To expect an exception for bf baby?

[PatchItUp]

I have a 2 month old baby who is exclusively breastfed. Today I’ve got a hairdressers appointment for the first time in months and I’ve been really looking forward to it. I’m having cut and colour so may be a few hours. I’d expressed some milk and my DH is going to try giving him a bottle for the first time.

I mentioned when I arrived that this was the situation and that if he refused the bottle, my DH would bring the baby in to be fed then take him away again. I’ve done this in a different hairdressers with my older children before with no problem.

The receptionist said there was a no children policy and therefore I wouldn’t be able to bring him in. I was a bit shocked and reiterated that he is very young, exclusively bf and couldn’t be left hungry if he wouldn’t take the bottle. She said she would check with the hairdresser.

Hairdresser came and said much the same thing - no child policy, if we make an exception for you we have to make one for everyone and customers will complain. I said again that I understood a no child policy to prevent toddlers running around or making noise but this would be a small baby coming in for a feed and then out again. She said she would check with the manager.

Manager heard and said from across the room ‘there’s nowhere for you to go’. By this point all the customers are listening and I felt really conscious and upset about being argued with by three different members of staff. I was fairly sure that this was illegal refusal of services but not totally confident so I said ‘I don’t need to go anywhere, he’ll just be on my lap, have a feed then go again’. They all again said it’s company policy, they can’t make any exceptions. The manager said ‘what’s the percentage chance he’ll need to come in?’ And one of the women said ‘there’s a good chance he’ll just take the bottle so why not take the risk?’ I replied I couldn’t take the risk that he wouldn’t take it and would be left screaming and hungry and not allowed to come in.

Eventually the manager reluctantly agreed that he could be brought in if necessary but it was clear they were really unhappy about it and it’s soured the experience for me massively.

When I checked on my phone it seems they’re acting illegally in refusing services to a breastfeeding mother, although I guess they could argue it’s down to chemical hazards (although this wasn’t mentioned at any time as a reason).

So - was I being unreasonable? And would I be unreasonable to complain later on?

I know some people will say I should have just left but my hair is such a state!! And I’ve been really looking forward to having it cut and having a few hours to myself.

I am surprised that as one poster said, they breastfed a baby on their lap while having their hair dyed. I don't think that is safe for the baby.

It's shocking that a site largely used by women can be have so many vile misogynistic posters.

If you think that women thinking that it's perfectly acceptable, indeed even attractive, for a venue to be childfree is misogynistic....then, my dear, you are very lucky never to have experienced the real thing.

I’ve only read a few pages, but it’s interesting as I had no idea what the legal status was.

All I do know is that I had rubbish hair for 2-3 years being a single mother with a young baby! No extended family to give the baby to for a few hours and breast fed mostly for the first six months too, and if I ever had a break from work or being a mother I just slept...

Yanbu.

YABU. Also the way you speak like its a done deal would get my back up. You sound extremely entitled in the way you spoke to them IMO

All those people quoting the legal rights of BF mothers (of which I was one and am not disagreeing with) - is this in the current context of COVID and some common sense.

So you’re in a salon and multiple women have EBF babies. The salon has to cater for the possibility of multiple dads dropping off babies thus increasing the risk on premise (to themselves and everyone around them). How does this work exactly from the perspective of running a viable business where every person on-site is temperature checked and given fresh PPE and there are restrictions on numbers?

@Lemonelderflower

Actually HalfShrunkMoreToGo reasonable adaptations should be made to allow a breastfeeding woman to attend an exam.

The obvious one being own room and supervised breaks to feed.

Seriously this thread

Not the case at all.

The exam provider only delivers tests that can be completed by over 18s so the exam centre is adults only, no children allowed. This is stipulated throughout booking information and T&Cs.

No babies/children are allowed regardless of whether they are bottle fed or breastfed.

The length of the exam is 45 minutes so reasonable for people to plan around, and there is no specific time of the year it needs to be completed or deadline for completion, so reasonable to wait a few months if needed.

The E&D act requires that "reasonable adjustments" are made, and those adjustments should be reasonable to meet the candidates needs AND the business needs.

It is not reasonable to pay staff to individually invigilate a test for one candidate and absorb the additional staffing costs that entails when the candidate is able to either wait a few months till baby doesn't need feeding every hour or provide an alternative like expressed milk.

You have misunderstood the legislation.

@Whybot

YANBU I would suggest asking that they revise their no children policy for breast fed babies under 1 year of age. But I would not go to a hairdresser that had a no child policy. Perhaps just write a review with positive and negative points on their website rather than formal complaint?

Why should they? Why should OP not just go to a kid friendly hairdressers?

Review - Positives - good colour and cut. Negatives - made me adhere to their policies when I should be exempt.

If you say under 1 then I guarantee you will get 13 month kids in with parents saying they are 11 months old or whining that they only turned 1 two weeks ago so why am I not alooooooooowed?

YANBU.

@Iminaglasscaseofemotion

And the guidance states that there are only two circumstances where it is legal to prevent a woman breastfeeding (those I stated above).

And one of them applies to a hairdressers.

