Considering changing DDs school talk me down?

[TheLonelyCup]

DD is 6, year 2, I’d be looking to move her ready for year 3 so September.

But I think I might be UR. This is a mainstream state primary.

In terms of academically, I’m happy. She’s behind in all areas but school have put things in place and she’s making slow and steady progress, she’s suspected to have dyslexia and/or dyspraxia. She has joint hypermobility syndrome and this is particularly bad in her feet and hips, but is also in her wrists, jaw, eyes and fingers. She also has some mild hearing loss on one side – she was treated with grommets which solved most of her hearing problems but not all. The JHS and hearing issues causes her speech to be slightly delayed, so she sounds like a 3 or 4 year old rather than a nearly 7 year old which may also be adding to her issues.

She is generally happy at school, but there seems to be more and more issues socially. I don’t know whether it’s just a covid thing or to do with the hearing loss that she’s missing the intent from her friends but I will list the issues here.

Will add here, DD knows her own mind and can be very stubborn, the issues are not entirely all the schools/classes fault, I know DD is no angel.

1. She struggles to lift most bottles and cups as once they have water in them they’re too heavy, so she either drops them and they smash or she can’t lift them. She also has a habit of chewing the tops if the sports lid is too soft. So I bought her the cup pictured (school insist that bottles are clear so you can see the liquid inside, it can’t have a straw and the child must be able to fill it themselves which rules out most bottles for DD). She’s now refusing to take the bottle to school because some of her classmates say it’s a babies bottle. I let this one slide and just gave her a big drink before school and when she gets home, but it is annoying especially on days when she’s at ASC.

1. She refuses to eat her school dinner. A lot of the other children are on packed lunches. She has packed lunches 2 days a week when I’m not at work, the other days she’s at ASC so has the hot lunch at school but she refuses to eat it. Teacher has discussed this with me and they are working on it with the class as a whole but individually they’re a bit stumped.

1. On the above she will often not eat her packed lunch anyway as I try and make it healthy a typical lunch will be a slice of ham, some cubed cheese (she doesn’t like bread), cucumber sticks, sliced strawberries or sliced apple and a chocolate bar. She’ll often eat just the chocolate bar. According to her her friends lunches are just chocolate and sweets (I don’t actually believe this, I think she’s chatting away which she doesn’t get the chance to do when on hot dinners as she sits in a different place to them) teacher tries to encourage her to eat her lunch but she often refuses

1. She won’t eat fruit unless it’s cut up, so for morning playtime I send in a box with her fruit cut up, but now she refuses to eat it because her classmates say only babies eat cut up fruit. Again teacher is working on this with the class.

1. She will often say a particular child won’t play with her because her (the other child) mum says she’s not allowed to play with DD. I’m fine with this and tell DD to find someone else to play with but it seems to bother her a lot and she gets upset. It also seems the other children she wants to play with play with this girl but DD isn’t included. This has been mentioned by the teacher but I’ve told the teacher not to force the issue as I don’t know exactly why this girl can’t play with DD (it could be that DD has said something mean or upset her and that’s why, which I understand like I said DD is not an angel or perfect)

She’s in the same class as she started in in Reception (2 form entry) as they usually mix the classes at the end of year 1 then again end of year 2 or 3, then again end of 4 but due to covid they’ve kept them the same, they don’t know if they’ll be mixing the classes or keeping them the same for year 3 which also adds to my worry over it as if she’s got another year with these people. Until March of year 1 she spent some time with the other class as they have the same PE and Music lessons plus spent playtimes and lunchtimes together so she had a few friends in that class, now however they don’t spend anytime with them apart from having the same playtimes, but they’re kept apart and play on different playgrounds so no chance to mix, she doesn’t remember the names of anyone in the other class anymore, so I don’t know whether a move to the other class if they don’t mix them might be a good move? Although that causes issues for the class she’s in as it takes numbers under 20 in her class (25 currently in other class).

Teacher says DD is fine in class, behind but there’s no issues with her behaviour bar the usual talking when the teacher is. She’s a late july born. We don’t think it’s bullying and it could be DD taking the comments wrong but I am stuck on how to help her.

