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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To HATE my daughter smoking and not allow it on the balcony

128 replies

HateCigarettes · 21/05/2021 14:15

We're in Southeast Asia (for context - always hot here!)
We live in a flat with a nice balcony with patio furniture off the living room, a not so nice but OK service balcony and small balconies off two of the bedrooms (mine and dh's room and my 14 year old DD2's room). My 17 year old DD1 does not have a balcony.

DD1 has started smoking a few months ago. I HATE it with a passion. My father died of lung cancer and I just hate everything to do with cigarettes. DD1 had some mental health issues and had been drinking, using weed and nitrous oxide too but this has now stopped thankfully but the cigarettes have remained. She's on about 10-20 a day, it's disgusting. Even worse, DD2 has also started and will sneak on to her balcony to smoke.

Anyway, DD1 has been forbidden from smoking on DD2's balcony. So she sits on our nice main balcony and puffs away. School is remote at the moment so she'll sit out there for hours smoking. This means we have to keep the doors shut and it's hot as no breeze so we have to turn on a/c earlier than we might do otherwise plus it wafts into my bedroom (I'm wfh too) so I have shut my window and then turn on a/c. Our balcony furniture smells, there's ash everywhere, the ashtray is always overflowing and no one else can sit on the balcony because she's alwys there smoking. I hate it.

If it were up to me, I'd not allow it and she could go down to the car park to smoke if she wanted to. I feel like we're facilitating her smoking. My DH believes she has the 'right' to smoke on the balcony and I'm being precious about it all. He also constantly says 'well, at least it's not weed/nitrous oxide/alcohol' which I don't feel is a valid argument. I feel very undermined and that I'm being bulldozed by both of them. They tell me I'm being controlling.

It kind of got to a head tonight when DD1 had a friend over who is a mutual friend with DD2 and also smokes. They went to DD2's room and locked the door. I got suspicious when they didn't answer when I knocked and opened with the spare key. THen I found DD2 smoking with DD1 and friend on her balcony. DD1 had offered DD2 a cigarette despite not being allowed to smoke there. So then DD1 and friend wanted to go and smoke on balcony and I got really angry because it's bad enough with DD1's smoking but after having given one to DD2, then I need to put up with DD1 and friend sitting out on balcony? So I told them no, DD1 goes to DH and tells him I said no and can he help, in the meantime I go to kitchen, come back and DD1 and friend on the balcony smoking. I go out and tell them that I don't agree and they can go to the car park. DD1 calls DH who says he think it's fine for them to smoke on the balcony.

I just feel really powerless to stop the smoking despite knowing how the damage it causes. But I wonder if it's an emotional reaction knowing how it killed my Dad with a painful and horrible early death. Am I being unreasonable and controlling? Or would you let your teen DDs smoke in this kind of situation (DH agrees we need to stop DD2 but it's so hard with DD1 constantly smoking)?

OP posts:
georgarina · 24/05/2021 05:35

Just really don't get what your husband is trying to achieve. Unless he wants you to just leave like he said.

Seems like your relationship/feelings aren't important to him, it's all about the kids and him giving them everything they want. And I have a hard time understanding why but that's how it's coming across.

mainsfed · 24/05/2021 06:45

I would be planning a return to the UK asap WITH all dc, WITHOUT him.

This man has serious issues.

HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 06:51

@georgarina

Just really don't get what your husband is trying to achieve. Unless he wants you to just leave like he said.

Seems like your relationship/feelings aren't important to him, it's all about the kids and him giving them everything they want. And I have a hard time understanding why but that's how it's coming across.

That's totally how I feel. He absolutely prioritises the girls above everythign else. Which would be fine it it was about meeting their needs but this all about meeting their wants too. It's not so much he wants me to leave but he wants me to feel the same way he does and can't seem to handle that I don't.
OP posts:
HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 06:54

@mainsfed

I would be planning a return to the UK asap WITH all dc, WITHOUT him.

This man has serious issues.

My job is here and our visas are tied to my employment. If I quit my job and left the country, he'd have to leave too. In fact, if we divorced he'd have to leave (I wouldn't do that to him - that wouldn't be fair, we'd have to have an informal agreement between us). But I love my job and I like my life here. Just not my marriage!
OP posts:
KidneyBeans · 24/05/2021 06:58

Have you tried pointing that out to him when he's being vile and accusing you of all sorts?

Good that your DD seems able to make better choices than your DH but sad at the same time

mainsfed · 24/05/2021 07:03

My job is here and our visas are tied to my employment. If I quit my job and left the country, he'd have to leave too. In fact, if we divorced he'd have to leave (I wouldn't do that to him - that wouldn't be fair, we'd have to have an informal agreement between us). But I love my job and I like my life here. Just not my marriage!

