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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

What happened here, is it rape?

109 replies

WhatHappened200 · 02/05/2021 06:59

I’ve namechanged for obvious reasons.

I’ve been with partner for 2 years and we have a baby boy. Partner is usually kind and a good dad to son and a good partner etc.

Last night he asked if we could have sex (first time since having ds) and I said yes but it was painful so I told him to stop but he didn’t. I told him to stop again and he did.

Would you call this rape or not as he did eventually stop?

OP posts:

Imreaaaaady · 02/05/2021 09:12

People are being deliberately fucking obtuse with the comment I made about him not being able to hear her. Is he supposed to be a mind reader then, is that it? If she said it quietly, which isn't completely out of the realms of possibility, how would he know to stop?! Then, when she said it again, he did stop. It's a case of playing devil's advocate here with little information, not saying "deaf people can't be rapists" or "well all men will just use that as an excuse." It's a real world scenario in a long-term relationship and it's not completely unrealistic to suggest that the reason he didn't stop the first time is because he didn't hear her. They could've been banging to thrash metal turned up to 11 for all we know.

Inastatus · 02/05/2021 09:12

Lots of people so quick to call him a rapist before even establishing if he heard you the first time! How do you feel? Have you spoken to him? Do you believe he is a rapist? Do you want to end your relationship because of what happened?

Totalbeach · 02/05/2021 09:13

No it’s not. I feel very sorry for him that you’d even come on here and ask that.

worried3012 · 02/05/2021 09:18

It's rape if he heard you ask him to stop but it's not rape if he didn't hear you the first time.

Reinventinganna · 02/05/2021 09:20

You withdrew your consent. We don’t know if he heard you do this.
Talk to him.

Are you okay op?

Twoobles · 02/05/2021 09:20

I wouldn’t say it is unless-

you had been drinking
you asked multiple times before he finally stopped, rather than once
he had coerced you into having sex in the first place

Obviously if he did hear you and continued anyway, that is very borderline and you need to have a firm discussion with him about stopping as soon as asked, respect and boundaries. But if he genuinely didn’t hear you the first time, heard you the second and stopped immediately, I wouldn’t call it rape.

This is my perspective as someone who has had this happen to them in the past.

IEat · 02/05/2021 09:24

You need to clarify with him if he did hear you say No.

PerspicaciousGreen · 02/05/2021 09:27

Does it matter? I don't mean that in a horrible way, but what's the difference to you if it was rape or not? Unless you're planning to press charges, I don't think it's the most important thing here. The important thing is how you feel and how the two of you go forward from this.

He's usually a good partner but you had an upsetting and uncomfortable time having sex. I presume it's never happened before as you haven't mentioned it. You're allowed to feel upset about it whether it was technically rape or not, and you should talk to him about it whether it was technically rape or not. You don't have to have a massive argument about it, but I think it's important that you tell him that you are upset that he didn't stop immediately the first time you asked.

Perhaps he will say, in surprise, that he didn't hear you. Perhaps he will apologise and reassure you that he regrets it. Perhaps he will say that he doesn't know why you're making such a fuss, a man needs sex from his partner, he can't just stop if you're leading him on, etc etc. Perhaps he will suggest that you leave it a little while before trying again and he will be more alert to the fact that it will be different for you than before.

It doesn't have to be rape for you to be unhappy about it, but you really should talk to him about it and see how he responds.

Nith · 02/05/2021 09:29

@3scape

Well he's trashed your sex life for a significant amount of time whether he heard you or not as he was obviously focused entirely on himself if he didn't hear a NO from point blank range. Which is bloody awful however you look at it.

Presumably OP is aware that the circumstances were such that he might not have heard, otherwise she wouldn't have said she wasn't sure about it. The nature of sex is that people don't focus exclusively on their partners.

GreenSlide · 02/05/2021 09:32

I think how I would feel about this would depend on a lot of factors like is it actually plausible that he didn't hear, was he otherwise gentle, is he usually considerate or do you think he got a kick out of continuing when you said no, all sorts of things which only you will know yourself.

CuriousaboutSamphire · 02/05/2021 09:33

Ignoring everything that everyone has said here, we cannot know, talk to him.

That is the only advice it is safe, fair or considerate to you OP. Talk to him.

PaulHollywoodsLowHangingFruit · 02/05/2021 09:46

OP says he eventuallly stopped. I think that needs to be explored.

You have to wonder how he could have been unaware she was in pain and also why she was unable to move away from him.

How are you OP?

JinglingHellsBells · 02/05/2021 09:50

I don't think the word 'eventually' is that significant without a timescale. 2 seconds? 2 minutes? 10 minutes?

