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Original poster

To ask everyone in the UK to watch this NI documentary

326 replies

NornIronKid · 13/05/2021 10:08

You will (hopefully) be aware of the Ballymurphy Massacre, that has been in the news this week, when innocent civilians were killed by British soldiers in 1971. It has taken 50 years for the victims' names to be cleared of any wrongdoing.

There has been a lot of posts on here mentioning NI over the past years due to Brexit, and it has become clear that many people in GB are not aware of the history. This documentary is from 3 years ago and now showing again on Ch4 - it is a long, difficult but important watch

www.channel4.com/programmes/massacre-at-ballymurphy

OP posts:
HerMammy · 14/05/2021 09:18

Let it go
Would you let it go if it was your mother, your sister?
Appalling comments on here, we see your ignorance and arrogance and it’s not pleasant.

pinkearedcow · 14/05/2021 09:28

@Pixxie7

It was an awful time but there were wrongs on both sides, it went on for years and it was a frightening time for everyone. We can’t keep raking up the past and need to move on otherwise there is a risk of history repeating itself.
Some people really do need to read up on why the British Army were deployed to NI in the first place and the reasons why people who were initially supportive of their presence turned against them.

www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2020/07/06/news/50th-anniversary-of-falls-curfew-remembered-1996012/

YouWerePrettyIWasLonely · 14/05/2021 09:35

I'm just going to post this picture. If you are OK with any of it then you need to take a long look in the mirror.

To ask everyone in the UK to watch this NI documentary
RuggerHug · 14/05/2021 09:41

@ChinookPilotsGoVertical

Watch (or read) Peter Taylor's 3 programmes (&books) for the BBC, "Provos", "Loyalists" & "Brits" - they give a good examination of the origins & development of the Troubles. I learned a lot that I didn't know & that some of what I "knew" was wrong.
Haven't seen these so will look them up, thanks!
MabelPines · 14/05/2021 09:52

I wonder how many deaths could have been saved had the UK government passed an equality act and changed the voting system

That is a really good point.

I’ve got to go to work so won’t be back till this afternoon but I just want to make the point to people about the soldiers: they were in NI to do a job which was to prevent a civil war, and to understand why things went so wrong you do need to look at the context, it’s not ‘whataboutery’ it’s an understanding of the bigger picture, which gives people a better understanding of how to see things from all sides.

*it should go without saying but for the avoidance of doubt - if soldiers do their job unlawfully of course there should be a proper investigation into why and polices updated and training implemented so it doesn’t happen again.

StepawayfromtheBiscuittin · 14/05/2021 10:01

@YouWerePrettyIWasLonely
Shocking isn't it. I knew of some of these but I've never seen them all together like that.
Combine those powers with an army that held no regard for innocent people...

And to all the posters talking about sides. I grew up in NI. The only side I'm on is the side of treating everyone equally. Of ensuring the record of history is accurate and not a cover up. Of working towards a better future for all those who live in NI.

MissMarks · 14/05/2021 10:47

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MindtheBelleek · 14/05/2021 10:53

[quote CourtAndSpark2]@NornIronKid, I do appreciate the distinction you are trying to make.

Regardless of a difference or not, these prosecutions never happen, that's the reality (lest you think I'm defending it, I'm not, it was murder ... as with the republican/unionist terrorists).[/quote]
When you say 'these prosecutions never happen', which other instances are you thinking of, of the British army killing British citizens within the UK?

DynamoKev · 14/05/2021 11:29

@YouWerePrettyIWasLonely

I'm just going to post this picture. If you are OK with any of it then you need to take a long look in the mirror.
Not Ok with any of it at all.

Pop quiz - which Parliament passed it?

dancerdog · 14/05/2021 12:55

RuggerHug

tansplaining...!

fireproofwitch · 14/05/2021 19:50

@YouWerePrettyIWasLonely

I'm just going to post this picture. If you are OK with any of it then you need to take a long look in the mirror.
Some of the responses here are just downright ignorant. The victims were branded as terrorists as a justification for their murders, despite all being unarmed. Meanwhile, the killers went on to kill again. Not easy for any family to "move on" until the truth was acknowledged.
StoneofDestiny · 14/05/2021 20:18

The massacres in Ballymurphy and Bloody Sunday were definitely a driver in the rise of power of the IRA in the early days of the Troubles.