I also know we could get the same problems in a new school/class. There are spaces at the 2 other nearest schools to us, but they are a further walk away which is something to consider given DDs diagnosises.

So AIBU and WWYD? Is there anything more school could be doing?

For added context I’m a single parent. Left ExH when DD was a toddler due to his violence and control, he sees DD EOW for 1 night for court ordered contact. He doesn’t mind where she goes to school as long as he knows where she is. DD is an only child, has no cousins and is unlikely to have them.

[TheLonelyCup]

@Exhausted4ever

Forgot the image

Thank you the image did load, these are allowed but DD can't unscrew the lids herself to do it, she uses these at home.

[Calmdown14]

Is there any option to put her back a year? I'm in Scotland so not sure on the rules.
There's a child in my son's class with very similar issues. Her mum fought for her to repeat year two. She is a different child. The previous class was composite with the year above and the girls weren't mean, just at a much more advanced stage socially and it really showed

[TheLonelyCup]

@Calmdown14

Is there any option to put her back a year? I'm in Scotland so not sure on the rules.
There's a child in my son's class with very similar issues. Her mum fought for her to repeat year two. She is a different child. The previous class was composite with the year above and the girls weren't mean, just at a much more advanced stage socially and it really showed

Unfortunately not without an EHCP, we're applying for one but she's unlikely to get it as school are meeting her needs without any extra money, although as she goes through the school this could change.

[user1471530109]

I was going to suggest the sistema bottles. There is a small size she may find easier to pick up.
My dd is a year older and although doesn't have the same condition your dd does, she has had similar issues.

You say she won't eat bread. What about a wrap? My dd will happily eat a wrap and it's easy and quick to eat instead of all the little bits. I would ask dd what the others have apart from all the sweets in their lunch boxes. She's trying to fit in bless her.

The other girl needs dealing with. No matter what the reason, she is adding to your dd's social issues. I would totally be encouraging the school to take this further.

The going to bed early will be short lived. I know you say it's related to her condition, but as she gets older, she will stay up later. Could you have some quick meals up your sleeve for a hot dinner when you get in. Jacket spud, eggs/beans in toast, boiled egg. Basically lots of protein.
I'm a single working mum too. It does get easier as they get older

[LIZS]

Agree it will be same issues elsewhere. School need to make reasonable adjustments which should include assistance with bottle filling, extra time for eating lunch or snacks. Who supplies the fruit normally, could the teacher cut it up for everyone?

You also could encourage resilience as these comments won't just go away. For example, she can say she has the bottle as her weak wrists cannot open others. Factual not emotional. It is probably the picture they are latching onto - can she decorate with stickers or find a plainer version similar instead?

[JeanClaudeVanDammit]

6:45 is very early for bed especially as she doesn’t get to see you all day. Much better if she had a proper dinner and evening with you.

Not if she’s exhausted though, presumably. I read it as she needs to go to bed at that time because she is so tired, not that OP is putting her to bed early to get her out of the way

I’d be inclined to persist a little longer with this school I think. It’s not long that all the children have been back since the last lockdown so some of this could be them all settling back in. Do you feel the school are listening to your concerns?

[SaltAndVinegarSandwiches]

I'm not voting because I don't think you should move schools but don't think you're being unreasonable to be concerned. I would just choose a bottle DD can drink from, regardless of the school's policy and explain why - they shouldn't complain the circumstances, DD needs some simple adjustments made. (The teacher won't have time to fill 30 bottles twice a day but I'm sure they could fill one bottle for a child who is physically unable to).

The social issues probably wouldn't be helped by starting again with unfamiliar children who will have already developed bonds. I would encourage outside friendships, maybe invite one girl to the park after school. I do think you should address with the teacher the comments DD is getting from other kids. Not that the teacher needs to pull up individual children on specific comments but perhaps they could stress the importance of being kind and not making comments about her swimming etc.

I don't know what happened with the girl who won't let DD play but it's not OK for her to exclude DD from group games (if she doesnt want to play with DD then she needs to be the one to leave) so I'd also address that.

