Why are we embarrassed to fly the English flag?

[Dannyandsandy]

Just that really. I’m English but grew up in Ireland and everyone Irish is delighted to fly their flag with pride. I’ve travelled extensively around the world and have seen the same in other countries. To do so in England? Well you’re utter scum. Why?

@Susie477

I’m not in the slightest bit embarrassed to fly the English flag. Quite the opposite, in fact. I’m very patriotic and proud of my country.

It’s also great to know that flying the 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 annoys the hell out of pathetic self-loathing guilt-ridden snowflakes.

Thank you for putting it so much more succinctly than I did. This is exactly why I’m not proud to be English.

I have lived in England my whole life and have no sense of national identity or patriotism. I don't understand why people get so worked up about identifying with somewhere where they were born, only by a quirk of fate. If I see an England flag, I assume the bearer is a racist. I find flags totally divisive and unnecessary

Susie477 - so where dies the notion of 'guilt' come from?

@LookItsMeAgain

I'm Irish. *@Dannyandsandy* - When exactly do we all fly our tricolour with pride?

Football matches possibly? I can't say that I see Irish flags being flown very often tbh. County flags for football/hurling matches are far more common. If I saw a house with an Irish flag up all of the time I would assume that they were Republicans.

Unfortunately the flag has been hijacked by the far right, and historically by thuggish so-called football supporters.

For much of the 1970s and 80s the England football team were a sporting embarrassment too. I am old enough to remember when people such as Paul Mariner won England caps.

Because of the tendencies of lots of the people who do fly it. But tbh I doubt it's the case that loads of English people are thinking "I wish I could fly the flag but I'm too embarrassed". I am not remotely ashamed of my country or of being English - I just feel no need to make a fuss about it and am not a big fan of flag-waving in general.

No, it was the Glorious Revolution, which meant that there were controls on the monarch by parliament.

Because it's so closely related to racist organisations such as the EDL. It's a shame.

I'm irish and live in Ireland and besides St Patrick's day or when a match is being played I rarely see an Irish flag flying. Down my way you'd be more likely to see the flag of the local gaa or football club.

@Whyhello

Because it is tied up with connotations of racism due to parties like the English Defence League etc., who use it as their emblem.

This basically. I also associate England football fans with general thuggery as much of the world does. I think they’re an embarrassment in all honesty. My DH is watching the game and they boo every time the opposition has the ball. No wonder a lot of the world thinks we’re idiots.

You don’t think fans in other countries do the same?

@Bagamoyo1 don't think it was the UK back then...or even England? Might be wrong!

There's an embarrassment around it but it does confuse me. Yes football hooligans have tarnished it but other countries have football hooligans. And plenty of people are racist but would still look down on someone else flying the flag 🤷🏻‍♀️

Off the top of my head (and I'm happy to be corrected) I can't think of any other country where you see so many flags in so many places all year round.

Wales. Dragons everywhere.

As others have said, it's the racist connotations. When my parents lived in a Southern US state people proudly flew the US flag but despite their immense pride in being southern, none of them could fly a confederate flag because it's viewed as a symbol of racism.

Wales did well yesterday at the football.
I lived there for a while and saw dragons everywhere! They are patriotic.

@UpTheJunktion

Flaunting National identity when it has such a history of colonialism and worse. I am not personally ashamed of my nationality, but for me flags are as much about asserting your nationality. Why is that even necessary? You must be aware of this OP since flags are so contentious in parts of NI that they are banned.

It has become the Inger-land flag rather than England.

Yet other European nations have a similar history but don’t carry this shame and stigma attached to national pride and flags. It’s very interesting.

I think it’s a combination of the the flag being appropriated by “football loving louts” and everyone else wanting to be set apart from that lower class culture.
It’s basically another way which shows how our culture is obsessed with class.

I think it’s more common to see the union flag 🇬🇧 on buildings and out and about.
It sends the middle classes into a frothing fury, which is good fun.

@Susie477

I’m not in the slightest bit embarrassed to fly the English flag. Quite the opposite, in fact. I’m very patriotic and proud of my country.

It’s also great to know that flying the 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 annoys the hell out of pathetic self-loathing guilt-ridden snowflakes.

That is exactly the sort of mentality I associate with people who fly the flag. And one of the reasons I would stay far, far away from such people.

My DH is watching the game and they boo every time the opposition has the ball. No wonder a lot of the world thinks we’re idiots.

Oh how uncouth!

@LucilleTheVampireBat

People who fly the England flag epitomise little Ingerland mentality, narrow-mindedness, racism, Brexit, thuggery

That's such absolute bullshit.

Exactly. It is shamefully ignorant to make these lazy associations and results in greater divisiveness not unity.

I think it’s more common to see the union flag 🇬🇧 on buildings and out and about.
It sends the middle classes into a frothing fury, which is good fun.

Can I ask where you are? The flag flying efforts around me are all from middle class Tory MPs.

@SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius

Yes - it’s been appropriated by violent, far right thugs, and I don’t know how it can be taken back from them.

Billy Bragg wrote about this and basically said that the left should take back the flag. Britain or England may not be perfect but is deen by the rest of the world as a good place, a solid, reliable, safe and supportive country. One or two prime ministers and politicians aside we DO help, we do support and we welcome and help.

It's now a symbol of nationalism and racism which most of us aren't.

In Yorkshire lots of people fly the white rise instead which works well for us.

Rose* not rise