You’re clearly not happy, OP. Prioritise your DC and don’t feel you have to stay trapped in a marriage for his sake.

Does he work?

HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:08

@KidneyBeans

Have you tried pointing that out to him when he's being vile and accusing you of all sorts?

Good that your DD seems able to make better choices than your DH but sad at the same time

That he's prioritizing their wants above our relationship? Obviously I try.

But he gets very self righteous and says that he is defending the girls against my nefarious influence. So with the smoking thing, he says that my reaction pushing back on her smoking escalates things and causes DD to self-harm and that I am dangerous for her. Basically, convinced that he is the one who has to save them (mainly around DD1 who has always been the more challenging one) from me and that this is his duty to do so. It's fucking infuriating.

OP posts:
mainsfed · 24/05/2021 07:10

Is he jealous of your job or your breadwinner status (if that’s what you are)?

HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:14

@mainsfed

My job is here and our visas are tied to my employment. If I quit my job and left the country, he'd have to leave too. In fact, if we divorced he'd have to leave (I wouldn't do that to him - that wouldn't be fair, we'd have to have an informal agreement between us). But I love my job and I like my life here. Just not my marriage!

You’re clearly not happy, OP. Prioritise your DC and don’t feel you have to stay trapped in a marriage for his sake.

Does he work?

I think it'd be even worse if I were job-less! Also, the girls are at critical points in their schooling which are not conducive to international moves.

My marital problems are not connected to where we're living and any solution - whatever we do - can be done where we are. I don't think moving back to the UK will help any - it'd jsut add financial pressure to the mix!

OP posts:
HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:15

@mainsfed

Is he jealous of your job or your breadwinner status (if that’s what you are)?
I don't think so. He can be an arsehole but he's not a sexist one at least.
OP posts:
mainsfed · 24/05/2021 07:16

Sorry, not suggesting you leave for UK. But why do you need to stay with him?

HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:17

@mainsfed

Sorry, not suggesting you leave for UK. But why do you need to stay with him?
I don't and I'm seriously considering not.
OP posts:
mainsfed · 24/05/2021 07:19

Good that that’s an option on the table.

This doesn’t sound like a partnership.

HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:21

It's actually been very illuminating just how wrong he is and how fucked up the situation is. I think you can sometimes start to doubt yourself and what has become normalized in a relationship.
It's not that everything is bad in our marriage, obviously not, we've been together for 20 years. His hero worship of the girls has always annoying and a source of arguments. But DD1's mental heatlh challenges over the last few have severely tested our relationship and it's not standing up to it very well and I feel that he blames me.

OP posts:
mainsfed · 24/05/2021 07:27

No, if everything was bad, you would probably called it a day long ago.

You shouldn’t doubt yourself, and I would even consider the impact of his behaviour on dd’s mental health. Children need boundaries.

HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:30

@mainsfed

No, if everything was bad, you would probably called it a day long ago.

You shouldn’t doubt yourself, and I would even consider the impact of his behaviour on dd’s mental health. Children need boundaries.

When I've suggested that his parenting could negatively impact DD1's mental health by enabling some of the harmful behaviours, he has absolutely exploded. This was a total trigger. How could I, the apparently shitty parent, question his parenting?! He was totally outraged that I could even suggest it.
OP posts:
Shelby2010 · 24/05/2021 07:38

Sounds like he needs a parenting course. Setting boundaries to make children feel safe is in the basics, surely. Do you think you could suggest going on one together so you’re ’on the same page’ for your younger children? In some ways he seems stupid & misguided rather than malicious.

mainsfed · 24/05/2021 07:40

Jesus, he sounds awful the more you post. He’s created this narrative inside his head as him being the perfect dad and you as the despised dictator and your deviation from it triggers rage.

He’s the one who needs counselling and if he refuses then tell him he needs to move out.

MotherofSmoker · 24/05/2021 07:42

I've name-changed for this, but I could have almost written your first post. My DD of the same age smokes following other more harmful behaviour and ongoing MH issues. Like you I despise smoking. I keep the cigarettes and she is allowed 3 a day at the far end of the garden. This under the agreement of her MH team who feel I'm actually being very generous.

I'm also a MH professional and I simply do not believe that a psychiatrist has told your DH that your daughter seld harms because of your boundaries, unless your other boundaries are much more Draconian than this. In fact the lack of boundaries from your DH and the conflict around this is equally likely to be a factor. But why is he talking to the psychiatrist and not both of you? Are you being excluded?

