To expect an exception for bf baby?

[PatchItUp]

I have a 2 month old baby who is exclusively breastfed. Today I’ve got a hairdressers appointment for the first time in months and I’ve been really looking forward to it. I’m having cut and colour so may be a few hours. I’d expressed some milk and my DH is going to try giving him a bottle for the first time.

I mentioned when I arrived that this was the situation and that if he refused the bottle, my DH would bring the baby in to be fed then take him away again. I’ve done this in a different hairdressers with my older children before with no problem.

The receptionist said there was a no children policy and therefore I wouldn’t be able to bring him in. I was a bit shocked and reiterated that he is very young, exclusively bf and couldn’t be left hungry if he wouldn’t take the bottle. She said she would check with the hairdresser.

Hairdresser came and said much the same thing - no child policy, if we make an exception for you we have to make one for everyone and customers will complain. I said again that I understood a no child policy to prevent toddlers running around or making noise but this would be a small baby coming in for a feed and then out again. She said she would check with the manager.

Manager heard and said from across the room ‘there’s nowhere for you to go’. By this point all the customers are listening and I felt really conscious and upset about being argued with by three different members of staff. I was fairly sure that this was illegal refusal of services but not totally confident so I said ‘I don’t need to go anywhere, he’ll just be on my lap, have a feed then go again’. They all again said it’s company policy, they can’t make any exceptions. The manager said ‘what’s the percentage chance he’ll need to come in?’ And one of the women said ‘there’s a good chance he’ll just take the bottle so why not take the risk?’ I replied I couldn’t take the risk that he wouldn’t take it and would be left screaming and hungry and not allowed to come in.

Eventually the manager reluctantly agreed that he could be brought in if necessary but it was clear they were really unhappy about it and it’s soured the experience for me massively.

When I checked on my phone it seems they’re acting illegally in refusing services to a breastfeeding mother, although I guess they could argue it’s down to chemical hazards (although this wasn’t mentioned at any time as a reason).

So - was I being unreasonable? And would I be unreasonable to complain later on?

I know some people will say I should have just left but my hair is such a state!! And I’ve been really looking forward to having it cut and having a few hours to myself.

What a lot of dramatic crap.

Yanbu OP.

Although the business can set their own rules, they are being unnecessarily awkward, which given the affects of covid on many businesses like this one, you'd think they would be more pleasant and welcoming.

A baby potentially coming in for a quick feed them being taken out again will have little to no affect whatsoever on anybody.

If they started screaming the place down and affecting the atmosphere, or the OP buggered off to get them to calm down and affected appointment times, then yes they'd have a point, but it hasn't even happened and probably wouldn't.

No, I think it's discriminatory but I don't think I'd go to them on principle about their flexibility. I'd choose a more accomodating hairdresser.

Has there ever been a test case against say an adult only spa or hotel refusing to allow a baby? Be interested to see it if that's the case, as I said I know Scotland does include the term anywhere the child is allowed to be.

@1boo1

YABU. No child policy which you knew about and also covid restrictions will make it even more difficult for them to make exceptions. This is for yours and your baby's safety

It’s not a no breastfeeding mother policy though

This is an exception within the law to no child policies

YANBU

@Aprilshowersandhail

Maybe this is why God gave us mobile hairdressers....

And hair dying kits.

@TagsMum

Do I think your being unreasonable - Yes. Would I be pissed if a baby turned up at a no-children salon - No.

Private businesses can implement rules and obviously they chose this rule for a reason, weather that be to give adults child free time or for safety. It doesn't matter which, ultimately that is their rules.

I understand the stress of BF, I've done it for 3 babies. But you did have time in advance to prepare baby with a bottle.

I don't think you can be pissed off at others for being abit annoyed that their kid free time has been interrupted. Try and understand the different perspective.

Private businesses/providers of services aren't able to implement policies that go against their statutory obligations, though - that's the entire point. Their policies have to accommodate the law, and so does their insurance.

There would be no point at all in discrimination law if providers could just have "policies" that disregarded it, would there?

As most others have said YABU. Breastfeeding doesn’t give you an automatic right to flout rules.

It’s policy, plain and simple. There’s lots of ‘what ifs’ .... but actually ‘what if’ your ds chose today to NOT breastfeed in his usual 15 minutes? ‘What if’ your ds needed feeding at a very inappropriate/inconvenient time of your styling? ‘What if’ he was unsettled by the noise/unfamiliar environment and screamed/feuded to feed? It’s not just others’ experiences to think of, or what could potentially happen to him (fumes, hair, heat etc, but also the fact that ds may not react/behave in his usual way, so your 15 mins could actually work out far from that.

Anyhow, good to see he took the bottle and you had your hair done.

@Viviennemary

Imagine if some hair dye dripped into the baby's eye.

This is an exception within the law to no child policies

Where? I can’t find it.

And it is discriminatory to the breastfeeding mother as she needs to breastfeed a baby, is not allowed to do so, so cannot access the service. The law doesn’t apply to the baby - it applies to the mother.

