Email from school about DD

[Thoughtsfortheday]

This isn’t really an AIBU and more of a pondering but seemed the best place to put it.

Had an email from the school yesterday (from tutor teacher) about concern for daughters behaviour, being late to tutor in the morning with no good reasons and also constant breeches of school uniform and being difficult (in front of tutor and head of year) when asked to resolve. (for context grey oversized hoodie with sleeves rolled up on top of blazer, tie not tightened, necklaces on top of shirt etc nothing revolutionary,)

Just to be clear I was absolutely mortified when I received it and was really cross with her last night, and she has had her phone and iPad taken off her and I have cancelled a sleepover she had planned for this weekend.

My slight pondering/AIBU (which I absolutely have not shared with my DD) is I feel it must be quite tricky to be a teenage girl atm, the world is pushing us not to conform anymore, encouraging women to wear and say what they want, to be able to express ourselves without judgement and identify as we please, great, I’m a big believer! School then however is the polar opposite, with rules, no room for fluidity, a one shape fits all approach.

The reason that she’s been late to class this week is due to a heavy flow period and wanting to change her pad at the last moment before going into a double hour class. She said she had explained this to her teacher but they have deemed this unacceptable.

I have spoke to her about good timekeeping and how she has plenty of time to do this and get along to class but a little bit of me (granted the bias DM) thinks give her a break.

Sorry for the rambling, I have a phone meeting with the school this morning and just trying to work out which approach to take.

As someone who could not wear the polyester school shirts owing to a skin condition, I think that the one size fits all is unwise. I was allowed to wear different shirts and socks, but made to feel by some I was letting the side down.
Schools with no uniforms are a rarity in the Uk and so no one agrees to it, they put up with it or truant or home school.
Professionally, I have dealt with many low income families who have found funding bespoke school uniforms puts them into debt or skimping on necessities. It is high time bespoke school uniforms were banned for state schools. Even if there is a second hand shop, there willl not be enough for anyone who needs it
A school dress code with a sew on badge should suffice
I think a lot of it is just rather vulgar conspicuous consumption by heads and a minority of pushy parents

I would let them know that you support them but confirm that she is struggling with heavy periods and request a toilet pass.

We have them in my school. The child simply raises their hand to flash the pass and I nod to confirm i've seen it. They leave and return, no questions asked.

In an ideal world, we wouldn't need such things but in secondary schools, children often just want an excuse to get out if doing the task in hand so you'd end up with dozens of them gathering in the toilets during lessons with no staff on duty.

@Milkshake7489

Incorrect uniform is one thing but she has an absolute right to deal with her period. Not everyone can comfortably wait over two hours to change a pad...

In your position I'd deal with the two issues separately and would be asking the school whether they'd rather she was late to form or went to the toilet half way through her double lesson. These are the only two options which don't involve forcing her to double up on sanitary products (and likely still be uncomfortable) or bleeding through her clothes.

IMO it's essential that girls are taught that their comfort is important even if It's inconvenient to others.

Why does she need to be late. OP saying she needs to change at the last minute but she isn't doing at the last minute, the last minute would see her arriving at her lesson just in time. I wonder how late she gets to the lesson, probably isn't one minute.

Why are people always so disparaging about teenagers here . The tone of so many posts on these boards is one of barely concealed distrust and dislike ,prisoners get a better hearing quite frankly .

I am not blind to teenagers faults , I gave had three myself and I work in a school but most are well intentioned, thoughtful and generous if you give them a chance. Yes they make mistakes , they are impetuous and often need the error of their ways pointing out and they need boundaries. But they are not the heinous, manipulative dishonest monsters so often painted in these threads .

in my experience not enforcing fairly pointless rules and allowing the children some autonomy and having rules with obvious justifications (such as not hurting each other, showing respect to everybody etc) produces independent people who actually enjoy learning and focus on it rather than rebelling against rules that don't make sense to them.

I don't think expecting people to arrive on time is a pointless rule. It is great to be independent but it is also good to respect other people and not waste their time, teachers and other students.

@GlencoraP

Why are people always so disparaging about teenagers here . The tone of so many posts on these boards is one of barely concealed distrust and dislike ,prisoners get a better hearing quite frankly .

I am not blind to teenagers faults , I gave had three myself and I work in a school but most are well intentioned, thoughtful and generous if you give them a chance. Yes they make mistakes , they are impetuous and often need the error of their ways pointing out and they need boundaries. But they are not the heinous, manipulative dishonest monsters so often painted in these threads .

Isn't that what the school are trying to do though, they haven't threatened her or thrown her in a dungeon. They just want her to follow rules, I imagine they have brought it up with her and she isn't co-operating so it has moved on to parents.

Sorry but she needs to learn that some places have rules foe things and toilet breaks, uniforms are all normal in some jobs - she needs to scrub up her attitude, prep for life in general

I wouldn't be really hard in her personally such as stopping sleepovers etc, but I would really make sure she behaved better with regard to rules

Yes the school have and so has the OP , but some of the posters on here can barely disguise their disdain and dislike . Apparently the girl is clearly much more badly behaved than the school have reported, is likely to be lying and will turn into an unemployable teenage delinquent. She’s a teenager, she made a mistake , she is taking her punishment , she is struggling with her periods , some of us have struggled long after being a teenager . It’s just the general attitude on here towards teenagers that I find depressing; the first reaction is always to distrust and control, no wonder we have the unhappiest teens in Europe

And for the record I hid in the loo rather than go to a lesson with a heavy period because I was scared I wouldn’t be let out. I carried an ‘illegal’ jumper with me so that if the worst happened I could tie it around my waist. I lied about this when asked because so panicked. I did not become a delinquent or unemployable or perpetually rude ; I grew up and started to think of better ways to approach my problems just as the teen will.

