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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Tell me who is in the wrong here...

126 replies

Pebbledashery · 16/05/2021 13:24

Posted before regarding highly abusive and violent ex who is also a child abuser. I've been court ordered to make DD available every fortnight for supervised contact in contact centre. Ex is so violent he has TWO supervisors in the room at each session. Have had 6 sessions so far. I missed the last session due to illness but said I'd make up the session the following week and we'll follow that pattern for fortnightly and then append an additional session onto the end before we go back to Court for our next hearing. Ex was trying to force two weeks in a row so we keep to the original fortnightly pattern, but 3 seperate judges have said two sessions in a row is not suits for DD, she repeatedly says she's scared of him, has had violent night terrors screaming out that she's scared and she repeatedly says she doesn't want to see him.
So. All was confirmed to have the missed session take place.. But then, he just doesn't fucking show up!!! Doesn't let anyone know and just ignores all calls from the centre.
I was absolutely livid I just burst into tears as it took hours to get there.
It seems that because he's not getting his way he's punished DD by not showing up.
The contact supervisors were utterly disgusted with him.
Now, I'm wondering who is in the wrong as I made every effort to replace the missed session so that all sessions were attended.. I just utterly refuse to go 2 weeks in a row because its him being a bully.
Please tell me who is wrong here.

OP posts:

MzHz · 29/05/2021 14:26

This is exactly right

It’s how you deal with abusers

Grey rock, no drama,
No negotiation, stick to the script

The contact centre will know what he’s up to and if you keep documenting this for every session there is n independent record for court.

Well done you!

Keep strong, we’re here for you and know how hard this is. It gets easier. Things like what you’ve done today is how you get there

Original poster

Pebbledashery · 29/05/2021 14:47

I know. I'm just a bit worried though. There's no set dates for fortnightly contact in the court order it just says mother to make DD available fortnightly.. The specified start date was missed by him as he didn't bother to submit a referral form in time and the contact centre had to do checks.. So it got pushed back a week later.. I then missed one session through illness but turned up the following week and he purposely didn't show up so I said the next session will be in a fortnight which is this coming session.. He's repeatedly saying I owe a missed session that means I must turn up two weeks in a row and until I confirm in writing he isn't going to show up for contact.
Please tell me that's controlling abuser behaviour and he's taking it out on DD because he's not getting his way.. He's repeatedly saying I've breached the order.. I've missed one session but made it up the following week. He gets 2 sessions a month had he turned up he would've got his two sessions. Sorry if I'm repeating myself or seeking reassurance but this man is so dangerous and violent when he was granted contact it took me a full 3 days of crying and not eating to get over it.. He will destroy her life and punish me for the rest of mine.

OP posts:

San9ro · 29/05/2021 14:48

The courts!

Original poster

Pebbledashery · 29/05/2021 16:24

Too bad abusive parents get all the rights.

OP posts:

squiglet111 · 29/05/2021 16:45

Maybe you need to flip it. Send him a letter that you need confirmation that he will be there 24 hrs before the contact session. If he doesn't confirm then you don't go. If he confirms and doesn't show, then that looks bad on him and more evidence against him. Ignore everything about him asking for two days. Don't even engage. Just keep saying confirm you will be there on set day...

ChiefBabySniffer · 29/05/2021 16:55

Oh op I'm so sorry that you are still going through this. I remember your previous threads. This man is a total monster. But I agree with everybody else. Don't do two weeks in a row. He must confirm with the centre at least 24 hours before the contract is due . If he says he will be there, you must be there. Other wise totally blank him.

Ickythefirebobby · 29/05/2021 17:06

How terrifying and disturbing that the court see fit to force your child to see a man she is frightened of. It beggars belief.

LittleOwl153 · 29/05/2021 17:18

Given the contact was previously Sunday do you have contact scheduled for tomorrow? If you do then I would contact the centre staff and agree a time this evening that is your cut off for knowing whether to go or not - or even something like 9am tomorrow if that still gives you time to get there. If you let the contact people set a time and then the message to him is let them know whether or not you will be there tomorrow by X time or I will consider it you cancelling and forfeiting your session.