Maybe, but not necessarily. If this were the case, people entering the salon would need PPE etc. The health and safety risk would apply to everyone. Additionally, if it were the case, no hairdressers would permit children

@Somethingsnappy but no hairdresser allows tiny children to be near dyes. That is a health and safety hazard. Young children get their hair cut.

I don't know why people are tying themselves in knots to dispute this.

Just let those of us who don't want to be around babies and kids on our day off, have a handful of spaces where we can do that please.

@Clusterfckintolerant

YABU. Sorry. You booked at a no-child salon. Your baby is a child.

Just to drive the point a little, it's not just about noise, disruption or risk. Clients may use the salon because they can't handle or are not allowed to be, around children.

This is a huge point.

It isn’t that OP shouldn’t have her hair cut. Not at all, she deserved a break and a pamper. But so do other people.

We don’t know why they have a child free policy, it could be health and safety, it could be so it is a safe haven for people to go that A) cannot be around children, B) don’t want to be around children. I didn’t after I lost my baby, which is why I chose child free hairdressers/spas etc.

She wasn’t told she couldn’t have a service, she was told that the premises don’t allow children. Further, the reasoning is unknown.

You should name the hairdresser so I can go and give her my business and thank her for standing up to entitled people who simply cannot bear to be told no.

YABU OP. It's basic health and safety, risk and COSSH assesment. BF babies should not be allowed in potentially hazardous environment. Being a mother myself, I would be seriously concerned about the wellbeing of a baby in such unsuitable premises as hairdressers. Potentially, if reported, the situation will a reason for a salon insurance withdrawal. And social services involvement as it looks like the hair 'state’ is more important that likelihood of harm to baby due to chemicals, heated air, sharp objects.

YANBU

I did it a few times with DD when she was a baby (pre-COVID). My salon was very accommodating. DP brought baby in the sling while I was waiting for colour to set, fed for a few minutes, left, no one batted an eyelid.

YAnbu. I wouldn't have asked.

@PatchItUp
I hope you are happy with your new haircut and planning to change the hairdresser.
Thanks for pointing out that their refusal was not due to Covid,I still think they are massively unreasonable to refuse to accommodate your tiny baby,I would name and shame as places with such a level of discrimination should start thinking twice about their ridiculous rules without a good reason(kids running wild-yes,it not safe,but a tiny baby that needs a feed or a quiet child that just waits for mum is completely different story).

I have breastfed my girls in all sorts of places and have always felt confident in doing so. Always made to feel welcome and supported when doing so in cafes etc where it was if no inconvenience to the staff or fellow customers.

I would not have expected it to be ok for me to bring my young baby into a hairdressing salon (especially in the evening), safety aside they don't want potentially crying babies in a relaxing adult space, and it could cost the hairdresser valuable time/money if the mother is fussing over the baby and therefore not staying still. I would also feel uncomfortable taking a baby/young child to other environments such as pubs in the evening, posh restaurants, cinemas showing films for adults etc. And I wouldn't automatically expect a breastfeeding baby to be invited to a wedding ceremony and/or reception where the bride and groom have not invited other children.

It's not the breastfeeding that is the issue, it's just that some environments are inappropriate for babies and children from the point of view of both the baby and the clientele. Sometimes children are just not welcome and we all need to respect that.

There is a time and a place for most things, children and breastfeeding included.....

Whilst I understand how you feel, the salon told you 3 times that it was policy. Wait till you're sure dc takes a bottle or is going a reasonable period between feeds. Test it out a few times till you're sure. My first refused a bottle point blank till he was weaned off the breast completely. My second didn't really care. Your dc is only 2 mths and is probably around time for a growth spurt which leads to big feeds, so you want to be extra sure dc is okay taking bottles.Last but not least, in fact probably most important, book a different salon.

I doubt anyone would take a toddler to a haircut, it is not worth the hassle. People might take tiny babies, 7 year olds to sit quietly with a book or an 11 year old watching YouTube on phone etc, so making an exception for anyone could be a problem for hairdresser as anyone taking their child thinks the child will be no bother.

As a back up plan rather than actually bringing baby I think they were unreasonable not to allow you.

@sunshinesontv

Are you hoping you will get a medal and a lollipop to?

[quote 3JsMa]@sunshinesontv

Are you hoping you will get a medal and a lollipop to? [/quote]
Are you confusing me with someone else? I don't know what you're on about.

@PatchItUp

maternityaction.org.uk/advice/breastfeeding-in-public-places/#:~:text=Service%20providers%20include%20most%20organisations,woman%20because%20she%20is%20breastfeeding.&text=Therefore%2C%20a%20cafe%20owner%20cannot,or%20refuse%20to%20serve%20you.
Here is good explanation that it was indeed a discrimination.

YABVU. The world really doesnt revolve around you and your circumstances. I work with a woman like you and to hear her talk you would think she was the first person to ever have a child (eg today off work because child has a cold). You have older children so know that in some circumstances it isnt reasonable for children to be there. Your attitude reminds me of a post on my local facebook page - parent took a child into an antique shop - toddler had a wee on the floor - parent was outraged that the "local business" wasnt supportive. Please get a grip and fairly soon.