I am very concerned about all the info in your later comments. Your husband is quite clearly gas lighting you and manipulating your daughters against you. This is completely toxic and this is much more likely to be at the root of your daughter's MH issues than anything else you've mentioned.

HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:45

@mainsfed

Jesus, he sounds awful the more you post. He’s created this narrative inside his head as him being the perfect dad and you as the despised dictator and your deviation from it triggers rage.

He’s the one who needs counselling and if he refuses then tell him he needs to move out.

Yeah, that's kind of how he's created in his head. Also that he has given everything for the girls and he's the ultimate martyr. And you can't question a martyr!

He'd NEVER move out. It'd have to be me.

OP posts:
mainsfed · 24/05/2021 07:47

Are you renting or do you own? Who is on the tenancy? If it’s you, then YOU decide he moves out, not him!

Rosebel · 24/05/2021 07:48

You don't need to quit your job or return to the UK. You just need to say goodbye to your husband.
The more I read the more abusive he sounds. The things he says to you aren't normal.
Your daughters aren't little, they are learning about relationships from you and their dad. Do you really want them to marry someone who tells them things are their fault and undermines them?
Classic abuser. Lovely to everyone, so they can claim to be the good guy, but totally vile to the person they promised to love and cherish.

HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:57

@MotherofSmoker

I've name-changed for this, but I could have almost written your first post. My DD of the same age smokes following other more harmful behaviour and ongoing MH issues. Like you I despise smoking. I keep the cigarettes and she is allowed 3 a day at the far end of the garden. This under the agreement of her MH team who feel I'm actually being very generous.

I'm also a MH professional and I simply do not believe that a psychiatrist has told your DH that your daughter seld harms because of your boundaries, unless your other boundaries are much more Draconian than this. In fact the lack of boundaries from your DH and the conflict around this is equally likely to be a factor. But why is he talking to the psychiatrist and not both of you? Are you being excluded?

I am very concerned about all the info in your later comments. Your husband is quite clearly gas lighting you and manipulating your daughters against you. This is completely toxic and this is much more likely to be at the root of your daughter's MH issues than anything else you've mentioned.

The boundaries are what I considered normal. *Getting up in the morning even if going to school is too hard *Having a set amount of pocket money and not limitless access *Not buying the most expensive food becuase you 'feel like it' - we have the most amazing fruit here for example but since DD1 likes cherries, DH will run and buy them for her (at like 10 pounds a punnet) *not smoking cigarettes, weed or nitrous oxide and consequences if she does

Of course, I'm not perfect myself. I have lost my temper with DD1 (far more quickly than DH) and reacted in anger to her which is not good. Sometimes I have expected too much from her given her mental health issues. But I do generally reflect and make amends with DD1. I don't think is something which triggers mental health crises.

Sometimes we've been to psychiatrist together and sometimes separately (I have also been without dh). The appointments have been quite frequent (probably far more frequent than if we had been in the UK) and this has been an ongoing health issue for a few years now.

But I also don't believe what he says the psychiatrists said. I don't think he's fully lying (that would be totally ott) but probably misconstrued what they said to fit his narrative. I have since met those psychiatrists at different points and none of them said to me that I am dangerous or that I am responsible for dd's mental health. Surely, if they were so concerned by my parenting, they would have said something to me, face to face? He weaponises what apparently DD1 told them about me (and I do 100% believe that she complained about me) to tell me how much she hates me.

OP posts:
HateCigarettes · 24/05/2021 07:59

@mainsfed

Are you renting or do you own? Who is on the tenancy? If it’s you, then YOU decide he moves out, not him!
Renting. And the tenancy is actually only in my name. But I couldn't imagine how traumatic this would be to the girls if I kicked him out, we'd have to get the police involved. It would be horrific. Our lease is up soon and this would be a good opportunity to move our separate ways in a more peaceful manner.
OP posts:
MotherofSmoker · 24/05/2021 08:14

Having read your last update, all those are the same boundaries I set for my daughter and the MH workers working with her are very clear that these are not just fair and appropriate but are essential if her MH is to improve.

I think you and your DH need to meet together (without your DD) with her MH team and explain the tensions the issue of boundaries is creating (with some specific examples) and how your husband undermines these boundaries and blames the boundaries and you for DD's MH problems. Ask them what they consider to be best for your DD.

Be warned though - he is going to push back against this suggestion, and the reason is that he's lying and manipilating you all and doesn't want to be caught out. If he refuses to go, go without him. Take notes during the session (whether he comes or not) then immediately afterwards email the psychiatrist/MH worker with your notes asking them to confirm them as accurate.