Zzelda · 29/05/2021 17:27

Check with your solicitor about the possibility of a statement from the contact supervisors. I would have thought that would be valuable independent evidence for the court.

LittleOwl153 · 29/05/2021 17:27

I'm assuming this him repeatedly saying he won't attend unless you agree to his demands is coming through the contactbcentre and is therefore being recorded... that won't go down well with the court. And the inbetween means it is not your word against his!

Original poster

Pebbledashery · 29/05/2021 17:33

He's basically said to the contact centre if I do not agree to 2 weeks in a row to make up for the missed session he thinks I still owe him then he won't confirm his attendance.. The contact supervisor has text me that.
I'm flabbergasted DD means so little to him but in reality I'm not surprised. This was never about her.. This is how far he can go to still be an abuser.. To PURPOSELY not see his daughter because he's not getting what he wants. The only thing I think will save me is that the session he purposely didn't turn up to, they contact centre staff turned up to and he wasted their time as they opened the centre up specifically for our session..

OP posts:

DontCry4MeMyWillow · 29/05/2021 17:41

@Pebbledashery Hi,
Sorry you are going through this, I have been in this boat so just wanted to ask a few things to share my advice...
Do you have a social worker? I am asking as I wonder if they have done a section 7 report and asked the contact centre for detailed reports on how contact goes between child and parent..this is for the courts.
Are you paying for contact to be established in a centre? Or splitting costs? Also how far is the centre from your home? All of this the courts will have to take into consideration.
I have had to split costs with ex for him to have supervised contact and the judge finally agreed that the centre had to be nearer to me as I was resident parent. Also the contact centre can produce their own reports for you to submit to the judge at the next hearing, detailing why a session was missed due to illness and why it's not in the child's best interest to have contact two weekends in a row. You may have to pay for the report.
Sorry if you know this already, I didn't read the whole thread just seen a few of your posts on here. Good luck

Aprilwasverywet · 29/05/2021 17:45

Look at it as ripping the plaster off. It's tough now for you and dd but hopefully he will be out of the picture sooner rather than later if he carries on with his abuse... His hatred towards you so openly could cost him his dd
.

Duchess379 · 29/05/2021 17:50

Your ex is a complete C U Next Tuesday!! He's controlling & wants everything his own way. Personally, I wouldn't show up or take daughter to these visits if she's got night terrors. What family judge thinks that forcing these visits is in her best interests? *Mindblown. YNTA - put your daughter first 💕

MzHz · 29/05/2021 17:52

Please understand that people like him don’t think of others the way you do, they see everyone as a tool for them to use to get their way

So your job now is to remove all the ways he can use your dd as a method of control.

You do this by stating what you are prepared to do and sticking to the court order but he he refuses to turn up unless you agree to his unreasonable demands then that’s his decision.

Do not deviate from the narrative

He’ll get bored and give up eventually because he’s getting nothing from it and you’re showing him up for the prick he is.

Every other week you text the centre to confirm and if you have not got confirmation he’s coming you don’t go.

He has only one choice then, either to admit defeat and comply with your reasonable conditions and confirm, and turn up to see his dd or he won’t give in and he won’t see her.

It’ll be his choice and given he’s mucked you about needlessly, you’re not unreasonable to request confirmation

Overtime2019 · 29/05/2021 17:54

Op I’ve been in your shoes with my oldest two their dad was the same, he never turned up but keep going as the judge will see your still willing to try and in the end he’ll just say I more visits until your daughter is 16 that’s what happened to me

