To expect an exception for bf baby?

[PatchItUp]

I have a 2 month old baby who is exclusively breastfed. Today I’ve got a hairdressers appointment for the first time in months and I’ve been really looking forward to it. I’m having cut and colour so may be a few hours. I’d expressed some milk and my DH is going to try giving him a bottle for the first time.

I mentioned when I arrived that this was the situation and that if he refused the bottle, my DH would bring the baby in to be fed then take him away again. I’ve done this in a different hairdressers with my older children before with no problem.

The receptionist said there was a no children policy and therefore I wouldn’t be able to bring him in. I was a bit shocked and reiterated that he is very young, exclusively bf and couldn’t be left hungry if he wouldn’t take the bottle. She said she would check with the hairdresser.

Hairdresser came and said much the same thing - no child policy, if we make an exception for you we have to make one for everyone and customers will complain. I said again that I understood a no child policy to prevent toddlers running around or making noise but this would be a small baby coming in for a feed and then out again. She said she would check with the manager.

Manager heard and said from across the room ‘there’s nowhere for you to go’. By this point all the customers are listening and I felt really conscious and upset about being argued with by three different members of staff. I was fairly sure that this was illegal refusal of services but not totally confident so I said ‘I don’t need to go anywhere, he’ll just be on my lap, have a feed then go again’. They all again said it’s company policy, they can’t make any exceptions. The manager said ‘what’s the percentage chance he’ll need to come in?’ And one of the women said ‘there’s a good chance he’ll just take the bottle so why not take the risk?’ I replied I couldn’t take the risk that he wouldn’t take it and would be left screaming and hungry and not allowed to come in.

Eventually the manager reluctantly agreed that he could be brought in if necessary but it was clear they were really unhappy about it and it’s soured the experience for me massively.

When I checked on my phone it seems they’re acting illegally in refusing services to a breastfeeding mother, although I guess they could argue it’s down to chemical hazards (although this wasn’t mentioned at any time as a reason).

So - was I being unreasonable? And would I be unreasonable to complain later on?

I know some people will say I should have just left but my hair is such a state!! And I’ve been really looking forward to having it cut and having a few hours to myself.

[quote PatchItUp]@BonasthatBonas so I shouldn’t have my hair cut for as long as I’m breastfeeding?

I promise not to complain if my baby accidentally swallows my hair [/quote]
I started using a mobile hairdresser for this reason. I couldn't justify a few hours in a salon and couldn't take them with me.

I EBF for 14 mo.

YABU

You would like to get your hair cut and coloured but it’s not essential. It’s poses extra risk to your baby plus those around you and the answer is no as they don’t have facilities and it’s not essential they make them available. If it’s too long in one go then you can have separate appts - or none.

@SecretSpAD

Really? Your niece actively sought advice on whether what she was doing would be discriminatory to b/f mothers

Err, no. She wanted to make sure that she and her business was legally,protected. My niece doesn't give a shiny shit whether a woman is breastfeeding or not. She just didn't want under 18's in her cafe.

Ok, so how did the b/f part come up then? You specifically said she was given advice on this.

Incidentally I managed several haircuts of 1-2 hrs each with no issue during those 14mo. You’re over-engineering this situation massively.

why would she not as she was opening a business ?

You really think she said oh I want an adult only space, what do I do re b/f mothers?

Riiight.

Are there really people so stupid that they believe it's illegal for a private business to have a child-free policy?

FWIW legislation that protects breastfeeding mother's right to breastfeed in any space was first introduced in the 70s in England.

The equality act has nothing to do with any of this. I have questions about the 'solicitors' on this thread.

You would like to get your hair cut and coloured but it’s not essential.

Since when should mothers only be able to do something if it meets the criterion of 'essential'.

If she wants to get her hair done in a salon, and needs to be able to, reasonably, feed her baby while there, she should be able to.

@EarringsandLipstick she probably did specifically ask. She trained as a solicitor so would have thought of all eventualities. And good for her, I say.

@Trixie78

Gosh I'm going against the grain here it seems but I think the hairdresser's handled that dreadfully. No bother would be caused to anyone by a baby having a 10 minute feed on your lap FFS! Are mothers just supposed to stay at home for months/years if bf? Give your heads wobble the lot of you. 🤔🤔🤔

OP cancel your appointment and go somewhere else who understands their customer's needs, you deserve this to be a relaxing experience xx

Completely agree.

I took my daughter with me when breastfeeding, & fed her under the cape. No issue.
Wasn’t a no child policy hairdressers though (& years ago, although I’m not sure their reasoning was anything to do with COVID anyway). I wouldn’t have gone to one that was in the first place.