If they have a no child policy then they have a no child policy.
When you feed they could bit continue to cut your hair or dye or whatever and as limited people allowed in , you would be taking up more time.
They wouldn't if let someone in to bottle feed either.
If you knew you were going why had you not expressed and your dh tried a bottle before the appt?

TheKeatingFive

I did not say you should not have your hair cut when you have a 2 month old.

I said would it kill you if you did not?
and what I did when my baby was 2 months old is not what I am implying everyone should do. But i am questioning why OP could not think of the other options which are alternatives to arguing with not less than 3 people at that hair dressers.

of which i think there are many many options.... and none of those other options are about society as a whole trying to silence or cancel breast feeding women.

And currently they are only allowed X amount of people in and therefore are timing to be able to get the max amount of people in and out since they have been shut for a significant amount of time. Every appt I have been to for various things in the last few weeks has been to a strict time scale

It seems to have changed with our local hairdressers. I had my hair cut at one - washed by one lady, cut by another. And then at another salon I had my highlights done by one lady and the colour taken off and it rough dried by another. I was a bit surprised because I thought it was end to end with one person.

I also walked past a third salon yesterday and it looked really busy inside (admittedly they did have the door open so plenty of ventilation). But I don't think covid is a reason to exclude babies as a consequence. But they can refuse for other reasons like wanting an adults-only environment.

How can it possibly be discriminatory.
The insurance would be a nightmare for them to add a baby.
What if dye dropped in babies eyes.
Also, some people prefer adults only and look for businesses with this policy.
There are plenty of hairdressers on the high street that cut kids hair, so of course they are child friendly.
Pre covid I've seen mothers bf whilst their other child is having a cut.

A recurring theme on MN is that people genuinely think they are special because they are pregnant/have kids. Hint, you are not.

Wow, this is so unnecessarily spiteful.

A bfing mum is not asking for special treatment. She wants to do the same things as other people while ensuring her baby doesn’t go hungry. What kind of person doesn’t get that.

And that includes going to an actual physical hair salon. Because I don’t see why bfing mums should have to be stuck in the house unnecessarily either.

But why shouldn’t you get a haircut when you have a 2 month old baby. I don’t follow this reasoning.

Because I exclusively breastfed 10 babies while living in a shoe and didn’t have a bath or go to the dentist for 17 years.

Or the shorter version - misogyny.

No, they really are.

Give the baby formula

No, how about YOU check the law and let me feed my baby

I’ve reported that one keating

Lay into a mum with a two month old and make her feel shit, isn’t that poster so cool and tells it like it is

@poppycat10

I would love there to be a law that says places have to make reasonable allowances for breastfeeding babies to be kept with their mums. It's so stressful and exclusionary when you have to go into hospital or to a school appointment or something and your baby can't/won't take a bottle or you can't pump

The reasonable allowance in this case is to use a mobile hairdresser.

And now school meetings have moved onto Zoom, that's not an issue either.

Hospital appointments are not realistic, you can't have a baby attached to you if eg they are trying to remove a mole! The father needs to step up at that point and look after the baby until you can feed it. Of course, so many won't ask for the time off work but that is a different issue entirely.

A recurring theme on MN is that people genuinely think they are special because they are pregnant/have kids. Hint, you are not. Millions are born around the world every day and you have to adjust your life to the world, not the other way round. In this context it means either making sure baby will take bottle while you get your hair cut or getting a mobile hairdresser to visit.

Again @poppycat10, you’re arguing against a mothers choice to parents. there should be regulations to allow babies to stay with mums. I believe in attachment parenting and stayed with my DC when they were that little and feeding on demand. So I expect to be able to take my baby to school and doctors and hospital appointments. And I did, and no one turned me away and if they had I would have complained.

We don’t support parents enough in this country. All the stupid arguments of ‘millions of people ah e babies all the time’ is a weak, pathetic and parent-shaming argument.

@Trixie78 I bf both my kids , at no time did I have to take a baby into a hairdressers though or expect to , especially one that has a no child policy
At the moment hairdressers can have limited people in , so whilst op baby has a 10/ 20 min feed then hairdresser can't work on her hair and time slots are limited .

Christ. The irony is that I bet 100% of posters on this thread would be outraged if a business discriminated against them on the grounds of another EqA10 protected characteristic. But bf mother it's absolutely fine....? Nice one, MN.

And it is discriminatory to the breastfeeding mother as she needs to breastfeed a baby, is not allowed to do so, so cannot access the service. The law doesn’t apply to the baby - it applies to the mother

It's not discriminatory. They aren't refusing the mother, nor are they saying she can't breastfeed. They just don't accept children as is their right as a business. The mother could have made other arrangements and didn't, that's not the salons fault.

@WorkplaceLlama

This is an exception within the law to no child policies

Where? I can’t find it.

And it is discriminatory to the breastfeeding mother as she needs to breastfeed a baby, is not allowed to do so, so cannot access the service. The law doesn’t apply to the baby - it applies to the mother.

How would that work with say a nightclub? No kids allowed except the ones who are bf?

Wow. Entitled much.