[TeenMinusTests]

rucksack.
change of clothes normally at school.
reasonable adjustment for waterbottle - someone else undoes it.

Swimming will help coordination and muscle tone long term, so I would try to stick with that, moving to somewhere further away if necessary to be away from school peers.

DD enjoyed 'wildlife rangers' with our local wildlife trust (for teens) but they also do sessions for younger ones. Non-competitive, outside, interesting, and a bit different. Also doesn't rely on motor skills. I've also heard that 'woodland folk' are very accepting of differences.

Or film making, or chess, or cooking, or anything really that you can find to give her a chance to feel she is succeeding.

[Mydarlingmyhamburger]

Unless she goes to a school specifically for children with special needs, she’s going to have to deal with the same issues whenever she goes. There are plenty of other water bottles she can use that will suit her and adhere to the school rules, I also agree with providing a packed lunch every day as something is better than nothing. The small fruit suggestions as someone mentioned is a good idea. It sounds like the teachers are working with her and doing their best to overcome any obstacles. Unfortunately other children will make comments, your dd is seen as the ‘weird’ kid as she’s a little different to them. The teachers are obviously on the ball with this though, and you say she isn’t being bullied. I think if you keep her in the same school there’s more chance of her classmates getting used to her quirks and accepting her, if you move her she’ll have the same issues but will have to start all over again

[Sirzy]

I assume she is under the care of occupational therapy if her issues give such problems with holding cups etc?

I think it’s hard when a child has additional needs but I would be careful your not jumping out of the frying pan into the fire if you move.

[Embracelife]

Get clear sports bottle with similar top
no need to have baby pattern
Get OT review assessment and strategies
Get advice from hypermobility organisations

[Mummyoflittledragon]

1. I had to look up the Aladdin water bottle. This looks good and small with a handle. If you want it, it’s almost oos. www.lakeland.co.uk/62231/Aladdin-Aveo-Water-Bottle-–-Blue-350ml
   As for filling up the bottle, the teacher needs to make reasonable adjustments. I take it your dd’s disabilities are diagnosed.
   I was going to suggested a small systema bottle and the TA refills it with her.
   
   
2. Stick with packed lunch. Will your dd eat baked crisps / popcorn? She could have this as the carb.
   
   3/4 ) I’ve never heard a child of this age saying cutting up fruit is babyish. Dd insisted on having her grapes halved as another child had theirs that way. Have you tried tangerine segments?
   
   
3. This is bullying and exclusion. Schools hate exclusion and should be cracking down on any form of exclusion. Parents cannot dictate who their child plays with on school property as school is in loco parentis.
   
   Every point you have put is about some kind of issue of your dd being excluded. So this is how you should be tackling it with the school. Teachers will have better wording than me. But basically you want your dd to be included and feel part of the school team. You want the school to make reasonable adjustments. You want the school to put an action plan in place to tackle the bullying and exclusion.
   
   The school should be making targeted classes on inclusion and stamping down on bullying. If the situation is severe, they can also be adding things into newsletters to the parents about inclusion, kindness and so forth. Tall to the senco and the head. Parents can be arseholes.

[DancesWithDaffodils]

I would keep working with the school. If you move you will start very close to the beginning with what adaptations your daughter needs.

Why does the bottle need refilling at school? Does it live at school? (if so get a modification for your daughter to bring it home and refil it) or just give her drink one bottle, and if it's gone it's gone. Drinking something is better than drinking nothing.

I'd send packed lunches every day. Dont worry about he not getting a "decent" meal on the days you work. Do your best to vary the quick dinners away from a typical lunch, and just go with it. Eating something is better than eating nothing. Can you send a carton of juice in her lunch to ensure she drinks at midday?

I still send in chopped apples for my 2, and one is a secondary! I got told off when I stopped. If you can afford it, send fruit that doesn't need chopping, or would be expected to be chopped - berries, melon, pineapple could be one way round it.

I'd think she'd be better in the small class at the current school, with less noise making it easier to hear the teacher than in a class of 29 (assuming a class of 28 with 2 spaces gains just your daughter).

