Why are we embarrassed to fly the English flag?

[Dannyandsandy]

Just that really. I’m English but grew up in Ireland and everyone Irish is delighted to fly their flag with pride. I’ve travelled extensively around the world and have seen the same in other countries. To do so in England? Well you’re utter scum. Why?

It's traditionally been used by the far right OP and is associated with rabid nationalism aka football thugs with the cross tattooed on their faces.

Agree that union jack raises less eyebrows than an England flag

I dont mind england flags around football times, but my local pub for example that has flag bunting all year round might as well hammer "foreigners not welcome here"

Its been high-jacked I'm afraid. Id assume a pub with rainbow flags was queer friendly and have put it outside to signify such, I would expect a pub deliberately displaying flags to be broadcasting ukip credentials but far more likely edl or bnp.

It screams racist brexit voter type.

I think it's fine during a football tournament but the only people I know who fly flags in England are (forgive me) quite openly racist types in Essex and
(possibly more closet racist types) such as Conservatives party members in affluent places like Horning - and both give me the willies frankly.

I agree with the previous poster who said it's wierd to celebrate an entirely serendipitous event like where you happen to be born.

[quote StrictlyAFemaleFemale]@Lockhart try Denmark. Danes LOVE their flag. They put in on birthday cakes and even the Christmas tree. Im ok with raising the flags on special occasions - weddings, birthdays, funerals, national holidays but the christmas tree is just too much for me.[/quote]
I have tiny Finnish flags on my Christmas tree every year. But those are the only flags I have, unless you count putting two blue and white candles on the window on the Finnish independence day.

@kidsatuniemptynester

Due to the appopriation by Nationalists and the far right. I cringe when I see a St.George's flag, and seriously judge the owners. If I was viewing a house and neighbours were using one as a curtain, I would walk away. But then again, i find nationalism a strange concept, it is just about where your Mother was when you were born, nothing you can control yourself.

Same here. It may be unfair but its the way it is currently. It may be that in future we can reclaim it from the far right but at the moment I would assume anyone who displays the St George's cross on their house is either a) very right wing or b) has been living under a rock for about 20 years.

If I were non-white I'd give these people a very wide birth.

* Due to the appopriation by Nationalists and the far right. I cringe when I see a St.George's flag, and seriously judge the owners. If I was viewing a house and neighbours were using one as a curtain, I would walk away.*

^This. It is sad but that is the reality.

In Scotland, the saltire 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 is seen as confirmation that you're an SNP supporter, sadly.

I guess in football/soccer it has such a bad association with hooliganism that it's tainted. But that's not the case for other sports! Perhaps our imperialistic history is problematic for many people too (nothing we can do about that today though).

It think it's really nice to see supporters at sports events with team colors, flags, shirts, etc. That applies for English supporters as well as other countries.

Year ago (20 or so) I lived in an area where there was one street that had a mix of about 20 different nationalities all living side by side. An American family put up a flag, followed closely by a Canadian family. Within about 2 weeks everyone had a flag and it looked great... right up until someone complained to the college about the St George cross and the family were told to change it for a union flag

Whether it's right or wrong the flag has been flown by racists, nazis and all kinds of bad people- I'd rather not fly a meaningless piece of fabric than be associated with them.

@FrankButchersDickieBow

Because it is tied up with connotations of racism due to parties like the English Defence League etc., who use it as their emblem.

This

I'm not, I'm proud of my country and anyone who doesn't like it can fuck right off.

There's a local house (rural, very affluent) with a flag pole which generally flies the union flag, the EU flag or occasionally the St George's cross. I know the owners are not football hooligans or EDL supporters, but the St George's cross would make me wonder if I didn't know otherwise.

Usually I only see that flag flown around football events, though more commonly out of a window than from a flag pole. I did used to ride through a farm with a flag pole that always flew a St George's cross and had banners for the EDL on their fencing and gates. It's not a good association.

I said years ago it’s like ‘taking back the streets at night’ walking protests, just too engrained in all the wrong things already listed. It is a real part of the shame because we like to travel and collected flags so the children would recognise them easily etc but we stopped when one day our DD said it made her uncomfortable seeing it there too.

I’m English but grew up in Ireland and everyone Irish is delighted to fly their flag with pride.

Sorry, this isn’t true. Not everyone who is Irish can fly their flag with pride. In Northern Ireland it’s actually quite dangerous depending on where you are.

The Swiss love their flag. National or from the canton. You won’t see that many in Germany for obvious reasons.

@Justjoinedforthis

I think patriotism ‘works’ better in countries that have a history of being oppressed, or have had a revolution - for example Ireland, France. America (regardless of what the reality is now) was founded on a written set of principles that are supposedly represented by their flag. England/UK I feel doesn’t quite have the same impact. Also as the previous poster said, to a lot of us sadly the England flag is connected to the national front. I am not at all saying that anyone who flies one is right wing, but there is that connection for lots of people, rightly or wrongly.

This! Well said!

@Crankley

I'm not, I'm proud of my country and anyone who doesn't like it can fuck right off.

Playing right into the stereotype there, aren't you!

The town I live in had the English flag hanging from most shop fronts for St George’s day and they have put the Union Jack out this weekend. Think it’s great to celebrate with our nations flags, we need to do more of it to suppress its bad reputation 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

It's a pretty unique Americanism, the sheer amount of flags everywhere. And the pledging allegiance and what have you in schools and that. Off the top of my head (and I'm happy to be corrected) I can't think of any other country where you see so many flags in so many places all year round.

Pledging allegiance is one of the civic rituals that was put into place to help assimilate the tidal wave of immigrants we had in the 20th century. It's also said before sporting events. I think it has helped promote a sense of national unity for a lot of people who were born elsewhere or who came here as children.

I'm Irish.
@Dannyandsandy - When exactly do we all fly our tricolour with pride?

I'm not ashamed of the English flag at all, in fact I have one on my car.

We are a mixed race family with visibly "brown" children if that's even a thing

Our driveway has an England flag at the end of it. Our DDs will be wearing the shirts they picked out at ASDA (very good value at £8 a pop as it happens).

All this "the far right has appropriated it" stuff is fine, but we worry so much about what other people think in this country, it's depressing.

My kids and I will be part of the change. In our local market town more and more buildings are starting to fly flags. We don't need to hand England over to the 1980s folk. Times have changed and so will we. I'm taking back something we as a family never gave up.

I’m not a fan of flag waving in general, but especially in this case where the associations with racism and right wing extremism are too strong.

Similarly, I would never wear a St. George’s ribbon in Russia (where I spend a lot of time) because it has been appropriated by Putin to signal support for his thuggish government.