Original poster

Pebbledashery · 29/05/2021 17:54

[quote DontCry4MeMyWillow]@Pebbledashery Hi,
Sorry you are going through this, I have been in this boat so just wanted to ask a few things to share my advice...
Do you have a social worker? I am asking as I wonder if they have done a section 7 report and asked the contact centre for detailed reports on how contact goes between child and parent..this is for the courts.
Are you paying for contact to be established in a centre? Or splitting costs? Also how far is the centre from your home? All of this the courts will have to take into consideration.
I have had to split costs with ex for him to have supervised contact and the judge finally agreed that the centre had to be nearer to me as I was resident parent. Also the contact centre can produce their own reports for you to submit to the judge at the next hearing, detailing why a session was missed due to illness and why it's not in the child's best interest to have contact two weekends in a row. You may have to pay for the report.
Sorry if you know this already, I didn't read the whole thread just seen a few of your posts on here. Good luck[/quote]
Thank you. So the back story which I've posted in my previous threads is DD and I had to flee domestic abuse last year, she was abused by him also physically and mentally, I was subjected to an extremely violent physical assault by him Which DD witnessed, we had social services involved a few times previously but this time when the police arrived a child protection referral was made by them and i self referred to a domestic abuse agency.. My idva referred us onto Marac.. We were assigned a social worker who basically said if I didn't flee my daughter would be taken off me for failing to protect her. That same day I left with 3 bin bags of belongings and had nowhere to go.. Children's services relocated us to a safe address where he doesn't know where we are.. He went several months without seeing her and tried getting his solicitor to bully me.. Then initiated court proceedings.. He doesn't know where we live. He doesn't know where DD goes to nursery, he no longer knows what car I have and where I work as I got a new car and new job.. He knows nothing.. Contact cannot take place where we live or even half way...that's why I'm scared. If he's given any kind of unsupervised contact, he will find me.. DD and I would be in danger and I'd most probably have to go into a refuge. His own mother was terrified of him and said if I was ever in a room alone with him.. I wouldn't come out alive.
He doesn't accept or admit he's abused us... He's turned it all around on me and said I'm the perpetrator of domestic abuse despite police call outs in double numbers, despite him being arrested several times for assault, despite evidence of his child abuse, despite 4 Marac referrals, despite countless interventions from children's services, despite cafcass saying DD is a vulnerable child who is risk of significant harm from him.
That's basically it.

OP posts:

toocold54 · 29/05/2021 17:56

I’d be tempted to go anyway unless the contact centre has told you not to just because if you don’t go and he’s there he’ll use it against you. If you do go and yes not there yes you’ve wasted your time but it will make you look better that you went all that way and he didn’t bother coming.

Original poster

Pebbledashery · 29/05/2021 18:03

He's already confirmed he's not coming tomorrow unless he has it in writing that I'm coming 2 weeks in a row. The contact centre won't be open as they only open for our session on our day.

OP posts:

chickenyhead · 29/05/2021 18:08

That is an example of him putting his needs first. Don't bite. Follow the court order and arranged contacts.dont engage.

Original poster

Pebbledashery · 29/05/2021 18:08

He's made 2 attempts at our last 2 hearings to push contact up to weekly but both judges refused his request. I was ordered to split the cost with him.

OP posts:

NettleTea · 29/05/2021 19:03

if the contact is supposed to be this week, then go. Do not confirm to him that you will be there 2 weeks running. confirm to contact centre only that you are coming tomorrow, and go. Dont get pulled into his games.
He missed the extra session that you arranged and told him about, he has missed his chance.
keep all the messages to show in court that you turned up for the 'extra' one and he knew about it
show that he is attempting to blackmail you in order to attend this one, despite having missed his 'catch up' session
when he fails to attend tomorrow, thats another point for you.
if he does turn up then it shows him you wont be bullied by him.

Original poster

Pebbledashery · 29/05/2021 19:18

But I've already been told contact isn't going ahead tomo UNLESS i confirm I'm going two weeks in a row in writing. The centre won't be open tomorrow so it'll be just a wasted trip.. I could just turn up and take a time stamped photo of the contact centre to prove I had made DD available.. But the staff won't be there. So it's either I do that or I don't go.

OP posts:

Rmka · 29/05/2021 19:25

@Pebbledashery, then I'm sure you're doing the right thing. If the contact supervisors won't be there then it's not even safe for you to go in case he shows up, if I understand correctly?

I feel so sorry for you and your DD and I hope the court will stop this contact soon.

chickenyhead · 29/05/2021 19:28

If the contact centre has told you not to go, don't go. Never go when there aren't staff to supervise. Go only when arranged in accordance with the court order. Do not rise to blackmail attempts. Just confirm with contact when you need to attend.

Do not engage in blackmail or try reasoning with an abuser. Call the contact centre each week to see if contact Is going ahead or not and keep records.

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