I dont think you will find things massively different at the new school (we've done 3 primaries in 2 different countries), and moving school is disruptive.

[2bazookas]

I woul;d press the school a little harder on class teacher dealing with the other kids. The teacher should be addressing with them, that DD's fingers and wrists are different and that's why she uses a special cup, has cut up fruit etc. Name calling should just not be happening.

The social issues might be no different at another school; perhaps what needs to change is DD learning some targeted responses to "comments", with the help of the school's support services. So that if someone says her cup is babyish, she replies factually " It's special because my joints are extra bendy." " Flexible joints are my superpower".

If you can, cultivate one or two classmates for out of school friendships. There will be lonely oddball kids only too glad to be asked for tea.

[NeverDropYourMoonCup]

I've had various diagnoses since childhood, including hypermobility.

Apart from the obvious deconditioning most kids have experienced through a year of less activity, which is a concern particularly for hypermobility - have they done any blood tests to check for Rheumatoid Arthritis/Psoriatic Arthritis/Juvenile Idiopathic Arthritis? Autoimmune things often come along at the same time. POTS, which makes you dizzy/weak upon exertion is also a common comorbidity. And tiredness, pain and weakness are well known symptoms. They'd need to include Rheumatoid Factor and CRP (C reactive protein, it's a marker for inflammation) along with the ESR that features on a standard bloods screen. She may also be anaemic.


She might benefit from custom insoles to support her feet, which would reduce strain on her legs, if she tends to let her ankles drop inwards and you could potentially use KT tape to stabilise particularly lax joints to encourage her to keep them within the normal range of movement. Physiotherapy involvement could also help stabilise joints and increase her strength/stamina.


She does need to eat better, though. Not eating enough in the evening means she's not fuelling her body enough to recover from the day before or to grow. And if she does have POTS as well, not only does she need to stay well hydrated, it's common to recommend that there's a slight increase in sodium content in her food - something like a few Pretzels help there. Being dehydrated also causes weakness and dizziness. So perhaps you need to find easier ways of increasing the calorific value of her food (milkshakes/smoothies with cream and fruit in the afternoon could be a start - and also make sure that she doesn't actually have the HMS affecting her jaw, as that will make it hurt/hard work to eat. A dietician referral could help there.


She may also need some pain relief. Being in pain makes anybody crabby with the more irritatingly healthy people around you.


I don't think that moving school to somewhere further away would necessarily solve any problems - she'd likely be in the same situation with new kids, just even more tired and in pain. But perhaps you could see what comes from some more referrals and investigations before looking into that further, as it might be sorting some of the issues medically/biomechanically help?



Sorry that's a bit of a brain fart, I'm knackered after work. But the point I'm trying to make is that a lot of her difficulties could be that her physical health isn't being fully catered for at present and dealing with that might help other things resolve organically.

[TheLonelyCup]

@NeverDropYourMoonCup

I've had various diagnoses since childhood, including hypermobility.

Apart from the obvious deconditioning most kids have experienced through a year of less activity, which is a concern particularly for hypermobility - have they done any blood tests to check for Rheumatoid Arthritis/Psoriatic Arthritis/Juvenile Idiopathic Arthritis? Autoimmune things often come along at the same time. POTS, which makes you dizzy/weak upon exertion is also a common comorbidity. And tiredness, pain and weakness are well known symptoms. They'd need to include Rheumatoid Factor and CRP (C reactive protein, it's a marker for inflammation) along with the ESR that features on a standard bloods screen. She may also be anaemic.

She might benefit from custom insoles to support her feet, which would reduce strain on her legs, if she tends to let her ankles drop inwards and you could potentially use KT tape to stabilise particularly lax joints to encourage her to keep them within the normal range of movement. Physiotherapy involvement could also help stabilise joints and increase her strength/stamina.

She does need to eat better, though. Not eating enough in the evening means she's not fuelling her body enough to recover from the day before or to grow. And if she does have POTS as well, not only does she need to stay well hydrated, it's common to recommend that there's a slight increase in sodium content in her food - something like a few Pretzels help there. Being dehydrated also causes weakness and dizziness. So perhaps you need to find easier ways of increasing the calorific value of her food (milkshakes/smoothies with cream and fruit in the afternoon could be a start - and also make sure that she doesn't actually have the HMS affecting her jaw, as that will make it hurt/hard work to eat. A dietician referral could help there.

