Financial situation of in laws

[isthisgreedyofme]

I am writing this to vent and to try to get my head around it.

Been happily married to DH for 15 years, we're in our 40s. Like a lot of people our age, we are doing just about OK for money. Keeping up with the mortgage, childcare costs, etc. is a struggle to be honest, but we scrimp and save, make do, and keep our heads above water. DH has a sort of slightly above averagely paid job; I don't earn enough to pay tax (I run my own business and though I work really hard, it's not going at all well over the pandemic, but that's another story).

Over the years, our in laws have more or less a succession of large presents from us. Things like weekends away at expensive historic properties to celebrate landmark birthdays, large presents, parties etc. We've have had to scrimp and save to do this, and the effort involved hasn't always been appreciated (my MIL complained that the very nice cottage we'd let for her 70th birthday wasn't grand enough). The effort isn't reciprocated - they don't do the same back for us. We also do a lot to help them out in practical terms, which again is not reciprocated.

What is more, they are downright tight in their attitude to money on a more everyday basis, asking us to pay for meals out, drinks, and never donating to charity or good causes. They never give anything that they own away, unless it's broken or junk and more or less worthless, even though their houses is over-full of valuable belongings (there are literally things piled on things in every room to the point that it borders on hoarding).

I've always assumed they were asset-rich but money-poor and been willing to make sacrifices to ensure they have a good time. But I've recently found out that this is not true and that they are actually cash millionnaires. They have over £1.1 million in the bank in ISA-type investments (they are very risk averse), they own a £500k house, and another bungalow without a mortgage. They also have very generous pensions, especially considering that they both gave up work in their 40s plus income from their second house, which they let. Altogether, they have far more coming in than we do, plus this immense cash reserve as a safety net.

This has come out becuase we have been dealing with solicitors recently due to a legal issue they have and the solicitor told them that they might want to consider estate planning to reduce inheritance tax. They said right in front of us that they don't want to do this because they don't know how much they will need for care costs, and they come first. They didn't even stop to think about us, or about BIL (who is financially in a similat position to us). They have form for this - they are very, very self-centred.

AIBU to think they are just really mean? Or am I being grabby in thinking that?

YANBU. They sound like my parents. Hoarding money, expecting us to endlessly work for them free of charge so they can hoard even more money with zero appreciation of the fact that we work far longer hours with much heavier outgoings and no chance of retiring early as they had. We used to pay a fortune for them to have weekends away, concerts to their favourite bands from 1960s. We used to drop everything to paint their house, mend this, fetch that, drive them everywhere. All met with petty complaints not joy. I just stopped. And later discovered their £1m squirrelled away in so many accounts, because they'd been sponging off us ad their friends all their lives.

On MN it's said: their money. Well, yeah, to a point, but only because they managed to get everyone else to pay for them all the time. So not entirely all theirs.

Just stop doing everything for them. Never offer, make excuses when asked. For presents, revert to a nice bunch of flowers and if they comment, say that money is very tight right now due to down turn during Covid. Put the money you used to spend on their weekends away into ISAs for your own future. If you are able, start having the occasional moan to them in a light-hearted 'It's very different now'. I had to do this several times to get through to my dad that things are different now. Our mortgages cost 50% of what we earn, not 10%, we have no job security, no proper pensions, we have to pay for DC's uni etc, there's no 11% interest on savings, if you can afford to save at all.

They don't get it. But that's no excuse for milking you.

Of course it is their money to do as they wish but they have been lying by omission so you have assumed that they do not have enough. Token gifts from now on and declare loudly that during family meals each family pays for itself.

I couldn't be like your ILs but some people have no pride.

@Cowbells I'm so sorry you've been through this too. It's hurtful to be treated that way, I think it's not about the practical side (what the money can do) so much as it is about suddenly realising the truth of the situation and feeling a bit exploited.

I think you have a really important point there about one generation simply not understanding the changing pressures suffered by another. But that's not a universal thing - I know a lot of friends whose parents are immensely supportive. And I know that DH and I would walk over hot coals for our own kids when it comes to financial matters - I worry every day about what the housing and environmental situation will be for them when they get older. I know their lot is likely to be worse than mine and I would do anything to help them out. And I never want them to have to spend days of annual leave sorting out admin that I could do myself but am too lazy to get on with.

As others say, they are entitled to do whatever they want with their money.

The ungrateful, tight-fisted gits.

I would be going down the route of taking inspiration from their approach.

I.e. they don't know how much they will need for care costs, and they come first.

Tell them that gave you a lightbulb moment. You're in the same situation. You don't know how much you'll need for care costs either, so from now on you come first and you'll be saving every penny of your hard-earned cash to protect your own futures. Which means no more expensive gifts, no more paying for meals and drinks other than your own, etc.

Thank them for showing you the way...

It's their money and they can do what they like with it. BUT you decide what you spend your money on...........why on earth do you lavish gifts on them that you have to scrimp and save for?

Time to take a leaf out of the in-laws book and put your household first!!!

Do not give gifts, expensive or not, if you don't give them graciously with no strings attached. If gifts are not received graciously stop giving.

Do not expect an inheritance from anyone.

I think as a general rule presents for adults should always be an extra and not something you have to scrimp for. I’d hate to think of anyone I cared about struggling to pay for presents for me!