@KeepWashingThoseHands

Incidentally I managed several haircuts of 1-2 hrs each with no issue during those 14mo. You’re over-engineering this situation massively.

You know what, OP really isn't.

She planned for her DH to mind baby & expressed milk.

She also planned, and mentioned to the salon, that perhaps baby might not take bottle & a breast feed would be necessary.

In the end, it wasn't.

There was no over-engineering & your posts are plain nasty.

I still instinctively feel it is unfair, but recognise this isn't exactly a cast-iron argument

Oh yes it might be seem as unfair but in this case 'unfair' is subjective and it does very much depend on the side of the fence you are sitting on.

The ban in children in this case might be a safety issue with regards to chemicals, wax and so forth or it might be a gap in the market where people want to have their treatments in peace and quiet without kids. Other customers might even have kids and want the silence for a respite.

When previously working in the services sector I found it far easier to enforce the rules to a customer who did not agree with them, rather than explain to another customer why exceptions have been made for somebody else.

Anecdotally despite having children myself I was a member of an adults only gym before it was bought out by a bigger chain.

She trained as a solicitor

Handy that 😉

@EarringsandLipstick yes, maybe she did specifically ask....was the bit missing from the beginning of my last post

Nobody sane thinks Op should not have a haircut its just many disagreed that the hairdresser with a no child policy should of made exemptions and some felt also not best place for baby with hair dye etc
Also as baby had never had bottle might of been worth trying before this day
OP said herself she was unaware of the policy of the shop so fair enough and I am sure going forward she will use another hairdressers who would allow.
Her baby took a bottle by sound of it anyway so was ok , as I don't agree with those who said baby could just wait if they didn't take it.
Whilst I think b/ f in public is fine and should of course be allowed , I also agree that of a place has a no child policy then that is also fine and exceptions don't need to be made , some bottle fed babies will only take a bottle off mum as well or only be held by mum etc
OP had her hair done ( hope you like it) and her baby was ok with the bottle and she is obviously a good mum doing her best so doesn't deserve any abuse

Yanbu

The ONLY TWO places where a woman can be prevented from breastfeeding her baby are

You are missing the point. She was not banned from breastfeeding per se. She was banned from bringing the child in to the salon due to the no children rule which is completely lawful.

If you do not have the baby then you cannot breasteed.

so doesn't deserve any abuse

And you know what worried neither do all the women you wanted to disparage for potentially wanting to feed their baby eg at work, or in an exam centre.

Each single one you repeatedly complained about.

Where is the support for women here?

I feel for you OP I understand

Recently I had to go to a and e and they tried to refuse to let my 8 m old bf baby come in I had to really push the issue they were telling me to get dh to pick her up and she wasn’t allowed but I Insisted as I was there for mastitis and needed iv antibiotics and dd has cmpa and digestive issues has never had a bottle and only has 2 v small meals a day still so she had to stay with me ! They were not happy at all blamed covid but I had to insist

@EarringsandLipstick yes, I think it was handy that she was able to use her training to make sure that she was not opening herself up to challenge from MN warriors who think they know the law, when they don't.

@PrincessBuggerPants

FWIW legislation that protects breastfeeding mother's right to breastfeed in any space was first introduced in the 70s in England.

The equality act has nothing to do with any of this. I have questions about the 'solicitors' on this thread.

Mm, well the EA has been used to enforce the right to bf, but via a claim of sex discrimination which isn't applicable here.

Absolutely @SecretSpAD and handy that the little drip-feed about her (extremely useful) prior training came some way into your example about your 'cousin'

@PrincessBuggerPants your questioning several solicitors but not that maybe others have interpreted it wrong .
There are lots of adult only places and I don't think they would allow a baby on so mum could breastfeed such as clubs and betting shops , adult only gyms,
Adult only holidays don't allow children , pretty sure they don't have to make exceptions for a b/ f mother

YABU. Sorry. You booked at a no-child salon. Your baby is a child.

Just to drive the point a little, it's not just about noise, disruption or risk. Clients may use the salon because they can't handle or are not allowed to be, around children.

[quote worriedatthemoment]@Somethingsnappy yet 2 solicitors have posted to say otherwise as it has a child free policy so they are not discriminating her , otherwise you could say a breastfeeding num could book an adult only holiday as they have no right to stop her bringing her baby [/quote]
I know and I've been engaging with the solicitors. I appreciate their input; it's actually quite a complicated subject. I intended that post to be directed at them, because I can't understand why the guidelines for women, made by the relevant authorities, do not seem to include the 'no child' policy in their guidance. Most women reading them will not have law expertise, so will take the guidance at face value. And the guidance states that there are only two circumstances where it is legal to prevent a woman breastfeeding (those I stated above).