@GlencoraP

Yes the school have and so has the OP , but some of the posters on here can barely disguise their disdain and dislike . Apparently the girl is clearly much more badly behaved than the school have reported, is likely to be lying and will turn into an unemployable teenage delinquent. She’s a teenager, she made a mistake , she is taking her punishment , she is struggling with her periods , some of us have struggled long after being a teenager . It’s just the general attitude on here towards teenagers that I find depressing; the first reaction is always to distrust and control, no wonder we have the unhappiest teens in Europe

What a reach! The school have reported on her behaviour, posters haven't invented anything. You certainly have, though.

Yabu.

I would push back, sounds like the teacher is being a bit mysognistic. It’s absolutely acceptable to be late because you needed to change a pad on a heavy flow, and even if she didn’t have a last minute gush, who to risk sitting in their own blood for an hour on a heavy flow when you know it could leak at any minute- if they’re that heavy I would want as short a time as possible between one change to the next too. She may have been a bit abrasive when questioned about her reason, but would you not be? It’s not exactly a comfortable thing to talk about as a teenage girl.

It's not acceptable to be repeatedly late because you're changing a pad. As a one off it is just about OK. If the DD knows she needs to change her pad before tutor time, then she needs to get to school 5 mins earlier to do it in. The majority of women working in school cope with periods. I'm a teacher with heavy flow. I plan my day accordingly. It wouldn't be OK for me to arrive late due to changing a pad. Very few UK schools have longer than 2.5 hour stretches without access to a toilet in a break. If your pad needs changing that quickly, then she needs to see the GP. Perhaps wearing a tampon, pad and period pants would help her feel "safer".

Ok, sorry for the late post, busy day yesterday!!

I spoke to DD’s teacher (who was absolutely lovely!!)

First and foremost and big relief to me, no further behaviour/school work issues, DD is doing really well in school and generally quite a compliant and polite child, however though age appropriate they have noticed her bending boundaries (school uniform) slightly and personality is blooming and she can be quite head strong.

(for ref, she is on a LAMDA, art, music, creative perf track and is 80% of her school time encouraged to express herself, teachers words)

Teacher was surprisingly complimentary of her and said she actually really liked having DD in her class and that she reminds her so much of her when she was a teenager.

As I thought DD needing to change pads at last minute was just an excuse, week before it was the new one way system and the week before it was something else so that has absolutely been nipped in the bud and I have told DD I’ll have no qualms about removing her phone for another week if I get wind she has had another late.

I also won’t tolerate rudeness and had a big chat to DD (who is now speaking to me again!!) about respecting elders and even if she doesn’t agree zipping it because unless someone is doing or saying absolutely awful she needs to appreciate that adults have the final word.

Dd said part of the issue and disagreements with the teachers has been because it’s so cold in the class room, windows all open for COVID so I’ve bought her some teen approved black jumpers and a new school skirt as she has really hated the one she has for a while.

Phones and iPad have stayed removed and will for the week but I have relented on camp over, as it’s the 1st one she has been to in a year and it’s for a friends birthday.

Sounds like all went well and so glad that you and DD are keeping the lines of communication open and finding a way forward together.

Glad you seem to have got the full picture and moved forward!

It's worth bearing in mind that girls tend to use the 'I was changing my tampon, OK?!' defence/response largely with male teachers because they think it will embarrass them into never questioning her ever again.

The girls who do that (use periods as a weapon, not the genuinely suffering ones) never need to change them during their breaks or during lessons they like/have done homework for. And they always seem to last three times as long for the journey home including a trip to the sweet shop before walking/catching the bus.

Plus, some use the same 'it's just started a minute ago and I never knew it was coming' multiple times over the month (it started out of the blue Monday, then Tuesday afternoon, then it's still a complete surprise on Wednesday lesson 1?)

Glad it’s sorted.

Your daughter can wear what she likes outside school, inside school she needs to comply with the rules / standards.
I was probably similiar at school, tried to assert my individuality through little uniform breaches. Rebel without a cause. Only person it caused trouble for was me. Pointlessly. Probably a headache for my parents too and the teachers. I probably mistakenly thought it made me look tough.

It's rude to the staff / fellow students to be late. There is time before & inbetween lessons to go to the toilet and changing a pad doesn't take long.

Encourage her to be considerate of others and that means following the rules at school. You & she can set your own standards outside that. Give her a big hug too, as teenage years, hormones and stress are hard.

She's your daughter & you love her but if it was a colleague that you were managing who wasn't looking presentable / was turning up late - would you be sympathetic?

Sorry OP just read your update. Am glad it's been resolved / nipped in bud. Hope she enjoys getting the positive praise & continues to do well.

If she is having issues with heavy periods though (I know it was just an excuse here) then she could try a moon cup and pad as well. I'd be most upset about the lying to cover her track tbh.

I would side with the school.
I remember when Sil was still in school and mil would complain to me about how unfortunate poor sil was having to follow the rules. Similar things - she was late for class and wore her skirt too high, catty and disruptive. I just remember clearly thinking 'you are not doing your daughter any favours.' and she didn't. Her siding against the school gave sil ammunition to disregard the teachers and guess who left school with no qualifications?