@Bluedeblue

Oh well, at least your inheritance will be good.

Possibly, but you should never count on an inheritance. It could get left to someone else or a charity they like or they might be swindled out of the money when they get older. Ask any solicitor, lots of people who expect a sizable inheritance are disappointed.

I think you really need to separate money from love. I do not know if they love you but not everybody expresses love in being generous with money or things.
They clearly have anxieties and are frugal bordering on 'hoarding' with things and money. That is just how they are. Don't see it as a measure of whether or not they love your DH or you.

You see generosity as a way of expressing your love, but they didn't receive your generosity that way so it didn't express what you wanted it to express. I'm glad to see you are learning this and thinking of all the ways you can now feel less obliged to continue doing this to no avail.

@isthisgreedyofme

The more I read your replies, the more I agree with you. It IS their money. It is absolutely their choice what they do with it.

But also: it's my time and labour here, spend doing gardening, helping with form-filling, doing admin that takes literally days on end (we are currently on a visit where DH has spent literally 3 days of his annual leave trying to straighten out their affairs because they are too busy playing and enjoying themselves with friends to get down to being organised so we have to step in). They can absolutely pay for professionals to come in and do all this in future.

This is where you have gone wrong though-thinking that you have to step in!

How have you ever become so involved in doing so much for them?

It’s very important to only help others up to the point it becomes detrimental to you and not do more for them than they are willing to do for you.

For example my DM bends over backwards for me/DH/Kids in times of need and goes massively above and beyond. We will always return that!

MIL whilst lovely and very helpful wouldn’t prioritise us over her own stuff. She helps out where she can, not where is needed.

Like if the toddler urgently needed to go to the GP and I couldn’t take the baby (covid restrictions) my DM would rearrange a coffee date to come watch them whereas MIL would be like ‘I’ve got plans sorry but I can do next week’

It’s not wrong it’s just different approaches

Let them look after their own finances. Its nothing to do with you . On you part stop the expensive gifts.

Well now to be fair, they have just given you the most priceless and best gift ever..Your freedom... You know they are loaded so you needn't feel guilty about saying no I don't have time to do that for you or better still I will invoice you for my time and you can transfer over the cash to me lol

Stop buying the people who have everything presents and tell them you have bought a goat for a starving family as you know they have enough money to buy whatever they need for themselves

Over the years, our in laws have more or less a succession of large presents from us. Things like weekends away at expensive historic properties to celebrate landmark birthdays, large presents, parties etc. We've have had to scrimp and save to do this, and the effort involved hasn't always been appreciated

I still don't understand. Why did you do this?

Why on earth are you buying things for them? Especially lavishly. Honestly, ridiculous.

That's not to say they should feel any obligation to give you any money, but you shouldn't be giving them any either!

Visit them yearly and say you’re putting yourself first, just like them, when they challenge you!

I think its mean and misguided of them, really.

I think it's their money to do what they like with, and yes - they sound tight - but that's up to them.

I think you're daft to be scrimping and scraping to buy lavish presents you can't afford for your in-laws. Money's tight for us, too. It has never occurred to me that I might spend some of it on a weekend away for my in-laws to enjoy. I simply can't afford to.

"Why did you do this?"

Basically, because they asked us to. And yes it is ridiculous. The roots of it lie in the fact that they are quite bullying people. And because DH, having been brought up by parents who are bullies, was accustomed to bend to their will, we went along with it.

The problem is in this people pleasing. However, during his recent period of depression/anxiety I mentioned upthread, he had counselling and it really helped him to recognise that he had a problem in this area. We had already started setting some boundaries, but clearly we need to go way further (and this whole thing is the kick up the arse we needed to do that, tbh). There will absolutely NOT be any more lavish gifts from us. I. Am. Done. With. That. And we will not be allowing them to take so much time or labour from us either.

The issue is more the lack of appreciation and downright rudeness in regards to the gifts you give them. I mean complaining that the cottage you let for them wasn't grand enough? Fuck that. From now on, stick to roughly the same price range as they give to you i.e. if they give you a gift worth 10 quid, they get the same in return. It's more the shitty attitude that would be pissing me off.

They can visit you from now on op. You know they can afford a 5 * hotel... I would say they see you as The Hired Help but that would mean you got paid!

(The real issue is much more their entitlement to our time and labour than the gifts, to be honest).

[quote isthisgreedyofme]@xiaoxiong that is exactly it. It's not the money, it's what the money represents and the way that they've treated our time/labour as a resource they can just draw on. Up until a year ago, DH had a very, very full-on management role and was exhausted all the time to the point he started to have some depression/anxiety issues - they knew he was struggling and on meds and they would still ask us to sort things out for them. We assumed it was because there was a need and it couldn't be done any other way. I feel implicitly lied to, just from the context.

They chose to retire 4 hours' drive from us, so just getting to them every 4-6 weeks to spend a few days sorting them out is really onerous and takes up a significant part of our annual leave.[/quote]
Well I hope your Dh is also on board and will not be running when they click their fingers. Given you live so far away is a positive. It's not like they can call round to give out to him if he declines their request to help them. Both of you need to be on the same page and have your responses ready - go as far as looking up gardeners, financial advisors etc in their area and have the details to hand when they call. If they mention that it will cost them money, be open about the fact that they can well afford it.