a rare occasion was normal. Being beaten certainly wasn't. That was definitely abuse.

#Trigger warning#
I am around the same age as you, female if it makes a difference. When I was around 7 in the late 70s, my step uncle (who was not often in contact) visited the family home. He was an unpredictable alcoholic and I felt very uncomfortable around him, always slurring his words, talking nonsense and being nasty and creepy. For some reason he decided that I needed to be punished for something. In front of my older step brothers he pulled down my knickers, put me over his knee and spanked my bare bottom. I don’t remember the pain, just complete humiliation at having my knickers removed and him touching me in that way. Like you, I always wondered if that was deemed acceptable back then or if it would have been considered child (sexual?) abuse. I don’t know if it was ok but it didn’t feel ok then and doesn’t feel ok now. If anyone working in child protection reads this I would be grateful for an opinion as I feel quite traumatised by it. Especially as I don’t think I did anything to deserve that and my mother didn’t step in to protect me. I’m pretty sure this wasn’t the first time he touched me inappropriately, but I can’t quite remember what happened when I was younger than when this incident took place. Around 30 yrs later one of my step brothers confided in me that this man sexually abused him in childhood. Not sure if my story helps you in any way, but it’s been quite cathartic writing about it x

I'm so sorry that this happend to you ❤️

I think smacking children back then was fairly common practice. We were certainly smacked regularly. The discussion between adults deciding who was going to “beat” you is not normal and absolutely disgusting. I’m sorry you experienced that.

@Sacredspace

That sounds like child abuse to me for definite and I would argue sexual abuse too. I’m so sorry this happened to you.

@BeingATwatItsABingThing
thank you, that’s what I thought, especially when family member disclosed sexual abuse in childhood. There was no reasonable justification, it was not his job to punish me, looking back I feel is was just an excuse to remove a child’s undergarments and touch.

Where to begin on this one.Even though it was the norm,it has ruined many people’s lives.There’s a lady in my old neighbourhood who has had a severe mental breakdown and has completely lost all sense of reality.My mum said that her dad was very abusive and this girl would come to school with a black eye or welts across her legs and always seemed like a nervous wreck.My mum said she understands why this poor lady is this way.The thing is,back then no one said anything.My mum said she doesn’t remember asking who did it as there’d be several kids being beaten by either the school or parents.When I was 11,a teacher choked and slapped me.I have become very sensitive to anyone even raising their voice to my kids and become extremely upset if someone hurts them.OP,I think what you are experiencing is a direct result of what you went through as a child.It’s very traumatic and all I can send are best wishes and good luck.I hope that you are able to overcome/deal with this trauma.

I have no advice, only sending virtual hugs to you, @baroqueandblue and the others who have described abusive events in their childhoods.

What a previous poster said was spot on: the fact that it is still affecting you means that it was not normal behaviour. Xx

It was not normal. My parents never hit me and I couldn't imagine any parent letting someone else hit their child.

That sounds horrible and I would agree with other posters who are of similar age - a smack on the legs was the norm in the 70s/80s. However it wasn't normal to be thrashed and for there to be a discussion about who would dish out the punushment.

Try to focus on your positive friendships and perhaps minimize contact with family members. They don't sound nice. My father was picked on by his father. it must be horrible.

It's not your fault and you need to remember that.

@Hsurbbrb

The answers aren’t as black and white as that. It was fairly common back then. It was considered acceptable even though it wasn’t. And of course you can’t just ‘get over it’.

Beating with a belt? Of course it wasn't common.