PaulHollywoodsLowHangingFruit · 02/05/2021 09:53

Exactly - it needs to be explored- my point. However, it does suggest a delay between consent being withdrawn and his stopping and that is troubling the OP.

manymanymany · 02/05/2021 09:54

CuriousaboutSamphire is right - talk it through with him. This comment is really ratcheting it up: Well he's trashed your sex life for a significant amount of time whether he heard you or not as he was obviously focused entirely on himself if he didn't hear a NO from point blank range. Which is bloody awful however you look at it. Really OP, just talk it through with him. Those posters saying he's a rapist, it was rape are just alarmists. It sounds unpleasant and upsetting but you need to find a way through with him and talking about it is the first step.

Whatwouldscullydo · 02/05/2021 09:55

Oh op

Sex is all about listening and being aware of what you and your partner are doing. I dont see how he couldn't have heard what you said or not realised you weren't enjoying it and in fact was hurting you.

I find this "get out clause" disturbing.

Truth is you will never know and by default can't really trust him.

How are you op.

PaulHollywoodsLowHangingFruit · 02/05/2021 09:55

Also partner is usually kind. Doesn't sound like he was at all kind or sensitive here at the very least and OP needs support.

GNCQ · 02/05/2021 09:55

I wouldn't say rape in this case.

I'm sorry to hear you're going through something quite upsetting. The first "time" after child birth is a very sensitive moment both physically and emotionally do talk to your husband about it. He should hopefully apologize and be more considerate towards you in the future (more than just in the bedroom too).

PaulHollywoodsLowHangingFruit · 02/05/2021 10:03

People on here should stop calling this.

Something really horrible could have happened to the OP and her 'he might not have heard' rhetoric may be her processing shock.

She is obviously disturbed enough by what happened to want to talk it through but may not now owing to those quick to judge.

TaraR2020 · 02/05/2021 10:07

@WhatHappened200 how are you doing op?

The same has happened to me more than once, although in each case the man didn't stop, so I feel that I understand how confused you are at the moment. I'm afraid I don't have answers as I'm still confused about my experiences myself.

I would suggest you take time to examine your relationship with him as a whole for indications and incidents of controlling behaviour on his part.

Ultimately, in a relationship you need to feel safe and free.

With something like this, all the arguments about what constitutes rape and how it does so will be debated, as you can see, which isn't terribly helpful because I imagine they're already going through your head.

I think talking to him is a good idea. Then you go with how you feel about the relationship. If you feel you can move on from it and have a loving and respectful future together then who is anyone else to judge?

Its up to you what happens as a result and you don't have to make any decisions right away.

For me, where it happened in a long term relationship, I didn't forget the incident and although I didn't end the relationship over it , perhaps I should have done?...it was a sign that the relationship wasn't what I believed it to be, what I wanted it to be and years on its stayed with me when other aspects of the relationship have faded into the past. I still recall the dull shock i felt about being so overridden.

(To those who say why you didn't move away etc, I know that in the moment you don't respond the way you think you might)

Only you can decide whether you believe it was an honest mistake or if he didn't hear you at first. Only you can know how it might affect you going forward. How do you feel about it?

If you can rebuild trust then maybe you'll feel you can move past it, maybe not, but its up to you and you can make any choice you want.

If you talk to him, see how he responds,both in conversation and with future intimacy (should you be intimate, you don't have to be of course). Of course if you identify a pattern of controlling behaviour then I advise you to think seriously about your relationship with him.

Give yourself plenty of time to process what happened and get to grips with how you feel about it...I will say though that if this is otherwise a loving and respectful relationship that you want to continue, not talking to him about it will not help.

Feel free to message me if you like

Happycat1212 · 02/05/2021 10:16

Shelovesamystery · 02/05/2021 10:20

Exactly the same thing happened to me with DH once. Before that incident and every time since he has never pushed my boundaries, never forced or coerced me into sex, never done anything at all that I was uncomfortable with during sex and has been nothing but considerate and respectful in the bedroom. I just assumed that he hadn't heard me the first time I said stop. He stopped as soon as he did hear me (a matter of seconds) the second time I said it so it didn't bother me.

So, for me, I am imagining the same situation from what you have described OP but only you can know if it is the same situation, the same sort of behaviour in your DH, the same sort of relationship etc. Like I said it didn't bother me and I didn't give it much thought but as it has upset you then it's worth a conversation with him at the very least. There is a reason that you didn't just assume he hadn't heard you so don't ignore your feelings.

notagainmummy · 02/05/2021 10:40

I would need to know whether he heard you the first time? It's easy to be carried away and literally not hear. Ask him, that will give you the answer. I don't think legally it would be rape, because he stopped.

Why are you asking this question? Are there other incidences that cause you not to trust your partner?

caringcarer · 02/05/2021 10:45

You should have spoken to him at the time, to find out if he heard you say stop the first time.

Whatwouldscullydo · 02/05/2021 10:47

You should have spoken to him at the time, to find out if he heard you say stop the first time

This is just another one if the myths that circulate. Telling women that they reacted wrong or whatever.

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