She may also need some pain relief. Being in pain makes anybody crabby with the more irritatingly healthy people around you.

I don't think that moving school to somewhere further away would necessarily solve any problems - she'd likely be in the same situation with new kids, just even more tired and in pain. But perhaps you could see what comes from some more referrals and investigations before looking into that further, as it might be sorting some of the issues medically/biomechanically help?

Sorry that's a bit of a brain fart, I'm knackered after work. But the point I'm trying to make is that a lot of her difficulties could be that her physical health isn't being fully catered for at present and dealing with that might help other things resolve organically.

She has custom made insoles, they also cause issues with school but that's an adult issue not social and school are trying (its a communication issue rather than an issue with the actual insoles, they keep forgetting to ask someone to check DD has them in the right shoes and her shoes are on the right feet).

[Sirzy]

To help with the right feet thing I have drawn half a smiley face on each of ds insoles so he knows to put them next to each other to make the smile and then they are the right way round

[TheLonelyCup]

Will add, school are happy to help her with refilling etc but DD wants to be like her friends and do it herself, she rarely asks for help. Which both school and I encourage and praise as we obviously want her to be independent.

[TheLonelyCup]

@Sirzy

To help with the right feet thing I have drawn half a smiley face on each of ds insoles so he knows to put them next to each other to make the smile and then they are the right way round

Brilliant idea, never thought of that!

[quizqueen]

You could pre -batch cook some substantial meals like fish pie/spag bol/pasta bake etc. and it wouldn't take more than a few minutes to reheat them in the microwave so she could have a hot meal every day when you get in from the after school club. I wouldn't waste my money on school dinners if she's just leaving them. I also think, if she has delayed speech , she could struggle to make new friends at a different school. Better to stick the devil you know, I think, in this case.

[sunshinesontv]

Why does she need to be able to fill the bottle herself.

Just fill to a weight she can comfortably pick up and when it's empty she either asks the teacher to do it, or doesn't drink any more.

Either way, drinking more than she would be if she didn't take one in at all.

If she will only eat cut up fruit, but doesn't like comments from other kids, can't she take something else? Cubes of cheese, cracker with cheese spread, slice of malt loaf, dried fruit such as apricots or banana slices, raisins?

[Jumpers268]

Can I ask why she can't have a straw bottle? My son is in year 1 and has a green straw bottle (400ml). He very rarely finishes it at school, but if he does the TA refills it for him. Also, we had similar issues re school dinners so I just send him in with a packed lunch of the things I think he will eat and he has dinner shortly after getting in from school (around 4:30pm). Again, he eats very little of it but I don't pack any chocolate as I know that's all he'll eat out of it. I also hate the saying "if they're hungry they'll eat". Some children will not eat. My son has gone for DAYS without eating. He also normally refuses fruit at snack times and if I'm honest I'm not that fussed as he'll eat fruit at home. I completely appreciate how stressful it is .

[sunshinesontv]

It sounds like you've got a good, supportive school who are working hard to meet her needs.

Most of the issues can be easily solved, and the friendship issue can happen anywhere.

I wouldn't move her.

[sunshinesontv]

If she won't ask the teacher to fill her bottle, ask the teacher to do it discreetly without asking her.

[TheLonelyCup]

@sunshinesontv

Why does she need to be able to fill the bottle herself.

Just fill to a weight she can comfortably pick up and when it's empty she either asks the teacher to do it, or doesn't drink any more.

Either way, drinking more than she would be if she didn't take one in at all.

If she will only eat cut up fruit, but doesn't like comments from other kids, can't she take something else? Cubes of cheese, cracker with cheese spread, slice of malt loaf, dried fruit such as apricots or banana slices, raisins?

It's the bottle itself thats the problem, school will fill it up or unscrew lids if she asks, which she doesn't because she likes to do herself but she's currently not drinking anything at school due to comments about the bottle.