No one has denied atrocities committed by the IRA

Exactly

Some of the responses on here show total ignorance of the history and events of 'the troubles* as they have been called, and a complete ignorance of Irish and Irish/British history.

Proven in court - the people killed on Bloody Sunday and in The Ballymurphy Massacre were not members of the IRA. They were innocent victims.

underneaththeash · 14/05/2021 20:20

The history is - that is was horrendous and innocent people were tortured and killed on both sides and in the UK.

Both sides need to let it go. Nothing is gained by dredging up the past - as you can see by the trouble in Belfast.

StoneofDestiny · 14/05/2021 20:22

I wonder how many deaths could have been saved had the UK government passed an equality act and changed the voting system

Exactly, bad government becomes the breeding ground of disaffected citizens. Some disaffected citizens become terrorists.

But I'm guessing, looking at some of the responses on here, many have never heard of gerrymandering.

Blossomtoes · 14/05/2021 20:25

@underneaththeash

The history is - that is was horrendous and innocent people were tortured and killed on both sides and in the UK.

Both sides need to let it go. Nothing is gained by dredging up the past - as you can see by the trouble in Belfast.

This. All my bloke’s family live in N Ireland and say the vast majority of the population are desperate to move on, they don’t want to be defined by the past.
HannaHat · 14/05/2021 20:26

I watched it. Absolutely heart wrenching. The daughter talking about how her dying mum was crying made me sob.
It was 8 years before I was born but I’m ashamed I didn’t know anything about it, although I do recall seeing the photograph of the priest.
Really shocking.

StoneofDestiny · 14/05/2021 20:27

Thank god we teach history in school so we can help young people understand the past and learn not to repeat the mistakes of the past. Sadly, not enough modern British history is taught and lots of adults today remain clueless about the NI situation.

tonimitchell · 14/05/2021 20:32

I don’t know why people are conflating IRA terrorists with Irish civilians.

What the British soldiers did was a travesty. They were welcomed at first but it soon became apparent they were not friendly. They murdered women and children.

These women and children were not IRA terrorists.

They made a bad situation even worse.

StoneofDestiny · 14/05/2021 20:37

I don’t know why people are conflating IRA terrorists with Irish civilians

Ignorance, and lack of understanding of historical fact..

tonimitchell · 14/05/2021 20:56

@StoneofDestiny

I don’t know why people are conflating IRA terrorists with Irish civilians

Ignorance, and lack of understanding of historical fact..

Yeah.. it’s embarrassing really.

I’m British but have Irish family. I always feel some weird sense of shame when I see them.

Bloodypunkrockers · 14/05/2021 21:15

@underneaththeash

The history is - that is was horrendous and innocent people were tortured and killed on both sides and in the UK.

Both sides need to let it go. Nothing is gained by dredging up the past - as you can see by the trouble in Belfast.

Again

What "side" were the British Army on

What "side" were the people murdered at Ballymurphy on?

Ffs

RuggerHug · 14/05/2021 21:53

"Can't they/you all get over it, it's rather uncomfortable for me to acknowledge I have no interest in history or how other people in the world feel".

RuggerHug · 14/05/2021 21:54

You didn't do anything wrong(as far as I know, joke!). Just acknowledging it and not being ignorant/saying stupid things is fine.

Fireflygal · 14/05/2021 22:34

@underneaththeash,

It has always been acknowledged that the IRA and Loyalists were terrorists who murdered innocent people. It has only just been acknowledged that The British Army also killed innocent people. This is why it's news.

I'm glad that the Government has admitted the truth about British Army brutality to catholics as it was widely known in the rest of the world but the people of the UK were ignorant to it.

If you watch the documentary you will see the victims family want to move on and now the truth is out they can. They victims reputations can be restored and the truth will heal.

It's a good day that will lead to healing however it's deeply shameful for the regiment involved.

StoneofDestiny · 14/05/2021 22:43

Both sides need to let it go

It's not 'sides' !
It's the British Army who massacred innocent citizens. No sides about it. An unlawful criminal act carried out by the British Army.

Can you imagine this happening to a group out shopping in The Trafford Centre or Bluewater or while gathering on Princes Street or Oxford Street? Could you imagine people saying 'you need to get over it?
No, of course not.